General Discussion Forum Closed Temporarily

[Webmaster]

I have closed the General Discussion forum because it has become it has become a magnet for negativity and disagreeable conversation. I don’t mind community members bantering about where to buy good pizza, or the war in Iraq, or good beer. I do not like how that forum has been attracting people who seem to only want to be disagreeable. I particularly do not like guests from other countries who want to run down America, Americans and Alaskans. Guests from other countries and other parts of America are most welcome here – but not to spout hatred.

The general discussion forum will reopen, but it will not function in the same way. Stay tuned.

In the meantime, forum discussion must be topic focused. This basically means general discussion is not permitted until that forum reopens.

You are welcome to comment on this decision in this thread only.

David

 

[Huntress]

Ahhhhhhhhhh a breath of fresh air

Thank you David, I wouldnt want your job.

 

[AlaskaHippie]

Bound to happen

Bound to happen

Sorry to see it come to this David, but I can't say I disagree with the decision.

Hopefully the resurrected version will have rules and features that can make it what it was intended to be, and what it once was...

Thanks for continuing to do whats in the best interest of this community as a whole.


Regards,

Mike

 

[fullkurl]

good call...

good call...

The wonderful thing about this great forum is the diversity of folks here, yet we all share the common bond of things afield--ideally Alaskan.
Some on the discussion forum have had no commonality in this respect. This move was needed big time.
We look forward to what's up next David; you'll make it work.

Frank

 

[Webmaster]

Please keep discussion on topic

Please keep discussion on topic

Kindly keep any comments restricted to the topic of this thread. I have deleted three posts already that were "general discussion."

Thanks...David

 

[TheRedBaroness]

Hopefully the new rules will prohibit mention of nude bars and cleavage.

It reflects very badly on our state.

 

[Huntress]

I would think that the rules would reflect what we ALL should be following and not just your couple of suggestions. Mind you, MOST of us here are adults, I think the very few comments about cleavage or whatnot can be handled with a grain of salt. Its no worse then the whole thread about the "rack"....
Mind you, you are on a 95% mens forum, thats like walking into a fire dept and telling them they cant talk about women....Yea, Ok

 

[8x57 Mauser]

I don't want to hijack this thread from rehashing old debates in the Gen.Disc. Forum, but I have a suggestion:

OK, it's my wife's suggestion.

When it's her turn on the computer, she participates in a forum that has an equivalent to the Gen.Disc. Forum. She tells me that to post on that one you have to have been a member for >6 months and have >50 posts. Or was it 100? I don't rememer, but you get the point.

She's a webhead, too, David. So she told me to tell you that it's also a VBulletin site. I assume that's a software thing...

 

[JDE]

Might I ask where the more extreme non-US comments were coming from? I've mentioned that at least one style of writing was very familiar to me.

I'm also fairly new here but might I add that Mauser's suggestion does have merit.

Finally, at the risk of being blanked ,please all, drop the animosity over the cleavage thing. I in fact (as a gone to seed weightlifter) still have excellent cleavage, when I do a pectoral pose. I think my wife even becomes a tad jealouse hehe night all.

 

[Webmaster]

I don't want to hijack this thread from rehashing old debates in the Gen.Disc. Forum, but I have a suggestion:

OK, it's my wife's suggestion.

When it's her turn on the computer, she participates in a forum that has an equivalent to the Gen.Disc. Forum. She tells me that to post on that one you have to have been a member for >6 months and have >50 posts. Or was it 100? I don't rememer, but you get the point.

She's a webhead, too, David. So she told me to tell you that it's also a VBulletin site. I assume that's a software thing...

We're considering that option, actually. It would keep the discussion more within the community. This is primarily an Alaska outdoors website. The general discussion forum was really only for members of the community. We've got some other ideas on the table, too.

Might I ask where the more extreme non-US comments were coming from? I've mentioned that at least one style of writing was very familiar to me.

Two that I especially noted: B.C. and London.

BTW, I have deleted more posts in this thread that were off topic.

David

 

[Huntress]

Just a note, my comment wasnt off topic. I was serious what I had said and the things mentioned have no bearing on this forum. Coming from a female point of veiw, Guess Im not easly offended when it comes to men


Hope it all works out for the best, I enjoyed the general chat, at least up until this last week

Thanks David

 

[AKDSLDOG]

At a loss....

At a loss....

Not sure about the negativity thing? Haven't seen any bad comments about our state or our country? And secondly, isn't the "general discussion" section about everything else non hunting or fishing related? This section should be taken with a grain of salt. Sorry if I am missing your point, but I would have to disagree with the closer.

Curt

 

[AlaskaHippie]

The diversity that IS Alaska

The diversity that IS Alaska

We're considering that option, actually. It would keep the discussion more within the community. This is primarily an Alaska outdoors website. The general discussion forum was really only for members of the community. We've got some other ideas on the table, too.
David

David, glad to hear that the focus of the revised thread is an emphasis on preserving the sense of community amongst this rather eclictic mix of folks that have made the ODD such a great resource for almost every facet of Alaskan Life....

I for one have at times been more than a bit vocal about what I perceived as "Heavy Handed" censorship by moderators (and that owner guy), however in light of recent events I will have to admit I may have been a little too judgemental (mark the calendar!). Though I stand by some of my arguments in regards to censure, I now have a greater appreciation as to why the rules here are more strictly, and swiftly, enforced as opposed to many other forums. I am a member on other outdoor forums and they are far more extreme in both directions than this site, not to name names, but some sites have almost NO moderation and the feces is thrown around in there like diaherritic chimps on a meth binge, while other sites are so heavily moderated that any view not adhering to the site owners personal politics and religious beliefs are verbotten, and often times the offending poster is banned for simply speaking in favor of a topic not aligned with said philosophies. This site seems to have a achieved a respectable middle ground, and it's value in that regard is worth preserving, by whatever means you and others deem appropriate.

That said I think some recent feigned (or real) indignation over comments I and others (okay, just me <grin>)have made in regard to the "C" word and gentlemans clubs needs to be seen in the intended context. This is Alaska (as we all so proudly boast, and rightfully so), the Last Frontier. We are only a generation or two removed from the Sourdoughs and Native elders that made this state what it is today. Among those people where Miners,Loggers,
Fisherman,Missionaries,
Chiefs,Scouts,Soldiers,
Trappers,Engineers,Wildcatters,
Women of Ill Repute,Gamblers,
Gun Fighters, Sailors, Authors,
Poets, and a host of others from all walks of life and nationalities who for a wide variety of reasons flocked North and laid a foundation upon which we still build today. This site is, in my opinion, a microcosm of that spirit and persona that embodies all those who came before us. If we assume some sort of holier than thou stance here, we do a disservice not only to our past, but to those who come here, via this electronic box, to get a taste of Alaska in the only way many of them ever will experience.
This community is as diverse as all of the abovementioned people I spoke of, and as such, there is bound to be disagreement, debate, animosity, and in some instances, hurt feelings. We have people of all ages, walks of life, backgrounds and beliefs, for the most part we have all "gotten along" very well. We recognize our differences, in most cases accept them, agree to disagree, and most importantly, we learn and grow both individually and as a group through these interactions. It's that very same coexistence that makes this the best, most unique, and individualistic region on the continent I feel.

Lately there has been an influx of new members, many have fit right in and been as accepting of all of us whacko's as we have been of each other. There has been a rather vocal minority however that have for whatever reason, decided to cause conflict in a host of different ways, and this has culminated in the much deserving closure of the only venue here in which "Non-Outdoor" topics can be discussed. It quite effectively kneecapped those that would delight in nothing more than turning friends and acquaintances into bickering cabin fever posterchildren, I am as guilty of this malady as anyone.

But to attempt to deride myself and others as being "UN Alaskan" or a "Bad Example of what Alaska is" is both presumptious and completely against the acceptance and tolerance of what Alaska IS about. Tourism companies market Alaska on their webpages with references of Creek St. in Ketchikan, and offer tours of the old brothels there. Joe McGinnis wrote fondly of the old strip on 4th avenue during the pipeline boom, and sold millions of copies of "Going To Extremes" with blatant references to the blocks of strip clubs that lined the street. Sydney Laurence had a much publicized affair with, and painted more than a few nudes of Nellie Brown, his mistress, and a "Fallen Woman", back in Anchorage's infancy. I could go on and on with references to this states colorful past and cast of characters that make it unique (Soapy Smith, Wyatt Earp, Pillow, Mr. Whitekeys, Capt. Healy, etc etc). Are these "Less than perfect" people and off color situations and scenarios indicative of ALL Alaska and it's people? Of course not. But it IS a part of our past, present, and most likely (HOPEfully!), future. We are a community, both on this site and in this state, of INDIVIDUALS, and as such we are going to make comments that enlighten, offend, and entertain. I am proud to count among my closest friends a State Judge, A former small town mayor, a cabin dwelling hippie (no relation) who's living the "Talkeetna Dream" (draw your own conclusions), A retired Base commander, and on and on. It's healthy to live and enjoy life amongst a wide range of people, otherwise you stagnate, and in some cases grow bitter towards those who are able to enjoy life for what it is, a game no one comes out of alive.

I hope this clears the air a bit, and hopefully has allowed me to explain where some of us here are coming from. I hope that it may help to resolve the issues that have been so divisive here as of late....If not, well...Guess I could try and see how many 4 letter words I can string into one sentence.

Sorry for the VERRRRY LONG post, I hope it did not stray from the parameters of the thread, if so...heheheheh...censor it..<grin>

 

[Maineguide]

Sorry to hear it.

Sorry to hear it.

Next to the Fishing and Hunting forums this was my next favorite forum. In planning our move to Alaska next year it has been very helpful in the planning stages. I think Mauser has a very good idea for new members. (6 Months/50-100 posts) or something of that nature for entry into the Gen. Discussion. Perhaps it can be just for general Alaska information and keep the world events out of the picture. I am sure there are plenty of political sites that you can go to argue over the war and politics. Personally I think those subjects always bring controversy anyway. You know what they say you never want to talk about politics or religion at dinner, maybe the same could be said here? Hope the forum isn't gone for too long.

 

[AlleninAlaska]

You guys have been Bad. Time for a Time Out.

 

[Marcus]

An overflowing tank. . .

An overflowing tank. . .

. . .the General Discussion forum . . . has become a magnet for negativity and disagreeable conversation.

It seems to me that the intended context for any General Discussion forum should be that we each are in mixed company, in a room full of strangers, and govern our conversation accordingly. David is correct, the General Discussion forum had become something of a septic tank.

Time to pump it out. . .

 

[BrownBear]

Thank you! It reached the point that I hated to even open the thread index.

For me the pivotal point in all this is community, a term used frequently in this thread. There were things going on here that I wouldn't endure in my own neighborhood and circle of friends, so why would I consider enduring them in an online "community?"

Lots of outdoor-related sites are experiencing the same kind of negativity, and in fact some of it looks pretty familiar from one to the next. Without strong moderation and an intent for community, the sites deteriorate badly. I would hope that could be prevented on Alaska's own outdoor site. This is an important step, and if folks whine about it, they can depart post-haste for sites where it is welcome and a standard. Good ridance to them!

Your efforts are deeply appreciated.

 

[ak257]

I guess it doesn't really matter to me one way or the other. If I started to read something that I felt I wasn't going to like I just stopped and moved on to something else. No one is forced to read anything here.

 

[Marcus]

Adult conversation. . .

Adult conversation. . .

I rather disagree with the post above because the operative word here is "community." What's done in community, stays in the community, affecting the whole community for better or for worse over the long run.

As a pretty smart fellow once told another community long ago, "But if you bite and devour one another, beware lest you be consumed by one another."

Nor should subjects such as religion and politics furnish an excuse for anything less than polite, reasoned discussion. We all know how to push buttons, so there is no excuse whatsoever for liberal bashing, conservative bashing, George Bush bashing, Christian bashing, or any other kind of bashing depending on where one is religiously or politically.

We are adults and capable of expressing ourselves rationally, keeping our discussion in the realm of ideas. There is no excuse for anything less.

I think that the second a post becomes anything less than the above it should be deleted or returned to the sender for restatement in polite and reasoned form. That's a judgment call — heaven help the moderators.

 

[Blueberry]

I agree with you, Marcus, though I was enjoying our discussion concerning farmed and wild salmo and hope that we can continue it at some future point.

Although the presence of jolly old gals of a certain type once flocked here during the various gold rushes, that's no real reason to make gratuitous posts containing inneundos simply because the author of the post is a female. It may or may not be marginally acceptable in an appropriate thread but to turn a thread into smarmy innuendo simply because it was posted by a female is the hallmark of an ill mannered bore.

If you don't want other people from Alaska to join in, why don't you just say so? I've done nothing wrong here but express a couple of opinions that apparently are shared by quite a few others yet I've been treated very rudely by two of the members simply for posting. Why should I have to justify my presense on a public message board and have peope snipe at me just because I post? Is it because I didn't join the nine other people who posted intros as was mentioned?

One of the things you'd be well advised to curb here is the propensity of certain members to tell others to leave. Or is that an age honoured tradition in alaska too?