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  • #31
    The problem with giving up the dividend is this:
    If we give up the dividend without significant spending cuts then there's just no point in giving it up.
    Why? Well that is because the government will spend and spend until the dividend is gone and then we will have an income or other tax(s) on top of no PFD.
    People keep saying that giving up the PFD will fix our problems but it won't.
    We can't spend our way out of debt!
    The first thing a smart person does when his income declines is adjust his budget to match his current income.
    It's crazy how much money this state GIVES away in grant funded programs and the like.
    If you're one of those people that lives in a rural community, serviced by the state ferry system, and you cannot afford to live there if not for the State ferry system maybe it's time to move somewhere you can afford to live without the government supplementing your cost of living?
    Some villages claim they're being washed into the sea and the government needs to pay to move their homes to safer ground.
    Others claim it's just too expensive to live in the villages where they've chosen to live and that there are no jobs there to support them living there.
    There again is another easy fix, move your butt somewhere cheaper to live!
    At one time there were communities where the native people were forced to live but that is no longer the case.
    And I don't feel I should supplement anyones life choices.
    But back to the topic at hand.
    I still think we should tax some of the fish and game that is leaving this state.
    Now whether we tax the guide business or tax the customer that is shipping that fish and game out of state is up for debate but I think the state could gain some income from doing so.


    Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk
    "The closer I get to nature the farther I am from idiots"

    "Fishing and Hunting are only an addiction if you're trying to quit"

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    • #32
      I agree we can't spend our way out of debt...nor can we cut our way out...new taxes are the only realistic solution. Jay Hammond laid that out for us many years ago...
      " Gas boats are bad enough, autos are an invention of the devil, and airplanes are worse." ~Allen Hasselborg

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      • #33
        Originally posted by cdubbin View Post
        I agree we can't spend our way out of debt...nor can we cut our way out...new taxes are the only realistic solution. Jay Hammond laid that out for us many years ago...
        But if we (the state) can cut spending to match our current tax revenues then we have what's called a balanced budget.
        And we would not a need ,at least currently, new taxes if we can accomplish this.
        How did we ever get by when oil was $20 a barrel and even less?
        We spent a whole lot less and didn't depend on the state for nearly as much as we do now.
        It's doable. People do it all the time.
        Why can't our state government?
        And yes new sources of revenue are needed.
        That is why I'm suggesting taxing a bit more of this 11+ billion dollar revenue from our fish and game.

        Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk
        "The closer I get to nature the farther I am from idiots"

        "Fishing and Hunting are only an addiction if you're trying to quit"

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        • #34
          Originally posted by kasilofchrisn View Post
          I still think we should tax some of the fish and game that is leaving this state.
          Now whether we tax the guide business or tax the customer that is shipping that fish and game out of state is up for debate but I think the state could gain some income from doing so.


          Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk
          Just put a 100% tax on coolers, lol.
          Redleader standing by

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          • #35
            [QUOTE=kasilofchrisn;1662225]The problem with giving up the dividend is this:
            If we give up the dividend without significant spending cuts then there's just no point in giving it up.
            Why? Well that is because the government will spend and spend until the dividend is gone and then we will have an income or other tax(s) on top of no PFD.
            People keep saying that giving up the PFD will fix our problems but it won't.
            We can't spend our way out of debt!
            The first thing a smart person does when his income declines is adjust his budget to match his current income.
            It's crazy how much money this state GIVES away in grant funded programs and the like.
            If you're one of those people that lives in a rural community, serviced by the state ferry system, and you cannot afford to live there if not for the State ferry system maybe it's time to move somewhere you can afford to live without the government supplementing your cost of living?
            Some villages claim they're being washed into the sea and the government needs to pay to move their homes to safer ground.
            Others claim it's just too expensive to live in the villages where they've chosen to live and that there are no jobs there to support them living there.
            There again is another easy fix, move your butt somewhere cheaper to live!
            At one time there were communities where the native people were forced to live but that is no longer the case.
            And I don't feel I should supplement anyones life choices.
            But back to the topic at hand.
            I still think we should tax some of the fish and game that is leaving this state.
            Now whether we tax the guide business or tax the customer that is shipping that fish and game out of state is up for debate but I think the state could gain some income from doing so.

            Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk[/QUOTE

            Tax fish leaving the state? Rod And reel caught fish?

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            • #36
              Originally posted by kidfromgarcia View Post
              Tax fish leaving the state? Rod And reel caught fish?
              That's one option for the state to gain revenue from the 11+ billion dollars our fish and game is worth every year.
              The commercial caught fish are already taxed so that's is covered already to some extent.
              I certainly don't want to tax the fish and game alaskans put in our freezers to feed our families, but the ones that are caught thrown in a cooler and flown out of this state or canned up and loaded in the back of RVs and all that...... Yeah I'm thinking there's some potential tax revenue there somewhere.
              I go through the Kenai and Anchorage airport all the time and you would be amazed how many boxes and coolers leave this state every year.
              Some of these people have a dozen 50# boxes and coolers they're taking South with them.
              It is also been documented a few of these people over harvest and take their poached fish and/or game with them as well.
              We keep talking about finding alternative sources of revenue, well maybe it's time the tourists step up and pay their fair share?


              Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk
              "The closer I get to nature the farther I am from idiots"

              "Fishing and Hunting are only an addiction if you're trying to quit"

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              • #37
                Originally posted by kasilofchrisn View Post
                That's one option for the state to gain revenue from the 11+ billion dollars our fish and game is worth every year.
                The commercial caught fish are already taxed so that's is covered already to some extent.
                I certainly don't want to tax the fish and game alaskans put in our freezers to feed our families, but the ones that are caught thrown in a cooler and flown out of this state or canned up and loaded in the back of RVs and all that...... Yeah I'm thinking there's some potential tax revenue there somewhere.
                I go through the Kenai and Anchorage airport all the time and you would be amazed how many boxes and coolers leave this state every year.
                Some of these people have a dozen 50# boxes and coolers they're taking South with them.
                It is also been documented a few of these people over harvest and take their poached fish and/or game with them as well.
                We keep talking about finding alternative sources of revenue, well maybe it's time the tourists step up and pay their fair share?


                Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk
                We know you don't like tourists but claiming they don't pay their fair share is a far cry.
                First you suggest a poundage limit, now a special tax, good luck with that.
                Redleader standing by

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by redleader View Post
                  We know you don't like tourists but claiming they don't pay their fair share is a far cry.
                  First you suggest a poundage limit, now a special tax, good luck with that.
                  I've never said I don't like tourists I just feel they need to pay their fair share.
                  OK what taxes do the tourists pay to help fund our state?
                  Because that's really what I'm talking about here taxes to help cover our state governments budget shortfall. local taxes do not come into play here because we're discussing the 11 + billion dollars the fish and game of Alaska bring to the state.
                  A little fuel taxes (but they are driving on and helping to wear out our roads). License fees (which cover the cost of ADF&G to manage the fish and wildlife that they're harvesting). And user fees(used to cover the cost of the maintenance on the facilities that they're using). Most of those just cover what they use.Oh and a cruise ship tax to make sure they're not dumping oil and trash overboard like they've been caught doing a few times.
                  So yes I will say they DO NOT pay their fair share to help fund our state government!
                  What taxes do the tourist pay to help fund the state troopers? What taxes do they pay that help fund our schools on a state level?
                  What taxes do they pay to fund the DEC, State Forestry, and other necessary government agencies?
                  Little to none!
                  Any little bit of added income will help at this point.
                  I mean there's 11 + billion dollars in value in our fish and game here and you're telling me you don't see any point in taxing any of the portion of that which is leaving this state?
                  You'd rather pay an income tax than tax the tourists?
                  Good luck with that!



                  Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk
                  "The closer I get to nature the farther I am from idiots"

                  "Fishing and Hunting are only an addiction if you're trying to quit"

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by redleader View Post
                    Just put a 100% tax on coolers, lol.
                    That would be an easy way to collect further revenue for the state by imposing a tax on a majority of people shipping fish and game out of state, sure some residents would pay a bit more when buying disposable coolers but by and large it would impact those leaving with our common resource. Even if it were only $5-10 a box, just look at almost any stores shelves near fishing grounds during the summer months the coolers are stacked on top of the aisles, aisle after aisle.

                    If it helps offset some of the cost that is incurred by their visit it's worth looking at.
                    I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers that can't be questioned. Physicist ― Richard Feynman

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                    • #40
                      I think another option might be to charge a tax similar to the city of Anchorages bed tax.
                      That is that every charter boat client and every guided Hunter would pay a tax that would be collected by the guide when the charter is paid for.
                      It would likely be small to start. Maybe $5 per head.
                      Or possibly a % tax. Say 2%.
                      That $300 halibut charter would net the state $6 and the $12,000 sheep hunt would net $240.
                      These would also be collected from residents using guides as well.
                      Just some thoughts on a way to generate tax revenue for the state from a resource worth 11+ billion dollars.

                      Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk
                      "The closer I get to nature the farther I am from idiots"

                      "Fishing and Hunting are only an addiction if you're trying to quit"

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by kasilofchrisn View Post
                        I think another option might be to charge a tax similar to the city of Anchorages bed tax.
                        That is that every charter boat client and every guided Hunter would pay a tax that would be collected by the guide when the charter is paid for.
                        It would likely be small to start. Maybe $5 per head.
                        Or possibly a % tax. Say 2%.
                        That $300 halibut charter would net the state $6 and the $12,000 sheep hunt would net $240.
                        These would also be collected from residents using guides as well.
                        Just some thoughts on a way to generate tax revenue for the state from a resource worth 11+ billion dollars.

                        Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk
                        And therein lies the problem with any new tax. It starts small.

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                        • #42
                          The tourists pay their share although it may be indirectly they generate 2.4 billion in revenue and 1 in 8 jobs.
                          Talking about raising taxes on recreational anglers is a tough one.
                          Tricky part is to raise taxes with limited impact on the residents.
                          Redleader standing by

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by redleader View Post
                            The tourists pay their share although it may be indirectly they generate 2.4 billion in revenue and 1 in 8 jobs.
                            Talking about raising taxes on recreational anglers is a tough one.
                            Tricky part is to raise taxes with limited impact on the residents.
                            It doesn't matter how many local jobs they provide if the state of Alaska goes bankrupt does it? At that point will it really matter?
                            Everything starts small taxes start small and our state's budget started a lot smaller than where it is now.
                            Besides having a balanced budget we need to find other sources of revenue to fund our state government other than the oil and gas industry.
                            And when you tell me the fish and game of Alaska has a value of over 11 billion dollars it seems to me that maybe there are some ways to gain a little extra income from that then what is already being paid.
                            The oil and gas industry is the largest private-sector employer in the state providing about 35% of all the jobs here.
                            In 2018 they paid $805,577,463 just in oil royalty taxes to the state of Alaska.
                            Not including money from lease sales and other various money they pay to the state.
                            Conversely all tourism fees combined equaled only $101,000,000 to the state.
                            So while tourism is supposedly our second largest employer they only pay 1/8 of what the oil and gas industry pays to the state and that's in all fees not just taxes.
                            Many of those fees they pay are used to cover the cost of maintenance and other things for the services they used.
                            Seems a bit lopsided to me but if you call that fair then maybe it is?
                            The oil and gas industry pays 35% in royalties for extraction of a state-owned resource.
                            Just a guess but I would say the average person(tourist, guide, or otherwise) doesn't pay 35% of the value of the fish that they catch or the game that they harvest to the state of Alaska do they?
                            But 35% of 11 billion is 3.85 billion dollars.
                            (Not that we need to charge anyone at that rate it's just a comparison.)
                            Just some more food for thought and my own two cents.

                            Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk
                            "The closer I get to nature the farther I am from idiots"

                            "Fishing and Hunting are only an addiction if you're trying to quit"

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