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Idea for dealing with Foreign Poachers

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  • Idea for dealing with Foreign Poachers

    I'm presenting this idea to you on this forum since I technically am not an Alaskan citizen, though I am an Alaskan property owner...and thus have a stake in the Alaskan fisheries...okay, onto the subject at hand:

    My Dad came up with this idea last year after witnessing multiple violations from various German, Swiss, and French fishermen. Please understand that I am not a rascist or bigot, and for stating this idea I am ready to be called every name in the book and run out of this forum forever, since my idea is probably not "politically correct". That is the price I may pay, and I am willing to do so. And I acknowlegde that plenty of Americans violate the rules on a consistent basis. Although, in my 14+ years of combat fishing experience, I've never seen a group (stereotype coming soon) of fishermen that violate the fishing laws like the Germans, Swiss, and French typically do. Vast overlimits, possession violations, and snagging/keeping seem to be the most prevelant issues that occur with these folks. Not to mention that a lot of these folks are selling their catch back in Europe, which I believe is against the law for the rest of us to do.

    Anyways, my Dad's idea was that any foreigner that is issued a game violation would not be allowed back into the state to fish/hunt ever again, period. Whether their name/passport goes on a list and they are denied a license or denied entry into the state/country, somehow they should be penalized with a meaningful penalty to discourage them and others from willful violations. Now, I know that this may seem harsh to many, and some of you will get all excited because it would be unfair, since Americans just get a ticket and can go back to fishing the next day....blah blah blah. Certainly, I feel that Americans should also face some sort of penalty, but from my experience the foreign groups that I mentioned at times seem almost to operate in a clandestine effort to rob the Alaskan fisheries. I've have many of them confide to me that they receive a substantial price (somewhere around $100+/plate...euros maybe?) for their fillets back in European Restuarants.

    Thus, my Dad's idea was for a grassroots campaign to contact Alaskan Senators and Congressman to lobby for the idea of blacklisting foreign fish and game violators. Sorry for the longwinded lead-up to a simple idea.

    Okay, let the games begin.

    Sockeye Pete

  • #2
    Poaching Foreigners

    I too have seen this same thing happen and it's not just with Germans, Swiss, and Frenchman, there are others that are just as bad to include Americans. I've tried to say something to them when I see that happen but all they do is give you a dumb look like they don't understand you, but I know they do. Your idea sounds like a good start in the right direction but it does seem a bit harsh. Your right though, something needs to be done about it. It kills me seeing other people so blatantly break the law and nothing is done about it. I have the Fish and Game violation hotline # saved on my c/p so I can call them when i see it happen, I suggest that everyone else do the same.

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    • #3
      I like the idea, too , but "forever, period" is a bit harsh. How about one full salmon life cycle... a science-based punishment to mitigate for their misdeeds. In this techno world, it would be easy enough to get those violations in the licensing database. Violation shows up for the next seven years and no license sold to the violator.

      For the habitual violators (US citizens included), the fines should be squared for a repeat offense, and cubed for a third time offense.

      Example 1st time $50, second offense $2500, and third time $125,000.
      "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
      sigpic
      The KeenEye MD

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      • #4
        I don't see it as being based on country of origin, and I'm sure there are many foreign visitors that do an excellent job of obeying the fishing regs. Also by definition poaching is taking fish or game in a forbidden area, so catching over the limit is not poaching.

        So getting down to the real issue, ie exceeding the limit, is the punishment and enforcement sufficient? I'd say a year suspension of license and forfeiture of gear as a pretty good sentence, no matter whether the person is from a foreign country or an Alsakan resident.
        Those that are successful in Alaska are those who are flexible, and allow the reality of life in Alaska to shape their dreams, vs. trying to force their dreams on the reality of Alaska.

        If you have a tenuous grasp of reality, Alaska is not for you.

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        • #5
          So if you catch 3 reds and you keep fishing, aren't those waters considered forbidden until the next day?

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          • #6
            Hadn't looked at it an that light. It's not that I condone game violations or folks going over the limit, rather that I found the title of the thread slightly inflamatory.
            Those that are successful in Alaska are those who are flexible, and allow the reality of life in Alaska to shape their dreams, vs. trying to force their dreams on the reality of Alaska.

            If you have a tenuous grasp of reality, Alaska is not for you.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by AkHunter45
              So if you catch 3 reds and you keep fishing, aren't those waters considered forbidden until the next day?
              Can't you catch & release (except for kings) after keeping your limit? Or fish for other species (trout, dollies)?

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              • #8
                Who is letting the French in anyway?

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                • #9
                  First Issue sounds good, but I would make this apply to evreyone including Alaskans. This way it will not become a racial or international incident.

                  Second you may keep fishing for reds catch and release, but if for some reason that fish dies it becomes yours and if you have 3 already now you just went over your limit.
                  Living the Alaskan Dream
                  Gary Keller
                  Anchorage, AK

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                  • #10
                    If they look at you with a dumb look...

                    when you confront about snagging etc, simply whip out the cell phone and call the fish cops or video them. Maybe that will prompt some ethics....or maybe "nyet".
                    Proud to be an American!

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                    • #11
                      I had understood that, according to new EU standards, foreign fishermen and hunters have a very difficult time bringing fish and game into their countries. I know it was a concern for some guides and outfitters.

                      I personally have run into more problems with people who appear to be from the orient abusing fish and taking more than their one salmon at Ninilchik. They do this by going back up to their rental RV's and changing clothes, I guess assuming that the average white guy won't be able to tell the difference.

                      Then you got your Rooskies at the Fishin' Hole, but that's another story.

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                      • #12
                        Cheaters come in many colors... so do Corkies and Spin-N-Glo's.

                        (sorry couldn't resist!)
                        "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
                        sigpic
                        The KeenEye MD

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Great idea

                          Originally posted by AkHunter45
                          I too have seen this same thing happen and it's not just with Germans, Swiss, and Frenchman, there are others that are just as bad to include Americans. I've tried to say something to them when I see that happen but all they do is give you a dumb look like they don't understand you, but I know they do. Your idea sounds like a good start in the right direction but it does seem a bit harsh. Your right though, something needs to be done about it. It kills me seeing other people so blatantly break the law and nothing is done about it. I have the Fish and Game violation hotline # saved on my c/p so I can call them when i see it happen, I suggest that everyone else do the same.
                          Great idea. I will take that advice. What is the number--I'll plug it in right now!
                          Hike faster. I hear banjo music.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Penalties

                            Any and all penalties doled out, to Aliens should be consistant and exactly as what an alien to their country of origin would be if the incident happened there. It would be very easy for F&G to query the appropriate country's judicial system and find out what the max penalty is for the exact or as reasonably similar in nature. I have a hunch, the penalties would be much stiffer than what Alaska and America in general dole out. The Alien would not have a gripe, because it would be based on laws they are responsible to at home. This concept should be applied to all Fish and Game violations.
                            "96% of all Internet Quotes are suspect and the remaining 4% are fiction."
                            ~~Abraham Lincoln~~

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                            • #15
                              The problem with any new regs will be the same problem with existing regs. They aren't enforced. I can't count how many times I motor past foreigners at Alexander Creek and see three guys in the boat, three fish on a stringer in the water, and three lines in the water. I watch ADF&G biologists motor right past them, and I've seen troopers motor right past them, and they don't do a **** thing.

                              For certain species in certain areas, foreigners should be required to fish with a registered guide, period. That would be easy to police, it would be good for the economy, and it would protect the resource.

                              We need our bonehead government to bring the Brownshirts back. No Fish & Wildlife enforcement is a poacher's dream.

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