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  • Proof of Traditional and Customary Use

    Check this out, subsistence fans. Is 1914 far enough back to qualify?

    http://content.lib.washington.edu/cd...SOBOX=1&REC=12

    Last edited by gr8fl; 03-14-2011, 15:19. Reason: because the Whop does

  • #2
    Ah, Fullbush is gonna have a cow!!! LMFAO. I like the picture dated 1934 that was submitted in 2008 at the BOF as an RC. It shows a native guy using a net made of alder and stitched together with leather strips, looks almost like todays dipnets. That was an eye opener too!!!
    If a dipnetter dips a fish and there is no one around to see/hear it, Did he really dip? ALASKADIPNETTING.NET

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    • #3
      More proof

      How about this one? The caption says they've been doing it like this for thousands of years.

      http://www.nps.gov/history/history/o...is1/chap1c.htm

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      • #4
        Heck, I think that is the one that was entered into the record!!! I thought it was a guy but I guess dipping back then was women's work. So much for flip-flopping duties!!! Keep em coming!!!
        If a dipnetter dips a fish and there is no one around to see/hear it, Did he really dip? ALASKADIPNETTING.NET

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        • #5
          1919

          Abercrombie Canyon, Copper River, 1919
          I think that's a white guy.

          http://content.lib.washington.edu/cd...ISOBOX=1&REC=3


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          • #6
            1917

            Copper River, 1917

            Is that a double or a triple or a ...?


            http://content.lib.washington.edu/cd...ISOBOX=1&REC=4



            Last edited by gr8fl; 03-14-2011, 15:59. Reason: for political correctness

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            • #7
              Rep points coming your way, right after I spread the love!!!
              If a dipnetter dips a fish and there is no one around to see/hear it, Did he really dip? ALASKADIPNETTING.NET

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              • #8
                1919

                Abercrombie Canyon, Copper River, 1919

                http://content.lib.washington.edu/cd...ISOBOX=1&REC=7

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                • #9
                  More industrious methods






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                  • #10
                    hey gr8fl I see you've been doing some sleuthing. Like most tourists that relocated to the Rabbit Creek area you're just a little inaccurate and mis-informed in your racial profiling of the Ahtna Natives. I have cousins that are Aleuts and they have blond hair and blue eyes. Maybe you should check some factual lineage of this state I'm from before you go assuming anything. Maybe you should also refer to the dipnet wish list- here I'll do it for you--

                    03-15-2010 #9
                    fullbush
                    Member

                    Join Date
                    Feb 2010
                    Location
                    Wasilla
                    Posts
                    1,762

                    17. I wish the board would for once consider my proposal to open the culvert of Rabbit creek at Potters Marsh to dipping. I once got a ticket when I was 10 for dipping humpys there so I have historical and traditional usage documentation....
                    18.I wish the ADF&G enforcement guys would let me hang 8" mesh into my dipnet, You know so I didn't get any incidental trout
                    19. I wish a Fairbanks attorney would PM in regards to number 17 and 18 W/ your logic then I should be able to get my subsistence out of Rabbit Creek.


                    Also heres another ditty for ya, those people that are in the pictures you presented, lived there thats why they were eligible for subsistence. They aren't some tourist from rabbit creek in his motorhome
                    sigpic




                    I'm taking a poll
                    <--------click this star if you think I should run for Gov

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by fullbush View Post
                      Like most tourists that relocated to the Rabbit Creek area ...
                      Well, only part tourist with my 1975 19' Class C motorhome parked out at the garden. The other part of me was born here pre-statehood. Now I did relocate from Anchorage to Juneau to Girdwood to Sitka to Rabbit Creek, so you do have that part right.

                      Originally posted by fullbush View Post
                      I have cousins that are Aleuts and they have blond hair and blue eyes.
                      Sure that's possible. Recessive genes in both parents who probably have Russian in their family tree. And I do see that you were there when this picture was taken, so I stand corrected.



                      ~tr

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                      • #12
                        And here I thought that was Hem's boat. Just thought he downsided to one just a bit smaller than he had then.
                        Hey FB, see... you have admitted to dipnetting. Just now coming out of the proverbial closet? Glad to see you have come over to the Dark side!!! Pack up your motorhome and come join the rest of us. HAHAHA
                        If a dipnetter dips a fish and there is no one around to see/hear it, Did he really dip? ALASKADIPNETTING.NET

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          This thread cracked me up. FB, thewhop2000, and gr8fl I feel like you guys should have something on TV like a presidential debate. I'd watch it. Not saying you guys should be politicians, just saying you guys discussing fish topics would be worth watching.

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                          • #14
                            More industrious methods

                            Originally posted by gr8fl View Post





                            Are you, by considering the above "industrious methods", in favor of fish traps and wholesale blockage of salmon runs?


                            There are a few notable differences between the archival images you've posted and todays dipnetter.

                            First of all, there isn't an R.V. in sight. Secondly as 'Bush noted the folks doing the netting are residents of that watershed. Also, it'd be a fair assumption that most of those salmon being caught where consumed by those doing the catching, not smoked, jarred, and shipped of as gifts.

                            Likewise you can more than likely bet that the folks netting those fish weren't self deluded into believing that those salmon where more theirs than, say, their brethren downriver, or the commercial vessels offshore.

                            Still getting over the idea that fish traps are considered "industrious", thats like saying a gas chamber was "efficient".....
                            “Life has become immeasurably better since I have been forced to stop taking it seriously.” ― H.S.T.
                            "Character is how you treat those who can do nothing for you."

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by AlaskaHippie View Post
                              ", thats like saying a gas chamber was "efficient".....

                              Well they were, in truth that is.

                              But on your other issue.

                              As for the dippers and subsistence issues, there is in reality so little subsistence left in Alaska its not funny. Wanton waste is more the issue then who has first dibs at it. Always has been, always will be. The copper and the Kenai should have the same limit, for Personal use, and a permit for one OR the other, not both. The waste that goes on between them is disgusting.


                              It is a little funny to me to see the same old argument, on a site i found last week, that has been playing out here the last half a century or longer. At least as i am aware.
                              squab (probably of Scandinavian descent; skvabb, meaning "loose, fat flesh") is a young domestic pigeon or its meat

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