My 1970 winchester model 70 question

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  • #31
    Originally posted by mark knapp View Post

    Man, he was a good guy. I commercial fished with him and guided for him. Best times of my life.
    I commercial fished the Theadore River. (near Beluga R.)

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    • #32
      Originally posted by AGL4now View Post

      I commercial fished the Theadore River. (near Beluga R.)
      Then you must have known Tyler and Jack Swiss, John's sons. I fished the Theodore once for kings with them. Mostly I fished with John at Polly Creek.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by mark knapp View Post

        Then you must have known Tyler and Jack Swiss, John's sons. I fished the Theodore once for kings with them. Mostly I fished with John at Polly Creek.
        NO......did not know them. We were next to Wade Charles.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by AGL4now View Post

          NO......did not know them. We were next to Wade Charles.
          Must have been a different graduating class, or maybe based on the other side of the river. They fished hard down there in the late eighties and all of the nineties. I'm pretty sure they sold their permits in the early 2000s. Last time I fished down at Polly Creek was 1999. The fishing was tough but it was good livin'.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by mark knapp View Post

            When you say up there, it means you are not a resident? You will have to have a guide to hunt brown bears. You can use your .06 for brown bear if your guide/outfitter lets you, but be ready to get a lot of help from someone with a bigger gun. You can hunt everything else if you want to except it would probably be a stretch for sheep.

            You can also hunt, moose, caribou, goat, deer, black bear, bison, elk, musk ox, wolf, wolverine so many opportunities. You could bring your .06 for a multi-species hunt and have your outfitter lend or rent you a bigger gun for brown bear.

            I'm curious what you meant when you said "Native Alaskans" In reality Alaska Natives (like native Americans) generally don't have much experience hunting brown bears, they don't eat them, and don't hunt them. If you meant born in Alaska, most of us weren't. I've only lived and guided up here for 35 years.
            Im actually from New york city but iv spent plenty of summers in Alaska with my uncle in Wasilla. When I said Native Alaskans I meant those who were from there, being im from the lower 48. I was offered a job with a guide Service back in 2010 on the Holitna River but had just been laid off and couldn't afford to get up there. I will most likely be back up next summer.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by Erik7181 View Post

              Im actually from New york city but iv spent plenty of summers in Alaska with my uncle in Wasilla. When I said Native Alaskans I meant those who were from there, being im from the lower 48. I was offered a job with a guide Service back in 2010 on the Holitna River but had just been laid off and couldn't afford to get up there. I will most likely be back up next summer.
              So, you are within 2nd degree kindred of your uncle so you can legally hunt brown/grizzly bears without a guide if he accompanies you. Might your uncle have a gun you can use for brown bear. Does he have some interest in brown bear hunting and does he have some experience at it? These things make it a lot easier.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by mark knapp View Post
                You can hunt everything else if you want to except it would probably be a stretch for sheep.
                .
                Curious why you say this?
                Sheep hunting...... the pain goes away, but the stupidity remains...!!!

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by 4merguide View Post

                  Curious why you say this?
                  Most of the time sheep hunters like to choose flatter shooting rifles for sheep because shots at sheep are very likely to be further than the average shot at any other of our big game animals. Many times, it is impossible to get in for a closer shot in the mountains above tree line.

                  Still, I'm not advocating for shots at ridiculous ranges but it is easier to make killing shots if your "hold-dead-on" range is out to 200 yds. Windage is also effected less with flatter shooting rounds.

                  An .06 is certainly capable of killing sheep.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by mark knapp View Post

                    Most of the time sheep hunters like to choose flatter shooting rifles for sheep because shots at sheep are very likely to be further than the average shot at any other of our big game animals. Many times, it is impossible to get in for a closer shot in the mountains above tree line.

                    Still, I'm not advocating for shots at ridiculous ranges but it is easier to make killing shots if your "hold-dead-on" range is out to 200 yds. Windage is also effected less with flatter shooting rounds.

                    An .06 is certainly capable of killing sheep.
                    I had a feeling you were thinking ballistics. Yes, I know many think it's a good idea to have long range calibers for sheep, but when it came to the sheep I've personally killed, as well as the sheep I guided hunters to, getting close wasn't ever a problem. Maybe I just got lucky, or I guess it could be that I just always like to get as close as I can too. To me, putting on a good stalk on a ram is half the fun! In fact, 2 of the rams I killed I could have stuck with an arrow. I know a friend of mine, all he ever used to kill sheep was his 06'. Imo, when it comes to the 06' for sheep, all a guy really has to do to get more range out of it is just sight it in differently and use a lighter slug. As you know it's not that hard to kill a sheep if you can get a slug into them. Of course, a guy doesn't need a reason to buy a new gun, but again, imo, a guy can make the 06' work just fine for sheep if he wants to.
                    Sheep hunting...... the pain goes away, but the stupidity remains...!!!

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by 4merguide View Post

                      I had a feeling you were thinking ballistics. Yes, I know many think it's a good idea to have long range calibers for sheep, but when it came to the sheep I've personally killed, as well as the sheep I guided hunters to, getting close wasn't ever a problem. Maybe I just got lucky, or I guess it could be that I just always like to get as close as I can too. To me, putting on a good stalk on a ram is half the fun! In fact, 2 of the rams I killed I could have stuck with an arrow. I know a friend of mine, all he ever used to kill sheep was his 06'. Imo, when it comes to the 06' for sheep, all a guy really has to do to get more range out of it is just sight it in differently and use a lighter slug. As you know it's not that hard to kill a sheep if you can get a slug into them. Of course, a guy doesn't need a reason to buy a new gun, but again, imo, a guy can make the 06' work just fine for sheep if he wants to.
                      I agree. I've taken sheep at close ranges too. There have been a few though, that we just weren't going to get much closer than we did and I was very happy to have a hunter with a flat shooting gun and the ability to use it well. Our only other choice would have been to spend the night, or go back to camp and try to catch him again the next day in a better place. There were a few, of course that we just had to leave alone.

                      There are always hunters that will want to use a particular gun for one thing ore another even if it is not the best weapon for the job, and like a bow, it will somewhat limit his chances of being successful. Different strokes.

                      If someone wanted to hunt sheep with a muzzle loader they could, but potentially effective stalks would be harder to come by.

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by mark knapp View Post

                        Most of the time sheep hunters like to choose flatter shooting rifles for sheep because shots at sheep are very likely to be further than the average shot at any other of our big game animals. Many times, it is impossible to get in for a closer shot in the mountains above tree line.

                        Still, I'm not advocating for shots at ridiculous ranges but it is easier to make killing shots if your "hold-dead-on" range is out to 200 yds. Windage is also effected less with flatter shooting rounds.

                        An .06 is certainly capable of killing sheep.
                        My Winchester Featherweight .06 works fine with 150 grain boat tail bullets. Used it on Caribou also. Even on the long shots. I took down a large billy goat at 450 yards. He never knew what hit him. Back in my youth I used a Remington 760 in .270 for sheep. Hand loaded 130 grain Speer boat tails. I didn't own any magnums back then.
                        Hunt Ethically. Respect the Environment.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by SmokeRoss View Post

                          My Winchester Featherweight .06 works fine with 150 grain boat tail bullets. Used it on Caribou also. Even on the long shots. I took down a large billy goat at 450 yards. He never knew what hit him. Back in my youth I used a Remington 760 in .270 for sheep. Hand loaded 130 grain Speer boat tails. I didn't own any magnums back then.
                          Some people can kill anything with anything. A 30/06 is a fine round and it is one of the best for most of our big game species though it probably isn't the best for all of them. For me, when I guide for brown bears I carry my .375 or .458. When I guide for sheep or anywhere there is a chance of running into a grizzly, I carry my .300 Win. Mag.

                          For anything else, I wouldn't mind carrying a 30/06. The only thing is, I don't own any rifles in 30/06 that are configured like my classic model 70s. For that reason, I carry my Kimber .308 when I want to conserve meat, say for instance while hunting deer. That way I'm not fumbling trying to find safeties and bolts where they aren't. My muscle memory always goes for a classic Winchester model 70 configuration.

                          I certainly never intended to say a 30/06 wasn't good for sheep, or anything else (I wouldn't advocate it for brown bears though) I only said it may not be the best for sheep. Most guides and the hunters I've known choose to carry a flatter shooting rifle.

                          One of the outfitters I've worked for carried an old lever gun in .348 on sheep hunts, actually, on all hunts except the peninsula hunts for brown bears. It was a horse outfit and the gun fit in well there. He seldom guided any more as his eyesight wasn't that good any more.

                          My job as a guide was to pick up game that looked like the hunter wasn't going to be able to take care of. By that time, game animals were all ready amped up on adrenaline, spooked and running the other way, toward cover. I'm going to choose the best rifle I can get, and one that I have shot a lot and have confidence in.

                          I've guided for something like thirty sheep and have gotten a chance to see lots of different rounds slung at them. We've had the best success with one of the .30 caliber magnums. Worst success, 7mm Mag. (bullet fragmentation) My best two sheep are in the book and were taken, one at 100 yds and one at 600 yds, both with .300 Win. mag. They were both one shot kills.

                          The .270 is certainly regarded as a fine sheep cartridge. One of the rounds I meant when I said "Flatter shooting" I also had a Rem 760 that I shot a lot about a million years ago in Minnesota for deer. I shot that rifle a lot and was really good with it. Now I use more dependable actions like the model 70 and Kimber bolts.

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by mark knapp View Post

                            .

                            The .270 is certainly regarded as a fine sheep cartridge. One of the rounds I meant when I said "Flatter shooting" I also had a Rem 760 that I shot a lot about a million years ago in Minnesota for deer. I shot that rifle a lot and was really good with it. Now I use more dependable actions like the model 70 and Kimber bolts.
                            Back in 96' I guided a father and son team from Colorado. Good people and we really hit it off. The father ended up having my father and I come down there for a horseback elk hunt. Something my father and I had always wanted to do. One night while at elk camp, the man asked me if I had a choice what new rifle would I get? I said I'd probably want a mountain rifle in 270. Wouldn't you know it, come that next Christmas I received a Browning A-Bolt stainless synthetic in 270! I was floored to say the least!
                            Sheep hunting...... the pain goes away, but the stupidity remains...!!!

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by 4merguide View Post

                              Back in 96' I guided a father and son team from Colorado. Good people and we really hit it off. The father ended up having my father and I come down there for a horseback elk hunt. Something my father and I had always wanted to do. One night while at elk camp, the man asked me if I had a choice what new rifle would I get? I said I'd probably want a mountain rifle in 270. Wouldn't you know it, come that next Christmas I received a Browning A-Bolt stainless synthetic in 270! I was floored to say the least!
                              Wow, isn't that nice. I love it when you can build up a comradery with hunters. With some outfits it's a turn and burn and you never really get to know your hunters.

                              I guided a guy for brown bear with a bow one time from Louisiana. He just happened to be the owner of Sports South, the distributor that supplies all the K Marts and Walmarts with knives and guns in the southern US west of the Mississippi. He got his bear and at the end of the hunt he gave me his catalog and said "Pick your tip" It was the first year that Winchester came out with the Classic Model 70 in stainless synthetic so that's what I picked in .375. When it came it had 4 boxes of safari grade ammo with it. I still use the gun a lot on the coast.

                              Like you, we got along well. More recently I guided him and 3 of his buddies for combination black bears with bows and pike with fly rods. It was a great trip. More like hunting with buddies than anything.

                              Another nice tip I got was some Swarovski 8 X 30 porro prizm binoculars. Shining times them.

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