Stolen stand or fair game?

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  • #46
    Originally posted by AlaskanOutdoorsman View Post
    What your recommending is illegal, unethical and in poor form sir.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    It is not illegal if it's your bait station, it's unethical to steal someone elses stand and it's in great form for the situation...
    Ignorance is not Bliss, it's insanity

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    • #47
      If nothing else comes out of this I think we will all be a little Better at hanging signs that clearly indicate it as an in use site and not an abandoned one.

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      • #48
        Tough situation. Just wondering if you have heard from the robber yet?
        Semper Fi and God Bless

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        • #49
          Originally posted by ArcherBob View Post
          I've been in the same bear bait stand for 7 years! It has my camo netting, my bow hanging hooks, my tarp, and my clean barrel and buckets. It by no means looks abandoned. This year I registered it on the 1st of April, but there was far too much snow to get 6 miles back on a 4 wheeler trail. Then work took me out of town for a couple weeks. When my son and I got the 6 miles in we found another personís bear bait sign and our clean barrel had been baited!!! Is this ethical or sound hunting etiquette? I hate to think this is how things work..."I found it you werenít here now it's mine"??? It was disheartening, especially the look on my son's face (10 yrs old) when I turned and said "well turn your wheeler around someoneís taken our stand" So what do you make of it? Stolen bait stand or fair game? I know how I feel! :mad:
          Originally posted by ArcherBob View Post
          Well I haven't posted on here in months and now I remember why! For all of you who automatically insinuate I've broken a single law... Well im not sure if Your just ignorant, pessimistic, or trying to get a rise out of others for fun? I can register my station and set it up on the 1st, then before the snow would melt enough for my son to be able to get his little quad out there I was pulled out of town for a couple weeks. Well in that couple weeks someone started using all my sh!$ I had built and staged. I should have figured there would be a bunch of arm chair "hunters" who would just assume the worst and insinuate I'm an outlaw. For those of you who took this for what it was (a question of your opinion on ethics or decency of the situation) thanks for the insight. I think I'll leave a note with my contact info and go from there.
          I'm confused. If you registered the bait stand and then set it up in the field and posted it accordingly, then why would someone take your stand? Perhaps your sign was tore down and someone else posted and squatted on the location? I don't intend to know specific details, however ...

          For now, I'm assuming you left it over the winter and were surprised someone else made ready use of your stand. (I'm sure pictures of the area, a little forensics would indicate what happened.) The current baiter may have plotted this action (using what available left behind by a previous baiter) after discovering the stand last year or a winter trip, when there was supposed to be none. This issue may go back several years (as suggested by your posts) of stumbling across the remnants of a baiting stand in the off-season. They may be making an invitation of "contact the baiter" if you have an issue or sending you a message that you need to remove your equipment from the field at the end of the season. Otherwise, I wonder how you 'd plan to remove the stand without "obstructing or hindering a bait station registrant's feasibility of taking game". They may have plans for involving LEO (based on any communication you might have with them) in their effort to clean up the area from the construction materials left behind by baiters. Perhaps it is a far fetched idea, but the station may be currently run by LEO.

          I would assume you still have the responsibility to remove the equipment described in your post, unless the other baiter does it by/at season's end. You could probably run the options up with LEO for earlier recovery, or try to work with the current baiter of that location. If action by LEO is a concern, perhaps you could remove the gear after the end of the season.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by JOAT View Post
            The solution is very simple. It's your gear that was set up following the law and the other guy has zero right to use your gear.
            I agree. If the station was registered, staged and posted within the law, then the other guy is illegal in using the equipment. If the sign was somehow was tore down, one could re-post and use the set-up. At my sites, I take photos of the going ons (set up, postings, etc), as they can be useful towards such a defense. One could write notes to the other guy or involve LEO as desired. IMO, if this was the issue, the first post would have been worded differently.

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            • #51
              Not to Hi-jack the thread.......But a related question..? If you found wooden tree stand this year that was "NOT" being used (Yes, in the National Forest it's existence is Illegal) and you registered the location this year or next year, and used the location and the tree stand, with no conflict from any past user.

              Now the Question: As the last user would you be responsible for dismantling the stand at the end of the season. Note: You did not build it, and it was truly abandoned. By virtue of using it are you responsible for it removal. This question is in NOWAY related to the Original Poster.

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              • #52
                I don't condone what happened. It is your stuff. Would it be unethical? In my opinion, yes. However, page 27 of the regualtions: "You must remove bait, litter and equipment from the bairt station site when hunting is completed, this includes any contaminated soil." If you left it out there, then you abandon it. I have come across sites in the past. Some are obviously organized and cleaned up, equipment organized and covered and people will be back. A lot are also obviously just abandon with it looking like people just walked away at the end of the season. I don't know what your site looked like and I am not going to judge. If however, you did not leave the equipment and then registered the site, then "You may not intentionally obstruct or hinder a bait statiions registrant's feasibility of taking game by using the station without registrant's written permission." If you left it out there and someone claimed it, set up a bait station and properly registered it, there might be little you can legally do. One thought is that you registered the site 1 April. When did the other's register the site? If you did it first, then it should be your site. To me both sides are not in the right, you left it out there and someone claimed it, so perhaps you can work it out and get your equipment back. I hope so.

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                • #53
                  Stolen gear? Possibly. Stolen stand? No.
                  "Ya can't stop a bad guy with a middle finger and a bag of quarters!!!!"- Ted Nugent.

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by AGL4now View Post
                    Not to Hi-jack the thread.......But a related question..? If you found wooden tree stand this year that was "NOT" being used (Yes, in the National Forest it's existence is Illegal) and you registered the location this year or next year, and used the location and the tree stand, with no conflict from any past user.

                    Now the Question: As the last user would you be responsible for dismantling the stand at the end of the season. Note: You did not build it, and it was truly abandoned. By virtue of using it are you responsible for it removal. This question is in NOWAY related to the Original Poster.
                    To begin with, why would you want to use/remove someone's station whether placed there legally or not. Assuming you do the right thing and don't use the station, you'd have no responsibility to remove it. I can see benefits for LEO to use such a set-up as any communication or activity associated with the station would help with their case. Unfortunately, such efforts from a common source may be frustrating to LEO's manpower. But I would not be surprised if they did not check up on stations that had multiple reports or a history of reported illegal activity.

                    The other guy should be using his own barrel, not Archer Bob's Barrel, hence they both are now in a pickle. Anyone know the fine associated with not removing a station by the required date. How about the fine associated with setting up too early.

                    For ArcherBob: its his equipment. While he didn't get to the site because of the snow, but when he did get there, someone was using his equipment, the other guy is illegal as he is using other people's equipment (whether there legally or illegally). Technically speaking, if the equipment was not taken down before the end of last season, then perhaps:
                    1) he would remove the station from the field in its entirety (taking photo documentation along the way for potential future defense).
                    2) Then a few days later, reset the station somewhere to avoid any perception of an early advantage into that area or of "storage in the field" (taking photo documentation along the way for future defense and so as to avoid the appearance of additional illegal activity).
                    Although a bit inconvenient, just suggesting this approach so as to limit the "potential" accumulation of multiple different fines.

                    AGL4now: IMO, if you really want to work with LEO, one could record the ticket number and take photos of the station. If the station is not tore down by such and such date, then turn over the photos and ticket number to LEO. Perhaps LEO will follow-up and execute enforcement. If you start removing the stands, IMO you do not have permission from the registered owner and would be guilty of illegal activity yourself. (kind of parallels issues associated with checking or removing someone else's crab pots). Unless you are LEO or have permission from the owner, just don't do it. Unfortunately, these sort of things have a way of escalating, so rather than position oneself in the wrath of a potentially disgruntled hunter(s) or burden the LEO with more duties, hope you find a better way of dealing with your concerns.

                    We all are not perfect. When out and about, I'll pick up litter (cans, paper) but don't mess with people's caches (barrels, tarps, tents, cabins, machines, or other gear). Hopefully, a little humility, tactfulness will help avoid escalation of ill will or illegal activity.

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Wet eNuf View Post

                      AGL4now: IMO, if you really want to work with LEO, one could record the ticket number and take photos of the station. If the station is not tore down by such and such date, then turn over the photos and ticket number to LEO. Perhaps LEO will follow-up and execute enforcement. If you start removing the stands, IMO you do not have permission from the registered owner and would be guilty of illegal activity yourself. (kind of parallels issues associated with checking or removing someone else's crab pots). Unless you are LEO or have permission from the owner, just don't do it. Unfortunately, these sort of things have a way of escalating, so rather than position oneself in the wrath of a potentially disgruntled hunter(s) or burden the LEO with more duties, hope you find a better way of dealing with your concerns.
                      Wow, I thought I made my question Clear: Tree stand has been in the tree for 600 years, OK original builder Dead. You find Wooden tree stand and use same. Question: Buy the act of using the tree stand which has not been used since before baiting was legal in Alaska, does the act of using compel you to be responsible for the removal of said stand at the end of the season......?????

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                      • #56
                        What's the purpose to mess with someone else's tree stand regardless of it's tenure? I'm assuming you have reason to believe the tree stand has evidence of alteration by past humans. Perhaps, the stand is of archeological significance? Disturbing such artifact is likely illegal.

                        But every situation is likely to be different.

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Wet eNuf View Post
                          What's the purpose to mess with someone else's tree stand regardless of it's tenure? I'm assuming you have reason to believe the tree stand has evidence of alteration by past humans. Perhaps, the stand is of archeological significance? Disturbing such artifact is likely illegal.

                          But every situation is likely to be different.
                          You sure have trouble with a straight forward question......? I can't make it any simpler for you, so I'll hope someone else has a useful opinion.

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by AGL4now View Post
                            You sure have trouble with a straight forward question......? I can't make it any simpler for you, so I'll hope someone else has a useful opinion.
                            My honest answer is, no, I would not feel compelled to remove the stand, but I would feel compelled to leave the area in at least as good of condition as I found it.

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                            • #59
                              If the previous answer was too much of a riddle, I would say no... LOL, I stepped into your trap. I've previously stated that I would not use the stand, whereas you direct the question based on the assumption that I would. Kind of like those simple and unanswerable attorney questions, have you stopped beating your wife? Therefore, the questions and answers may seem non-sequitor.

                              I agree with frostbitten. Additionally, just because one finds a stand out there outside the bear baiting season doesn't mean its illegal.

                              Back on point with the thread and to avoid a pissing contest, IMO if someone desires to set up on station where equipment is present, they should bring in and use their own equipment. For comparison, if a person used someone else's crab pots without their permission, they would be in violation. Just because a person used someone's pots doesn't make them their property when they are done. Hope that makes sense to you.

                              Perhaps, this bear baiting thing has been less enforced, but the legal enforcement aspects would not be surprising to me.

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                              • #60
                                if you take over an abandoned tree stand then yes it is now your responsibility to remove at the end of the season. Building structures in the woods is where alot of the problem is. whoever registers the site first has that spot that season. If someone moves in on a posted spot then they have the right to take severe actions. I ran into to baiters out by where I bait and they kept saying my spot and my stand and I built it years ago and blah blah blah. until this year hadn't seen a baiter anywhere near me in the last three years. I think they just need to stop people from building these structures and alot of these problems would go away. After I get hits and hang my stands i better not catch anyone sitting in them.

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