A Hunting Labradoodle? Now what?

[Linda]

I can hear hair standing up all over at just the idea. I didn't buy him or look for one, he was at the Houston AK shelter and I thought he was a Wirehaired Pointing Griffon without his tail docked. The woman at the Houston shelter said that people had called claiming to be his owners but did not want him back and that he was a WPG. I’m sure she lied.
I doubt that I would have had any interest in this dog had I thought he was a mixed breed of any kind. I thought I was rescuing a pure bred dog. At Upland bird class on Tuesday, one guy said he was a really nice Pudelpointer and looking at the WPG in our class I took his opinion seriously. I contacted a couple of Pudelpointer breeders and they were almost offended by the inquiry. “No Pudelpointer would have an undocked tail! “ Then an entire string of people on Alaska Dog News Facebook page said he was a Labradoodle which I rejected straight away.

For 7 months I have been training this dog like a gun dog and he does the work with a little less enthusiasm than our Lab Lucy, who is a maniac for retrieving and birds. He’s retrieving bumpers and frozen birds to hand up to 75 yards well. As I work through denial and grief I’m trying to make this situation as good as possible. On a walk alone with him in the woods yesterday he worked all the scents, held a brief point on a few of them.

I may have found his breeder who had a litter in December 2009 with a chocolate male but was unable to contact the new owner last year to follow up. She is going to take a look at him and see if she can tell if he is one of her pups. I still want to take him as far as he will go with hunting though we won’t be able to get a limited registration on him or enter any licensed tests. I’ll work him with some live pigeons next month. We’ll see what he does at the picnic trials and chuckar challenge

[Hoyt]

Labs and poodles are both waterfowl dogs, so the idea of having a mix hunt isn't that crazy to me. I don't know much about them however. I grew up around labs. I have no experience with poodles, so I have no real opinion on what he may be! Hope he works out, and turns into a nice unting companion!

[AGL4now]

I had a litter of eight Labradooles born on Oct. 17'th 2009 and sold'out on December 15'th 2009. They were from a Stud Registered Chocolate Standard Poodle and a Registered Chocolate Lab. They were and are fine dogs.

[Linda]

AGL4Now - thats about the right time frame. Did you have your's chipped? Or sell to anyone in the Houston, AK area? Jack is 24 " at the shoulder now and about 63 lbs. We estimated he was 8-11 mos old when we got him in Sept 2010. His coat is wiry. If you have an photos of the pups as adults could you send them to alaskadognews@mtaonline.net

[2jumpersplease]

Looks like a wirehaired breed to me

Your dog looks like a wirehaired versatile dog. It could be mixed with something but the picture makes it look like a Wirehaired Pointing Griffon, Pudelpointer, German Wirehaired Pointer, or some other similar breed. Other than the undocked tail it looks entirely within the realm of genetics in those closely related breeds. The wirehaired coats can be highly variable. If it is true to breed, it probably gets bored with bumper training easier than labs but should be more interested in tracking and searching relative to the lab. I will try to attach a picture of two german wirehairs from different registries with drastically different coats.

He should be a fun dog if you work with him.

[Howard N]

That picture doesn't look like any of the labradoodles I've seen (all 2 of them). However, he sure does remind me of my old German Wirehaired Pointer. She's been gone almost 20 years now. I got my first lab when she started showing her age.

[Hayduke]

For sure part GWP. Maybe 100%, looks funny with his tail.

[Linda]

I had a hoot of a conversation with Johnny "Hoot" Gibson of GooseBusters in Tennessee. He's been breeding and hunting with his PoodleX Lab mixes for a couple of decades after his first accidental litter. He's going to be featured in a couple of hunting magazines including Greys later this year. Im even more convinced about the Labradoodle the more I look into it. It is just too unlikely that a WPG or a Pudelpointer, with a natural tail ended up in Houston Alaska. There have been a number of Labradoodle litters and people who may have bred from them too. The wire coat is one of the results from the F1 breedings, Poodle to Lab. They can be wiry or fleecy. The wiry coat is least desirable for alergies and shedding. He sheds. Hoot said "Well then you must have the cream of the crop". Im getting used to the idea but still wake up everyday saying " a Labradoodle?"

[2jumpersplease]

Linda,

Very interesting dog genetics you have got there. Does he point? Did you give him a haircut or is that picture just how he is? Also, does he appear to have a shorter thicker inner coat along with a rough wiry outer coat or is the coat all one length?

-TOM

[Linda]

He points kind of, sometimes longer than other times and retrieves with gusto. He froze on a grouse this morning as it jumped and went up in the trees, but I couldn't see if he was pointing through the brush. We are in Upland Classes for the next few weeks. Yes, 2j, this was just 2 days after I brought him home from the shelter and a bad haircut I gave him after his first bath from the shelter, a groomer helped clean up my work the next day. He had a really dense, matted fluffy puppy coat that I stripped out. It will grow to about 3 inches if left alone and is wiry.
We'll see how he does at the retriever picnic trial. Maybe if I treat him like a gun dog of any lineage he'll be one. Competing isn't all its cracked up to be ...anyway, he's taking my version of conditioned retrieve well.
Linda

[2jumpersplease]

If he's a good dog you should keep him and take him hunting as much as you can regardless of whether you find out what he really is!

A book called "Griffon Gun Dog Supreme" by Joan Bailey might be interesting to you as it talks about the origin of the WPG breed, early imports to the US, and has a lot of information about coat genetics. Various websites and newsletters from breed clubs have information about the history of other wirehaired breeds and coat variability though I am unaware or any detailed english language books. Definitely some poodle type dogs in the early gene pool.

If your dog is a labradoodle then this may or may not apply, but generally folks try to avoid haircuts with the wirehaired breeds. Stripping with a tool like the furminator or a stripping knife will pull out dead hair and encourage healthy "wire" hairs to grow. The longer haired dog in my post was a rescue with a bad haircut. Her coat was always soft but the more time that went on past her haircut at the pound the harsher and lower maintenance her coat became. We changed what breed we thought she was until we met her previous owner/breeder and got the scoop on her. Sounds like you have a good lead on the Labradoodle breeders though.

[AK Ray]

The two labradoodles my coworker owns are tennis ball retreiving maniacs. Drive, they has it, lots of it to keep up with the skiing and biking. Both have shaggy hair, but the black one has some poodle curl to it. The black one is super smart and has a lanky poodle build. The brown one is more lab like in build.

He bought them from a breeder in Copper Center 5 and 6 years ago. They are probably first generation dogs like AGL4now's.

[tailwind]

IMO, that is definately a labradoodle!
You can pay for a test that can eliminate any doubt if it's driving you crazy.
The labradoodles I have worked with are tough as nails hunters that can keep up with any dog in spring/summer/fall.
In winter snow, they tend to get ice balls built up on their feet/under fur preventing them from being outside for long periods of time.
Also, they are sorta hypoallergenic(no dog truly is), which can be nice during shedding season(Now!)
Thanks for the great post Linda, really love to see this!

[PG13]

The one person I know that had labradoodles also loved them, preferred them in fact, for upland hunting in northwest Minnesota. Tall and tough. Rooting for your Labradoodle Dandy!

[Linda]

If there are a few people with doodles, golden and otherwise, any one want to get together for a little training/picnic event? They are allowing any dog to enter in the RCA/WRCA picnic trial (hunt test levels) May 1 at Rebarcheck field at the State Fairgrounds in Palmer, registration starts at 8am, tests start at 9 ish. Bring a dish to share at the BBQ after the tests are done, about 1.

Great photo tailwind, funny PG13 I called him doodle dandy the other day, better name than Jack (considering the commands that start with a name-- think about it) no Dandy would not work either. Please feel free to email me at alaskadognews@mtaonline.net if interested in the events.
Linda Henning
www.alaskadognews.com