Shooting and drinking a couple

mark knapp

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4mer, you work? Thought sure you would have retired wealthy after all your years as a guide!! The comment about CCW and having a drink in the restaurant caught my attention. I suspect there are plenty of folks who carry and have had a drink or 2......or more. Just as there are plenty of drivers out there with a few under there belt. Most of us use public ranges here in Alaska. Next time your at one look at the other folks on the line. Likely a few have had a drink. I never thought of that before this thread.
I believe if you are pulled over and get breath check and fail..........and you also possess a firearm...........you get a DUI charge AND a misconduct involving weapons charge. I also hear that Wildlife officers ask about drinking/alcohol when stopping by hunting camps. The legal parameters/problems around alcohol, driving, and firearms are too serious for me to risk in most cases.

Guides don't make no money. Ask me how I know. It's like being a starving artist. We do it because we like to do it. And, most of us are pretty good at it.
 

4merguide

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Guides don't make no money. Ask me how I know. It's like being a starving artist. We do it because we like to do it. And, most of us are pretty good at it.

Yeah, not enough months in the year to make a living at it. Especially if you guided for other guides/outfitters like I did. Loved it when I did though, and like you said, I was pretty good at it.
 

mark knapp

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Yeah, not enough months in the year to make a living at it. Especially if you guided for other guides/outfitters like I did. Loved it when I did though, and like you said, I was pretty good at it.

Yep, we do it for lots of other reasons than money.
 

mark knapp

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Right or wrong, I lump the guys that drink and shoot with the guys that drink and drive, shoot glass in the woods and shoot holes in road signs and the furniture and roof at the shooting range. Why do people do that?

We don't shoot with lots of others at the range, people have gotten shot that way. We don't ride or shoot with people that have been drinking, people die that way too. Do what you want, but don't try to tell me is right or customary. And please, be careful, warn us too.
 
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It truely is all about social norms. I lived in Germany for over 20 years. In that time I was a member of many clubs. Fishing club, Hunting Club, Shooting Club, Dog Club. They all had their facilities / club house. All of them had a bar in the club house. After a club session, the stories, friendship and wurst & bier flowed. The issue at heart is the social norm. A club rule violation got you kicked and banned and most likely black listed form other clubs. There is zero tollerance for safety violations. Seeing the number of road signs shot to hell, I think it would be prudent to keep alcohol sans firearms.
 
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MarineHawk

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Just read this thread. I’m kind of surprised by some of the absolutism here. If we’re talking about one beer, many lighter ones are around 4% alcohol. That’s less than 1/2 ounce of alcohol or about one ounce of 90-proof booze. Especially with food, that’s just not enough to have ANY appreciable negative impact on a typical adult male’s reflexes or judgment.

Most states allow you legally to drive with a 0.08% blood-alcohol level, and there is a reason for that. A typical adult male gains around 0.02% of blood-alcohol-level per drink and metabolizes around one drink per hour (women process far less, even per unit of body weight). So, you can drink up to one beer every hour and not go above 0.02%, even more, if you’re engaged in significant physical activity. You would have to drink five drinks in a short period of time to get over 0.08%.

Drinking one beer (especially with food, as in the OP), would have such a negligible, if any, impact on reflexes or judgment, that I think it’s irrelevant to whether or not one should handle a firearm after doing so.

Being drunk and handling a firearm is a bad idea, but that’s not what the OP is talking about.

There are a lot more impactful considerations, by comparison, that seem to be overlooked. For example, when hunting, do you get up at 5 a.m. or whatever after having a less-than ideal night of sleep to get in the field position before the game starts feeding? I do it, and I think it’s perfectly safe the way I do it. That doesn’t affect my reflexes or judgment enough to make it dangerous IMO. But it would have a much larger negative impact than having a single beer at lunch after a great night's sleep. If you think that drinking a single beer midday with food is dangerous, you definitely should make sure you get ten hours of sleep before heading into the field on opening day.

BTW, what happened to this site? It used to be a hotbed of often interesting and educational commentary. Now, the shooting forum has only two threads with any activity in 2-1/2 months, and one of them is about whether or not one safely could handle a firearm after having a single beer at lunch. I miss the old days on here.
 

PRDATR

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Just read this thread. I’m kind of surprised by some of the absolutism here. If we’re talking about one beer, many lighter ones are around 4% alcohol. That’s less than 1/2 ounce of alcohol or about one ounce of 90-proof booze. Especially with food, that’s just not enough to have ANY appreciable negative impact on a typical adult male’s reflexes or judgment.

Most states allow you legally to drive with a 0.08% blood-alcohol level, and there is a reason for that. A typical adult male gains around 0.02% of blood-alcohol-level per drink and metabolizes around one drink per hour (women process far less, even per unit of body weight). So, you can drink up to one beer every hour and not go above 0.02%, even more, if you’re engaged in significant physical activity. You would have to drink five drinks in a short period of time to get over 0.08%.

Drinking one beer (especially with food, as in the OP), would have such a negligible, if any, impact on reflexes or judgment, that I think it’s irrelevant to whether or not one should handle a firearm after doing so.

Being drunk and handling a firearm is a bad idea, but that’s not what the OP is talking about.

There are a lot more impactful considerations, by comparison, that seem to be overlooked. For example, when hunting, do you get up at 5 a.m. or whatever after having a less-than ideal night of sleep to get in the field position before the game starts feeding? I do it, and I think it’s perfectly safe the way I do it. That doesn’t affect my reflexes or judgment enough to make it dangerous IMO. But it would have a much larger negative impact than having a single beer at lunch after a great night's sleep. If you think that drinking a single beer midday with food is dangerous, you definitely should make sure you get ten hours of sleep before heading into the field on opening day.

BTW, what happened to this site? It used to be a hotbed of often interesting and educational commentary. Now, the shooting forum has only two threads with any activity in 2-1/2 months, and one of them is about whether or not one safely could handle a firearm after having a single beer at lunch. I miss the old days on here.

After the software upgrade a couple or three years ago some people left before the quirks got ironed out.
 

harrisjr

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Times change, I don't think it's fair to other people to be drunk at the range. After all, back in 60s doctors were allowed to smoke near the patients in hospital, just 'cause it happened doesn't mean it was a right thing to do in a hinsight.
The only time I've attended "drunk" shooting was back in early 00's when I was on a trip to eastern Europe. Had a chance to shoot like 3 bricks of 7.62x39 ammo with 5 completely smashed russians. I'm not talking 4-5 beers, I'm talking dead drunk. Looking back at this, I could've been dead back then if I got unlucky
 
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kasilofchrisn

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Just read this thread. I’m kind of surprised by some of the absolutism here. If we’re talking about one beer, many lighter ones are around 4% alcohol. That’s less than 1/2 ounce of alcohol or about one ounce of 90-proof booze. Especially with food, that’s just not enough to have ANY appreciable negative impact on a typical adult male’s reflexes or judgment.

Most states allow you legally to drive with a 0.08% blood-alcohol level, and there is a reason for that. A typical adult male gains around 0.02% of blood-alcohol-level per drink and metabolizes around one drink per hour (women process far less, even per unit of body weight). So, you can drink up to one beer every hour and not go above 0.02%, even more, if you’re engaged in significant physical activity. You would have to drink five drinks in a short period of time to get over 0.08%.

Drinking one beer (especially with food, as in the OP), would have such a negligible, if any, impact on reflexes or judgment, that I think it’s irrelevant to whether or not one should handle a firearm after doing so.

Being drunk and handling a firearm is a bad idea, but that’s not what the OP is talking about.

There are a lot more impactful considerations, by comparison, that seem to be overlooked. For example, when hunting, do you get up at 5 a.m. or whatever after having a less-than ideal night of sleep to get in the field position before the game starts feeding? I do it, and I think it’s perfectly safe the way I do it. That doesn’t affect my reflexes or judgment enough to make it dangerous IMO. But it would have a much larger negative impact than having a single beer at lunch after a great night's sleep. If you think that drinking a single beer midday with food is dangerous, you definitely should make sure you get ten hours of sleep before heading into the field on opening day.

BTW, what happened to this site? It used to be a hotbed of often interesting and educational commentary. Now, the shooting forum has only two threads with any activity in 2-1/2 months, and one of them is about whether or not one safely could handle a firearm after having a single beer at lunch. I miss the old days on here.
How far away from someone can you be and still tell their blood alcohol level?
Just because you only saw them drink one beer doesn't mean that's the only alcohol they consumed.
Was there bailey's in their morning coffee?
Jack in their coke?
A can cover so any excess beers looked like a coke from a distance?
I've worked with several alcoholics and even had a few in my boats.
Some people are pretty good at hiding it.
And no I don't trust every one of the 750+ members at my local range around alcohol.
If you have your own private range and have very trustworthy friends that's one thing.(though don't bother inviting me!)
But at a range where you don't know everyone?
No thanks!

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Chez

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Hmmm, I've had my post removed when all I did was recommend the op seek help for his condition????
 

MarineHawk

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How far away from someone can you be and still tell their blood alcohol level?
Just because you only saw them drink one beer doesn't mean that's the only alcohol they consumed.
Was there bailey's in their morning coffee?
Jack in their coke?
A can cover so any excess beers looked like a coke from a distance?
I've worked with several alcoholics and even had a few in my boats.
Some people are pretty good at hiding it.
And no I don't trust every one of the 750+ members at my local range around alcohol.
If you have your own private range and have very trustworthy friends that's one thing.(though don't bother inviting me!)
But at a range where you don't know everyone?
No thanks!

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This kind of proves my point. If someone openly drinks a single beer, they typically aren’t hiding anything.

If they are, they are no different from the person who isn’t openly drinking a beer but sneaking alcohol or much worse mind-altering chemicals you can’t see. If someone has “bailey's in their morning coffee” or “Jack in their coke,” they’re hiding something. Not the guy who openly has one beer.

I’d rather shoot with the guy who had one beer.
 

WinterHawk

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Interesting thread. I have had neighbors come over to the house with a 6 pack, to help me get the truck started and my reaction was, "why?" At 35 below I don't really want to be drinking a beer but alcohol seems to be so ingrained in people that they have to have it around all the time. Same with guns & alcohol, whether beer or Everclear. If nothing else, drinking and shooting sends a bad signal to other folks that it's okay, and they might NOT stop at one beer to "calm their nerves."
 

kasilofchrisn

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This kind of proves my point. If someone openly drinks a single beer, they typically aren’t hiding anything.

If they are, they are no different from the person who isn’t openly drinking a beer but sneaking alcohol or much worse mind-altering chemicals you can’t see. If someone has “bailey's in their morning coffee” or “Jack in their coke,” they’re hiding something. Not the guy who openly has one beer.

I’d rather shoot with the guy who had one beer.
I'd rather shoot with the guy that had zero beers!
But just because the guys openly drinking one beer doesn't mean that is the only alcohol he has consumed that day.
I have seen where a coworker in my own boat was openly drinking one beer and then later on I also saw them taking sips from the bottle in their pocket!
So yeah the guy who's openly drinking just One beer can be hiding things just as much as anyone else. And for the record the three other people in my boat, besides myself, got totally plastered became very annoying and obnoxious drunks and were not invited back!
Sometimes one has to wonder too when a guy stretches one beer out to an hour or even more.
Is he still on the same beer or did he crack a fresh one when I wasn't looking?
Without breathalyzing everyone at the
shooting range before they step up to the firing line there is no safe way to know how much alcohol they have consumed! That is an undeniable fact!
You've obviously been around alcohol a lot more than I have and you are more trustworthy of people drinking alcohol than I am.
But around me it's either zero beers or zero guns!
 

orangejuicy

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Interesting thread. I have had neighbors come over to the house with a 6 pack, to help me get the truck started and my reaction was, "why?" At 35 below I don't really want to be drinking a beer but alcohol seems to be so ingrained in people that they have to have it around all the time. Same with guns & alcohol, whether beer or Everclear. If nothing else, drinking and shooting sends a bad signal to other folks that it's okay, and they might NOT stop at one beer to "calm their nerves."
The first time something goes really bad for someone who didn’t know they had a problem with alcohol is usually the first time at which we can look back at that “any time is a good time for a beer” event, and with great certainty conclude that Yes, there was a problem. Until then, it’s just a “might be a problem”. Thing is, the transition between the two is unpredictable. Having lived like that myself, anyone who chose to stay away from me and guns was making the right choice. I’m grateful I don’t have to live like that anymore. I have compassion for those that do, and I also have zero tolerance to be around them and guns.
 

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