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  • Non Motorized Paved Paths becoming gravel, ATV Registration time?

    Seeing more & more of the bike trail covered with lots of gravel & some places almost impassable for road bike tires.
    Some even have some pretty big rocks.
    ATV & UTVs would be better if they drove on the paths & not try to ruin them for everyone else.


    Maybe time to register ATVs &UTVs ,like snow machines & boats,
    to help pay for the road & trail maintenance needed from the damage they are causing .

    Many places the road pavement is breaking off on the shoulders where they've rutted next to the pavement.
    Almost all road shoulders need swept, from where they drive close or cross over.
    All the Paved Paths, (aka bike trails) need swept monthly to be safe for road bikes
    But that never seems to happen
    ...VENTING.

    Many places I ride the road because i going down hill on the loose gravel on pavement gets scary..

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  • #2
    Reality is that it is 20 yrs. or so past time to require registration. The well documented damages caused by motor vehicles to fish and other habitats is solid proof of same.
    One cannot call in a violation and say, " I just saw a red machine....blah, blah ..." and expect anything more than a sigh. Legible registration numbers are necessary for any enforcement.
    Even 'access for all to everywhere" advocacy organizations have stated publicly that off-roaders are willing to pay their way. When?
    A side benefit to machine owners is that theft and blackmarket cases might be more effective. BC, Canada was the last province to enact registration with this reason being a paramount consideration.

    If this can be made to happen in this state, you deserve the title of 'miracle worker.' Decades of effort have failed.
    "Punish the monkey - let the organ grinder go" - Mark Knopfler

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    • #3
      25 plus years ago I used to help maintain bicycle trails in Minnesota when I worked for the DNR there.
      We used to run a street sweeper down the trails at least once and sometimes twice a year.
      Some of the problem areas such as trail crossings would get hit with a broom and leaf blower if they got bad enough and we weren't going to sweep the whole trail.
      I agree with you that ATVs can cause a lot of problems.
      We didn't have ATV issues on much of our trail sections it was just natural dirt and debris from driveway crossings road crossings and such.
      Of course they were always a few problem areas where the ATVs were an issue.
      The problem is that if you start registering ATVs they're going to want some of that money put into a trail system they can use.
      Those people are going to complain about their money being spent to maintain a bicycle trail.
      Minnesota ended up putting registration on bicyclists to use the 85+ miles of trails in our district. But it was only if you rode on the designated maintained bike trails that it was required.
      As a bicyclist are you willing to pay some fees to maintain the trails that you're using?
      And if so how would you propose we do that?



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      "The closer I get to nature the farther I am from idiots"

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      • #4
        Originally posted by kasilofchrisn View Post
        As a bicyclist are you willing to pay some fees to maintain the trails that you're using?
        Yes. But that's not really the issue here, is it? The issue is how do we keep people on ATV's from trashing non-motorized trails.

        Those people are going to complain about their money being spent to maintain a bicycle trail.
        How about if their money was spent to remediate damage they did to a non-motorized trail (because that's what's at issue here)? Do you think they would complain about that too? My heart bleeds for them.

        We have trails here in the woods, specifically paid for and constructed for bicycle/non-motorized use and clearly signed as such. The signs have been torn down and the trails intentionally torn up/vandalized repeatedly by people on ATV's. So spare us the "if we paid for our own trails the ATV's wouldn't be a problem" nonsense.
        ...he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. ~Thomas Jefferson
        I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief. ~Gerry Spence
        The last thing Alaska needs is another bigot. ~member Catch It

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        • #5
          Just for the record I don't own an ATV or SxS of any kind.
          I spent a couple of years in my younger days building and maintaining trails for a living.
          These would include snowmachine trails, ATV trails, hiking trails, canoe portages and paved bicycle trails.
          I'm not claiming to be any kind of expert but I do have a bunch of experience working on/maintaining these trails.
          A lot of the bicycle trails that are built in Alaska we're actually built because the federal government put it into their grants.
          The state got matching funds for highway construction/maintenance but the one of the stipulations was that they had to put in a adjacent bicycle trail.
          I would venture a guess though that the feds did not put any money in for future maintenance of said trails?
          I'm not sure there's much that can be done to keep stupid people from doing stupid things short of added enforcement for which there really isn't funding either.
          But all trails require maintenance to keep them in good shape for their intended user group.
          I couldn't tell you how many times we got called out to cut a tree that blew over the bicycle trail in a windstorm or just because it was dead.
          We had to do crack sealing on the pavement as well.
          And we ran a street sweeper down it once or twice a year just because it naturally picked up rocks, dirt, leaves, and dust from driveways crossing and whatever else nature through at it.
          Plus the signage that was required and the maintenance of those signs.
          One of our head bosses used to rollerblade/bike to work and wanted the trail in good condition for that. Used to complain when he couldn't get his rollerblades over 20 miles an hour so we wanted to make sure we spent extra time keeping it in good shape.
          But regardless all of this maintenance cost money.
          I think ATV users should pay for the maintenance required because of their stupidity though there are a lot of responsible uses out there not causing this kind of damage.
          But, if you require them to be registered, they're going to complain if all their money is merely being used for bicycle trail maintenance which they are not legally allowed to use anyway.
          Maybe the state needs to put in some more ATV trails to give these people a place to ride that is not interfering with other user groups?
          For instance here on the Kenai Peninsula so much of this area is refuge that they are not allowed to ride on.
          So they ride where they can and sometimes that causes issues in and of itself.
          I have to wonder who is picking up the tab for the current maintenance of these bicycle trails?
          Because I do see them getting maintained here on the peninsula by some government agency I'm just not sure if it's the borough or the cities or.....?
          It may not be as good of maintenance as they truly need but I know some of it is getting done as I've seen them out there doing it as I passed by on the road.




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          "The closer I get to nature the farther I am from idiots"

          "Fishing and Hunting are only an addiction if you're trying to quit"

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          • #6
            I say put up a toll gate and charge everyone on the trails using anything with wheels (wheelchairs exempt) or tracks

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            • #7
              Originally posted by iofthetaiga View Post
              Yes. But that's not really the issue here, is it? The issue is how do we keep people on ATV's from trashing non-motorized trails.

              How about if their money was spent to remediate damage they did to a non-motorized trail (because that's what's at issue here)? Do you think they would complain about that too? My heart bleeds for them.

              We have trails here in the woods, specifically paid for and constructed for bicycle/non-motorized use and clearly signed as such. The signs have been torn down and the trails intentionally torn up/vandalized repeatedly by people on ATV's. So spare us the "if we paid for our own trails the ATV's wouldn't be a problem" nonsense.
              How about instead of making every ATV or side by side Rider pay for the idiotic actions of a few,
              We enforce the law on the few that violate it.
              If there are some common hot spots for people throwing gravel onto the bicycle trail it wouldn't be hard to set up a game camera or something similar and catch them.
              Or beef up patrols in those areas.
              When they catch them you fine the offending individuals the maximum amount.
              After a dozen or so of the local atv crowd pay a $300 or $500 fine I'm guessing the message would reverberate throughout the ATV community and the problem would be significantly less.

              Sent from my S41 using Tapatalk

              "The closer I get to nature the farther I am from idiots"

              "Fishing and Hunting are only an addiction if you're trying to quit"

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              • #8
                There are way too many trails and way too few police officers to enforce the laws with our huge area up here. Some people just can't even leave a parking lot without spinning tires and throwing up gravel. Then you have the "beat the Jones's" crowd that if someone shows up with a slightly bigger rig, next year they will have an even bigger rig. Many of the trails in the state are so torn up that the guy with the average 500 c.c. stock machine can't even use the trails.

                I'd like to say that the best thing is for "us" to police ourselves but I don't see that happening in todays society. Things are just going to get worse until they shut down everything.

                Patriot Life Member NRA
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                • #9


                  Originally posted by Daveinthebush View Post
                  There are way too many trails and way too few police officers to enforce the laws with our huge area up here. Some people just can't even leave a parking lot without spinning tires and throwing up gravel. Then you have the "beat the Jones's" crowd that if someone shows up with a slightly bigger rig, next year they will have an even bigger rig. Many of the trails in the state are so torn up that the guy with the average 500 c.c. stock machine can't even use the trails.

                  I'd like to say that the best thing is for "us" to police ourselves but I don't see that happening in todays society. Things are just going to get worse until they shut down everything.
                  To be honest I have stopped people who were illegally riding on a bicycle trail.
                  Gave them a little lecture about where they should be riding.
                  I know you can't police everywhere but if there are certain hot spots that are a common problem you would think they could invest a little time there. Or at least set up some sort of game camera or something to help catch a few of them.
                  Like you said some of these rigs are pretty tricked out and in some cases that makes it easier to identify who they are from a photograph.
                  If they had a registration number on the side I suppose, much like a license plate, that would make it even easier.
                  One thing that I have noticed that does help in other states is giving the ATV crowd someplace they can ride.
                  You charge them a registration fee, you spend that money to make some trails, and you spend that money to maintain those trails.
                  So much of Alaska is off limits to these motorized users that I often wonder why they own them when there's not a lot of areas to ride?
                  I know here on the peninsula so much of it is refuge that is off limits to these guys.
                  Some of it does open in the winter time for those of us who own snow machines though.
                  But I also know that not every ATV owner is a bad Apple.
                  Lots of people own them just to take them down the beach fishing or dipping and to plow their driveway. They're not tearing up the trails.
                  But I guess they're guilty by association? Because their neighbor with a similar machine is causing havoc to a bike trail?
                  That's what some people want us to believe anyway!




                  Sent from my S41 using Tapatalk

                  "The closer I get to nature the farther I am from idiots"

                  "Fishing and Hunting are only an addiction if you're trying to quit"

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by kasilofchrisn View Post



                    To be honest I have stopped people who were illegally riding on a bicycle trail.
                    Gave them a little lecture about where they should be riding.
                    I know you can't police everywhere but if there are certain hot spots that are a common problem you would think they could invest a little time there. Or at least set up some sort of game camera or something to help catch a few of them.
                    Like you said some of these rigs are pretty tricked out and in some cases that makes it easier to identify who they are from a photograph.
                    If they had a registration number on the side I suppose, much like a license plate, that would make it even easier.
                    One thing that I have noticed that does help in other states is giving the ATV crowd someplace they can ride.
                    You charge them a registration fee, you spend that money to make some trails, and you spend that money to maintain those trails.
                    So much of Alaska is off limits to these motorized users that I often wonder why they own them when there's not a lot of areas to ride?
                    I know here on the peninsula so much of it is refuge that is off limits to these guys.
                    Some of it does open in the winter time for those of us who own snow machines though.
                    But I also know that not every ATV owner is a bad Apple.
                    Lots of people own them just to take them down the beach fishing or dipping and to plow their driveway. They're not tearing up the trails.
                    But I guess they're guilty by association? Because their neighbor with a similar machine is causing havoc to a bike trail?
                    That's what some people want us to believe anyway!




                    Sent from my S41 using Tapatalk
                    Many of us own them to access our remote properties.
                    Hunt Ethically. Respect the Environment.

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                    • #11
                      A-holes are going to screw things up regardless of rules. Idiots go out of their way to tear up trails when there are other places to go mudding. Same mindset and idiocy as rolling coal while in traffic.

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                      • #12
                        Hey, not to worry, soon they will be able to ride their ATV right down the road. Won't that be fun?

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by NRick View Post
                          Hey, not to worry, soon they will be able to ride their ATV right down the road. Won't that be fun?
                          Uh-huh. Watch our insurance rates go up as a result, too. Thanks again to the freak'n corrupt *******s club.

                          ...he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. ~Thomas Jefferson
                          I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief. ~Gerry Spence
                          The last thing Alaska needs is another bigot. ~member Catch It

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