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  • Kenai late run reds managed for commercial harvest

    The Kenai River late red run is "managed primarily for commercial harvest" per the AK F&G. See: http://cf.adfg.state.ak.us/region2/p...ockeye08mp.pdf

    Sport fisher man get a "reasonable" chance to catch salmon resources - this approach considers that only "275,000 angler days" were spent on the most fished river in AK.

    I see no mention of consideration of dip netters at all in the referenced document.

    With this management plan we should all understand why the boats go out with their walls of death while we are trying to spend out precious weekends trying to catch a few fish for our freezers.

    More fisheries managemetn information at: http://www.sf.adfg.state.ak.us/state..._StratPlan.pdf and http://www.cf.adfg.state.ak.us/regio...kenairiver.php

    Stay informed - know where you stand in the big scheme of things.
    Living the urban lifestyle so I can pay my way and for my family's needs, and support my country. And you?
    ".. ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country" JFK

  • #2
    Where we stand is that the dipnet fishery is a fairly recent creation specifically tailored to meet the needs of Alaskan residents who are trying to feed their families. Commercial windows are being dictated that will fall right before/during the weekend in order to put more fish into the river for dipnetters and sportfishermen.

    What would you have happen? If this isn't enough, what would be?

    Comment


    • #3
      Change

      I would change the management strategy so that the majority of the users - sport fishermen and personal use - are primary consideration in the management plan.

      A good start would be to at least include the personal use in the plan!


      Originally posted by Brian M View Post
      Where we stand is that the dipnet fishery is a fairly recent creation specifically tailored to meet the needs of Alaskan residents who are trying to feed their families. Commercial windows are being dictated that will fall right before/during the weekend in order to put more fish into the river for dipnetters and sportfishermen.

      What would you have happen? If this isn't enough, what would be?
      Living the urban lifestyle so I can pay my way and for my family's needs, and support my country. And you?
      ".. ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country" JFK

      Comment


      • #4
        Just a question from someone in the lower 48. when the comercial guys are out does it totaly shut the river down?

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by kgpcr View Post
          Just a question from someone in the lower 48. when the comercial guys are out does it totaly shut the river down?
          No. Some will say yes, but I have had fantastic fishing when the commercial nets are out.

          Comment


          • #6
            Wall of death

            The popular phrase for all the commercial boats out with their nets is the "wall of death". Stretching nets accross most of the mouth of the river certainly catches a lot of the fish. You can see some of the effects in the weir count 20 mi. upstream I have noticed.

            I'm certain some have had good luck with the nets out but the phrase didn't come into popular being from a lot of people having a lot of luck. All of us aren't lousy fishermen and the dip netting thing isn't quite like sport fishing where a lot of skill is involved!


            Originally posted by kgpcr View Post
            Just a question from someone in the lower 48. when the comercial guys are out does it totaly shut the river down?
            Living the urban lifestyle so I can pay my way and for my family's needs, and support my country. And you?
            ".. ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country" JFK

            Comment


            • #7
              The commercial guys don't head out there with the intent of allowing plenty of fish past them for the dipnetters I've personally seen the commercial nets have an affect on the catch in my dipnet.

              I'm more concerned about timing than anything this year. Typically I'll head down the 15th to 18th, but I'm wondering if its even worth heading down before the last week of the run.
              Those that are successful in Alaska are those who are flexible, and allow the reality of life in Alaska to shape their dreams, vs. trying to force their dreams on the reality of Alaska.

              If you have a tenuous grasp of reality, Alaska is not for you.

              Comment


              • #8
                It has WAY more to do with HOW MANY SALMON are running than nets in or out of the water. If 500,000 to 1,000,000 reds are heading towards the kenai you'll catch some regardless.

                If you watch numbers, and the offshore test fishery (to make a better guess that's all) you can usually do well.

                If few fish are running you will have a hard time catching fish. If the nets are out then it's easy to blame them I guess. I've been there when they go out, and the river shuts down. I've been there when they go out and the fishing gets better. Throw in the fact that the lower river is kind of hard to fish, and distance from shore can vary it is difficult for many to catch reds period. Do I LOVE seeing them go out if I drove a hundred miles? No, but I understand it has way more to do with sheer numbers. I could have saved time and $$ buying them at safeway if it was all about catching fish. I like FISHING.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Personal Use Fishery...

                  Originally posted by tvfinak View Post
                  I would change the management strategy so that the majority of the users - sport fishermen and personal use - are primary consideration in the management plan.

                  A good start would be to at least include the personal use in the plan!

                  The P U Fishery is not included in the management other then a means to control over escapement... This fishery is not one to be managed for. doubt at it's conception that the mng's ever intended >250,000 fish to be harvested by the means of Personal Use.
                  sigpic

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Alright Already

                    We have another thread pitting commercial against sport/PU's... there's a shock. The regs have been changed for comm guys to not only allow more fish for weekend dippers but they have also had a reduction in space from 2 miles offshore to one mile offshore in some areas; this is a new thing for us dippers and I feel that we should give it a chance before we judge. If it doesn't work out, then we can all voice our opinions at next year's BOF public hearings. It's still way early in the run for the 2nd slug of reds and although the first was lackluster to say the least; it was a mirror of last year if you look at the escapement numbers. Our voices WERE heard this last spring and although we are not mentioned by name as personal use users; we do fall under the "sport" category and that is mentioned under the new management plan. Let's put down our fillet knives and pitch forks and hold off on the lynching until we see how this starts to work out. Anyone else with me on this?:confused:
                    "He who is slow to anger is better than the mighty, and he who rules his spirit is better than he who takes a city." ~ Proverbs 16:32

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      No conflict intented

                      I my person in starting the thread was to show that the official purpose of the management of the Kenai River late run sockeye was to give the maximum benefit to the commercial fishermen.

                      Sport and personal use fishermen can't blame the commercial fisherman for for catching every fish they can under the current policy. The commercial fishermen aren't in business to please us - they are in business to make as much money as they can as quickly as they can. A significant number of them don't even live here - it is unrealistic to expect them to be concerned with sport and dip net fisheremen. Face facts - all of us would feel the same way if we were commercial guys.

                      While the F&G may throw us a few scrapes occasinally the real solution is to change the management policy so that the most fished river in AK with tens of thousands of fishermen is managed for the sport and personal use fishermen - not for a few commercal interests.

                      Don't scream at the commercial guys- work with the F&G to get the policy changed - not just give us a few more minor concessions for temporary appeasement.


                      Originally posted by Back Country Robb View Post
                      We have another thread pitting commercial against sport/PU's... there's a shock. The regs have been changed for comm guys to not only allow more fish for weekend dippers but they have also had a reduction in space from 2 miles offshore to one mile offshore in some areas; this is a new thing for us dippers and I feel that we should give it a chance before we judge. If it doesn't work out, then we can all voice our opinions at next year's BOF public hearings. It's still way early in the run for the 2nd slug of reds and although the first was lackluster to say the least; it was a mirror of last year if you look at the escapement numbers. Our voices WERE heard this last spring and although we are not mentioned by name as personal use users; we do fall under the "sport" category and that is mentioned under the new management plan. Let's put down our fillet knives and pitch forks and hold off on the lynching until we see how this starts to work out. Anyone else with me on this?:confused:
                      Living the urban lifestyle so I can pay my way and for my family's needs, and support my country. And you?
                      ".. ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country" JFK

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Brian M View Post
                        Commercial windows are being dictated that will fall right before/during the weekend in order to put more fish into the river for dipnetters and sportfishermen.

                        What would you have happen? If this isn't enough, what would be?
                        even though the windows are good for us they are still not good enough. Take for instance the 36hr. closure it's perfect but make it start at 7pm. fri. don't give them the chance to to start it 7am. thursday so they can start fishing at 7am sat. and make everyone on the beach and boats work there ***** off for 10 fish. Make it 7pm so they can't fish until sunday morning and will better are chances of catch success. It is nice to see them doing these windows now it's a start i will say that. For another thing if they have an E.O. that allows them to fish from 12 noon til 12 noon the next day it should be allowed the we fish that night as well or if they have an E.O. for 7am to 7pm for a day the are not scheduled to be out we should be allowed to fish overnight

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by tvfinak View Post
                          While the F&G may throw us a few scrapes occasinally
                          Scraps. Over a million fish in river is scraps.

                          :confused:

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by 06tributeman View Post
                            For another thing if they have an E.O. that allows them to fish from 12 noon til 12 noon the next day it should be allowed the we fish that night as well or if they have an E.O. for 7am to 7pm for a day the are not scheduled to be out we should be allowed to fish overnight
                            Now that seems like a reasonable solution.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Robb - Very well written post. Thank you for injecting some reason into this discussion, particularly since you are a very vocal supporter of personal use dipnetting.

                              Comment

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