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Thread: RUNNING THE GAUNTLET.... "must see" vid

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    Member fishNphysician's Avatar
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    Default RUNNING THE GAUNTLET.... "must see" vid

    "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
    http://www.piscatorialpursuits.com/uploads/UP12710.jpg
    The KeenEye MD

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    Member c6 batmobile's Avatar
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    That was pretty good. Its amazing what just removing a **** can do for the salmon. They bounce back pretty good they just need a little help from us getting their obstacles removed.

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    Moderator bkmail's Avatar
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    Good video, thanks for posting.
    BK

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    Member c6 batmobile's Avatar
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    just for reference the word in my post was d a m s. nothing dirty. dont know why it blocked it.

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    Yeah, I watched it on Sunday on PBS. Nature always has great shows. It is hard to believe that the government is actually having to pay a bounty to fishermen to catch pike minnows in order to prevent salmon fry from getting eaten. It is even harder to believe that the government is actually shipping the salmon fry on barges downriver to the ocean because the salmon can't do it themselves due to the hydroelectric dams. Maybe Alaskans will be smart and learn from the mistakes of others. Pretty pathetic.

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    Member fishNphysician's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bushwhack Jack View Post
    Maybe Alaskans will be smart and learn from the mistakes of others. Pretty pathetic.
    Precisely why I posted it here.

    The industrial worldview in the PNW royally f'd up the greatest salmon superhighway the world has ever seen.

    Don't think it can't happen in AK.

    A mine here, a dam there, a little in-stream re-routing... what could it possibly hurt? Besides, we can just fix it all with a hatchery, right?

    That's exactly what the kingdom of industrial resource extractors would like Joe Q Public to believe.

    Don't buy into the insanity!

    History is speaking loud and clear.... we just need to listen.
    "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
    http://www.piscatorialpursuits.com/uploads/UP12710.jpg
    The KeenEye MD

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    I think the worst problem with Columbia Basin Salmon is the Turns and Cormorants at the mouth of the Columbia, Millions of smolt are destroyed every year by these predators, These birds are not native in these number at this location, and I think they should be eliminated from the area. Remove the manmade islands and let the fish have a chance to make it to the ocean. The fish and game barge the lunch to the birds, what a waste, the more smolts barged, the more birds are hatched. Put a few raccoons on each island during nesting season, then trap the rest and get rid of them. Do not try to relocate them, what a pipe dream, they will still eat the smolts. The ODFW thinks that building an Island in Fern Ridge reservoir near Eugene will solve the problem, The dinner table is in the Columbia, and the birds will not leave just because ODFW thinks they can make a better island. Yes the dams contribute to the demise of the salmon, but the birds are doing the most damage. I agree when will Alaska get struck by the dollar bill, forget the fish, and collect the dollars. The same thing could happen in Alaska with the Pike if they are not stopped.
    Last edited by Gerberman; 05-04-2011 at 18:53. Reason: add to

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    Member fishNphysician's Avatar
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    Funny you mention about relocating the birds.

    The alternative plan to making them another nesting site further removed from the CR estuary was to relocate the Caspian terns to Willapa Bay and/or Grays Harbor.

    Now thems fightin' words right there! NIMBY dammit!

    We've got a handful of 'em that show up every spring/summer as it is. I dread the day an actual Caspian tern colony takes hold in Grays Harbor.

    As for the cormorants... it's already too late. Dirty bass turds already found us. Giant flocks of several thousand birds apiece are a common sight passing overhead these days.
    "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
    http://www.piscatorialpursuits.com/uploads/UP12710.jpg
    The KeenEye MD

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    Quote Originally Posted by fishNphysician View Post
    As for the cormorants... it's already too late. Dirty bass turds already found us. Giant flocks of several thousand birds apiece are a common sight passing overhead these days.
    The walleye population in Leech Lake Minnesota was nearly devasted by cormorants. The DNR allowed the killing of these birds and the walleye population has rebounded nicely. Also in Minnesota, bait dealers that have rearing ponds for their minnows are allowed to kill cormorants at will. You're right Doc, dirty bass turds.

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    Member Gerberman's Avatar
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    I think they need to be removed not relocated. Transfer the birds and the problem goes with them. Again the Pike in Alaska are the unseen future problem. Need to get rid of them not catch and release.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tcman View Post
    The walleye population in Leech Lake Minnesota was nearly devasted by cormorants. The DNR allowed the killing of these birds and the walleye population has rebounded nicely. Also in Minnesota, bait dealers that have rearing ponds for their minnows are allowed to kill cormorants at will. You're right Doc, dirty bass turds.
    You are spot on. they killed 93% of the cormorants and the walleye rebounded VERY nicely. I think i may have some pics on my computer of the fish they found in their guts and its no wonder the walleye crashed. As for the bird problem its very easily fixed with a shot gun

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    While the cormorants are a problem, I think the point that the video makes is that the damming of the rivers is really inhibiting the outflow of smolt. Main issue (that was only briefly alluded to) is that we would have to come up with alternative sources of energy, whatever they may be, to replace some of the output from those dams...

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    Quote Originally Posted by fishNphysician View Post
    Precisely why I posted it here.

    The industrial worldview in the PNW royally f'd up the greatest salmon superhighway the world has ever seen.

    Don't think it can't happen in AK.

    A mine here, a dam there, a little in-stream re-routing... what could it possibly hurt? Besides, we can just fix it all with a hatchery, right?

    That's exactly what the kingdom of industrial resource extractors would like Joe Q Public to believe.

    Don't buy into the insanity!

    History is speaking loud and clear.... we just need to listen.
    Doc
    Those words should be written in every who loves salmons hearts. That is exactly how it happens. It happens one small peice at at time. I personaly would like to see every inch of salmon stream protected forever.

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    Member fishNphysician's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gerberman View Post
    I think the worst problem with Columbia Basin Salmon is the Turns and Cormorants at the mouth of the Columbia, Millions of smolt are destroyed every year by these predators, These birds are not native in these number at this location, and I think they should be eliminated from the area.
    I think someone heard your request....

    Bald eagles to the rescue!

    http://www.ifish.net/board/showthread.php?t=364081
    "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
    http://www.piscatorialpursuits.com/uploads/UP12710.jpg
    The KeenEye MD

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    Are they thinking of a hydroelectric dam on the Big Su?
    Hike faster. I hear banjo music.

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    Member fishNphysician's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildog View Post
    Are they thinking of a hydroelectric dam on the Big Su?


    Queue up to 4:50 to see what a big concrete wall on the Big Su might look like.
    "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
    http://www.piscatorialpursuits.com/uploads/UP12710.jpg
    The KeenEye MD

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    Member c6 batmobile's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fishNphysician View Post


    Queue up to 4:50 to see what a big concrete wall on the Big Su might look like.
    yuck. hope that doesnt happen.

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    Member MNViking's Avatar
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    I would just like to bring up an opposing viewpoint. Salmon are a "rich man's fish" to many. Generally speaking, it is cheaper for the majority of people to get farmed salmon, or choose some other source of protein. Individually harvesting fish for personal consumption is a luxury for most. I would wager that the vast majority of the anti-industry, pro-salmon advocates are middle to upper class Americans, and this class is growing smaller every day. I know many people that find conservationists, like our good doc here, to be elitist. In fact, in a cruel twist, the continued blocking of industrial development prevents more people from having the extra resources to be able to enjoy salmon fishing, so in saving the salmon, we are eliminating supporters.

    I would like to see a strictly economical comparison of the value of a salmon stream and a hydroelectric dam/mine from an unbiased source. Denying the construction of dam's, mines, and other industrial infrastructure to save salmon streams may very well be an economic net negative.

    For the record, I am an extreme moderate. I think that we have the will and the way to find compromises. I am pro-salmon because I can afford to drive to the Russian and back for two fish. I just wanted to bring up an opposing viewpoint. I find one sided discussions to be boring and for the most part, unproductive. Didn't mean to pick on you either Doc, just wanted to make a point.
    Finally, Brad Childress is GONE!

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    Member coho slayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildog View Post
    Are they thinking of a hydroelectric dam on the Big Su?
    They aren't just thinking about it. It's Parnell's pet project right now. My dad is a fisheries biologist and he's on the senior advisory board for this thing. The administration is going to really try to push this through.

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    Member fishNphysician's Avatar
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    The welfare of wild salmon has taken a back seat to economic gain and societal convenience for as long as Euro-American man and salmon have co-existed.... from a thousand years ago in the Old Country to a few centuries back on the US East Coast to the past century on the US West Coast.

    When you figure the billions of dollars spent on salmon recovery on the Columbia River, and the monumental loss of salmon-related economic activity in the region, all of a sudden all that "cheap" electricity ain't so cheap.
    "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
    http://www.piscatorialpursuits.com/uploads/UP12710.jpg
    The KeenEye MD

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