4merguide
Well-known member
Me too. It looked like #6 shot as I skinned the face, and on both front paws.
Are Sea Lions Dangerous to Be Around?
- Thread starter Autistic_Deer_Hunter
- Start date
Mark,
Read this whole thread tonight, and while I respect your opinion and experience with the relationship of human- bear interactions,my experiences of 40 years of alaska bear hunt guiding in s.e alaska, kodiak and the ak. Peninsula differ from yours.
First and foremost, I have experienced many cabin and camp breakins in areas that were hunted rather heavily. Also many encounters in which the bear showed no fear of man in these same areas.
And there have been other times, in areas where I am sure that the bears have had little and in some no contact with man , in which they merely came across the track of a man and scedaddled. Whether the smell is repulsive or just strange,I do not know. Apologies to the original poster because this has nothing to do with sea lions.
Read this whole thread tonight, and while I respect your opinion and experience with the relationship of human- bear interactions,my experiences of 40 years of alaska bear hunt guiding in s.e alaska, kodiak and the ak. Peninsula differ from yours.
First and foremost, I have experienced many cabin and camp breakins in areas that were hunted rather heavily. Also many encounters in which the bear showed no fear of man in these same areas.
And there have been other times, in areas where I am sure that the bears have had little and in some no contact with man , in which they merely came across the track of a man and scedaddled. Whether the smell is repulsive or just strange,I do not know. Apologies to the original poster because this has nothing to do with sea lions.
kenaibow fan
Well-known member
Well what you say makes sense, and I can see reading back on my post, I was a little short sided by not taking into account that animals have probably more encounters with people doing things other then hunting. Hunters just came to mind because we are actively stalking or hunting animals. Which I would think would put the most fear into animals having a negative encounter. Very interesting perspectives in this thread.
mark knapp
Well-known member
Generally, I have found that cabin break-ins do not detract from or alter what I have said because those are done when humans are not there. They have learned not to attempt a cabin break-in while humans are there, and they have learned how to tell whether or not humans are there. We have the same thing here and I am afraid I did not speak clearly enough to make that clearer.
Also, I am trying to describe the differences of game in Parks where they cannot be hunted and game in open land where they frequently encounter man and have bad experiences. I'm sure you know that bears can easily move 30 miles a day and if we find game or bear activity in one place, where we think they are seldom hunted it realy doesn't mean that animal has not had encounters with man bad or good.
Our parks, on the other hand are some of the biggest in the world and an animal can spend it's whole life in the park without a bad encounter with man. The, we wonder why they were so tame or easy to kill just outside the park.
I don't think your experiences differ from mine a bit but I may see them differently. Kodiak and the Peninsula are great places to be. I've hunted both extensively (29 10/16 inch bear and a 74 inch moose were some of the highlights). I can't speak much about SE because while I have hunted and fished there a lot (It is a great place though), I haven't made any of my living there.
All my best to you.
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mark knapp
Well-known member
I was caught off guard too and only answered your question as it pertains to hunting instead of the whole year when, in fact we only hunt a fraction of the year but game animals have all year to learn about humans.
Best of luck to you, Mark
My experiences with bears have occurred over a 50 year span, both in areas that are heavily hunted, and in areas where hunting is not allowed. In addition, I was former NPS ranger when I was young. All of my experiences in remote areas where hunting is not allowed is that bears in those areas are very skittish of man and I have never had a harrowing encounter in those areas. They avoided my presence. My experiences in hunted areas is vastly different, in that those bears are habituated to man's existence, and I have had several harrowing encounters in hunted areas. So, I'm not a big believer in the notion that we have to hunt them to scare them of humans. My experiences are just the opposite.
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mark knapp
Well-known member
It took me too long to compile this answer and this one is more what I wanted to say. The other one ran over the 60 minute limit to edit so I couldn't edit it. This one is not a complete copy of the other and I think better written.
Generally, I have found that cabin break-ins do not detract from or alter what I have said because those are done when humans are not there. They have learned not to attempt a cabin break-in while humans are there (that usually leads to a bad encounter), and they have learned how to tell whether or not humans are there. We have the same thing here and I am afraid I did not speak clearly enough to make that clearer. It's humans, not the stuff humans leave. Cabins without people are usually a positive thing for them, cabins with people are usually bad news for them.
Also, I am trying to describe the differences of game in Parks where they cannot be hunted or even treated negatively and game in open land where they frequently encounter man and have bad experiences. I'm sure you know that bears can easily move 30 miles a day and if we find game or bear activity in one place, where we think they are seldom hunted it really doesn't mean that animal has not had encounters with man, bad or good. You know there're villages everywhere, especially in the coastal areas you described. The people in those villages hunt a lot, they don't hunt bears a lot but they do hunt moose, caribou and deer as well as do a lot of other traveling. While doing all that traveling they encounters bears and everything else. I've been with them on several occasions while they do those things and I have learned that, pretty much everything gets shot at, (at least by the people I was with) These incidences were not planned by me but for one reason or another (Like weather, float planes etc.) we ended up traveling with other people, in boats or overland, when all we wanted to do was get back to the airstrip for the flight home.
Our parks, on the other hand are some of the biggest in the world and an animal can spend it's whole life in the park without a bad encounter with man. Then, we wonder why they were so tame or easy to kill just outside the park.
I don't think your experiences differ from mine a bit but I may see and read them differently. Kodiak and the Peninsula are great places to be. I've hunted both extensively (29 10/16 inch bear and a 74 inch moose were some of the highlights). I can't speak much about SE because while I have hunted and fished there a lot (It is a great place too), I haven't made any of my living there.
All my best to you.
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mark knapp
Well-known member
Well, I have spoken to wildlife management professionals and big game guides as well as resident sportsmen. One of the guys I talked to does statistics for F&G so he gets a chance to talk to lots of biologists. For me and the people I have talked to, there is no doubt that there is a conditioning of both animals that have no negative experiences with humans, (like what mostly happens in parks), and those in open range where experiences are most likely all negative. They started giving me all the examples that I have posted here. Brooks camp, McNeil, Denali National Park etc.
There are, of course, exceptions to the rule with animal and human behavior. An anecdote that seems to be contrary to something that I said "Generally" happens or almost never happens, is not proof that what I said is not true. I am very careful not to repeat second hand stories as proof either.
This thread probably says more about the people that write on it than it does with the things we write about. Some people here don't believe in Wildlife Management, don't care what biologists have to say, and normally don't have anything good to say on here.
Some people come here to gather knowledge and learn others come here to stir the pot and complain. You can say anything you want on here as long as no-one knows your name.
I have said all I can here, about a subject that is second nature to me and don't feel like I need to start repeating myself.
There are, of course, exceptions to the rule with animal and human behavior. An anecdote that seems to be contrary to something that I said "Generally" happens or almost never happens, is not proof that what I said is not true. I am very careful not to repeat second hand stories as proof either.
This thread probably says more about the people that write on it than it does with the things we write about. Some people here don't believe in Wildlife Management, don't care what biologists have to say, and normally don't have anything good to say on here.
Some people come here to gather knowledge and learn others come here to stir the pot and complain. You can say anything you want on here as long as no-one knows your name.
I have said all I can here, about a subject that is second nature to me and don't feel like I need to start repeating myself.
What do you think they mean?
Or what do you think I think they mean?
Better yet, why do I care what you think??, LOL
I was talking about people in general but its interesting how so many think the world revolves around them
mark knapp
Well-known member
No, you said some pretty specific things, about something that a specific person said. Too spacific to be in general. We don't know who because you didn't say. It could only have been one or two people here that you could have been talking about (Someone that didn't believe a bear attack could happen and becoming a statistic) It's because I couldn't tell who you were talking to that I answered the way I did, not because I think the world revolves around me.
You talk in riddles, your answer (or questions) to Taiga, above, is proof enough of that.
kwackkillncrew
Well-known member
take your bear banter to pm's. So sea lions!
Again, My original statement was about people in general, NOT anyone specific BUT you insist I was talking about you or some other person. I'm telling you now (again) it wasn't about you or anyone else specifically, it was about people in general. Which leads me to my other statement about people believing the world revolves around them...
As to your comment about taiga, he made a statement and I asked for clarification and tossed in a joke. Why you or anyone would consider that a riddle is beyond me but you're free to think whatever you like so have at it...
mark knapp
Well-known member
Not sure who you are talking to, you didn't say. The OP, Deerhunter has liked several of my posts. He doesn't mind what I have had to say.
mark knapp
Well-known member
I'm just saying that the way you wrote it was confusing to me and to others.
The behavior of wild critters at Brooks, McNeil, or Denali, which are all highly visited/impacted by humans is not the norm in remote backcountry areas that have not seen a lot of humans. Apples to oranges.
Wild critters get habituated to humans very quickly whenever they experience them, and they like what humans bring/leave behind. This includes hunters in wild remote areas. The fact that said hunters have guns, don't seem to matter much to them.
Wild critters get habituated to humans very quickly whenever they experience them, and they like what humans bring/leave behind. This includes hunters in wild remote areas. The fact that said hunters have guns, don't seem to matter much to them.
Autistic_Deer_Hunter
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Right. This is true.
You should always have a decent patch kit and air pump on board.
I'm curious, did yours have multiple air chambers or was it just one monolithic air chamber?
Two chambers so I "canoed" it back. Most stories start out with; I was just gonna.... so the repair kit was on the boat. 18 years of doing the baiting thing and never a problem. I repaired it which was on a round edge. I then washed it with Simple Green and sprayed it with Clorox Cleanup. Most bears are just curios and not destructive. The're like kids.
At the NPS areas I worked at, we had active bear control efforts. That included shotguns loaded with beanbags, and rubber pellets (amongst many others techniques). We'd go out and have a shooting match to see what Ranger can nail the most bears. And in a typical season the good shooters would rack up hundreds of hits. I can't shoot that many bears during hunting season! And I suspect that getting tagged by a beanbag/rubber round hurts like heck. And guess what, the bears still came back! My guess is old Yogi couldn't tell if my shotgun was loaded with a beanbag or a live round.
kasilofchrisn
Well-known member
Just for the record I didn't find it confusing at all.
I interpreted it as a general statement that wasn't directed at anyone in particular.
Just my 2 cents!
