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Thread: 270 vs 284...lets argue:):)

  1. #1

    Default 270 vs 284...lets argue:):)

    I've been a 270 fan since way back in the 70's. It's just what I cut my eye teeth on. I know it works! If I do my job it never fails to produce a dead critter!

    I know we got some of those 284/7mm nuts on this forum that seem to think that their 7mm's are the shiznuts! So what I want you to do is to learn me why? What makes the 7mm's majic?

    If you're convincing enough then I might just buy one! It could be that I already got one spied and just need a little of your logic to push me over the edge!

    My particular debate deals with a certain 270 WSM vs a 7mm WSM....which one to get?

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    Quote Originally Posted by elmerkeithclone View Post
    I've been a 270 fan since way back in the 70's. It's just what I cut my eye teeth on. I know it works! If I do my job it never fails to produce a dead critter!

    I know we got some of those 284/7mm nuts on this forum that seem to think that their 7mm's are the shiznuts! So what I want you to do is to learn me why? What makes the 7mm's majic?

    If you're convincing enough then I might just buy one! It could be that I already got one spied and just need a little of your logic to push me over the edge!

    My particular debate deals with a certain 270 WSM vs a 7mm WSM....which one to get?
    I wouldnít consider either one, because Iíve heard so many discouraging reports about the WSM cartridges..

    Of course, not everyone has experienced the difficulties in handloading them, the feeding problems, and pressure signs with Factory Loads.

    As to the difference in caliber, .277 vs. .284, the 284 has more surface on the base, and at the same pressure, with the same bullet weight, you might gain a tiny bit more velocity, plus Iíd jist about betcha, that there are more 7mm bullets available than 270.

    I suggest a 280 Rem., Itís a great performer. But, be sure your scope is mounted high enough, because itíll boot you quite a bit more than a 243.

    Smitty of the North
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    Smitty of the North, you helped me alot with the troubles I was having with my 270 WSM but after solving those I have no criticisms of WSM cartridges at all - they feed well, they are efficient as proven with PPC and BR rounds years prior - I have fallen in lust with my 270 WSM but I used to be a died in the wool 7mm "man" - "IF" you are gonna handload the 7mm WSM would be alright but for some reason unknown to me the 7mm hasn't been as popular as the 270/300/325 WSM, at least from what I see - I don't think you would go wrong with either but the fact that the 270 WSM will darn near match the 270 Weatherby and in a lightweight more handy rifle is all I need - Now, if a sweet deal on a 7mm WSM that I really "needed" came past I will admit that I would be a bidder

  4. #4

    Wink

    Don't drink their Kool-Aide EKC!!!! We .270 guys don't need to give them any more chances to spread their hooey!

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    Member La Pine's Avatar
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    I have a Remington 721 270cal and its one shot one kill. Well most of the time, as its only as good as I am lol. Have a good day!
    May God Bless The USA!
    If you don't study and understand history, your doomed to repeat it!

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    I think you can throw the 270, 280, 7MMMag, 270WSM, 7WSM all in a pile and read ballistic charts and tech data till your eyes cross and it won't mean doodly squat!
    Bottom line is the 280 is the best of the 270 and 7MMMag features combined into a superb round that just makes the owner of one ( or more ) walk with that aire of confidence and satisfaction of owning the best there is!
    I looked at the WSM's and just can't get excited - to me fat ctgs just don't look right - besides some say if ya consistantly spank em out at max velocity your likely to erode the throat pretty fast if your a target puncher - like 1000 rounds maybe??? I Dunno???
    Think of it this way EKC - on prom night you coulda:
    A took out the ugly girl that was "friendly"
    B took out the good lookin "country gal" that would make ya feel good
    C or took out the high maint cheerleader that would dump ya for a chance at your buddy the QB
    Now, the 280 is like B - looks good, feels good, and just keeps lovin ya no matter how ruff ya get!

    The 280 to me just gives you all a 7mm round can give ya in performance without taking the next leap making it into a sharp recoiling more shooter punishing round like a 7Mag or WSM can do....
    When asked what state I live in I say "The State of Confusion", better known as IL....

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    I've "felled" more than a few animals with both calibers (.277 & .284) and if there is anything to choose between them for big game inside 400 yards I've yet to find it. However when ranges get stretched there is simply no comparison--the .284 has significantly higher B.C. bullets. .277 bullets hover around .500 at the top end and .284 projectiles are readily available over .600 (20% improvement). So when you compare the same class cartridge, i.e 270 vs. 280, 270 WSM vs. 7 WSM, 270 Weatherby vs. 7 RM, you find the .284 cartridges have a flatter trajectory and less wind drift with the same recoil and rifle weight than the .277 counterpart. It's as close to a free lunch as you can get in ballistics. There is no denying the superiority of the B.C. of .284 projectiles, but that fact is moot at the range that most guys use their rifles. At common hunting ranges they (.277 & .284) are like the two proverbial peas in a pod.

    I've a much loved 270 Winchester that I hunt with and shoot quite a bit, but I'll not buy another. The .284 clan is simply a better choice in my case.
    Foolishness is a moral category, not an intellectual one.

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    Member t-storm's Avatar
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    people lobby for what THEY are shooting. its all rubbish, the sheep don't care.
    Quote Originally Posted by elmerkeithclone View Post
    I've been a 270 fan since way back in the 70's. It's just what I cut my eye teeth on. I know it works! If I do my job it never fails to produce a dead critter!

    I know we got some of those 284/7mm nuts on this forum that seem to think that their 7mm's are the shiznuts! So what I want you to do is to learn me why? What makes the 7mm's majic?

    If you're convincing enough then I might just buy one! It could be that I already got one spied and just need a little of your logic to push me over the edge!

    My particular debate deals with a certain 270 WSM vs a 7mm WSM....which one to get?

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smitty of the North View Post
    I wouldnít consider either one, because Iíve heard so many discouraging reports about the WSM cartridges..

    I've been reading lots of good stuff on the forums lately in regards to the WSMs!

    Of course, not everyone has experienced the difficulties in handloading them, the feeding problems, and pressure signs with Factory Loads.

    The WSM cartridge design is one the promotes very effecient powder burn and most of the negative stuff...feeding is pointed at Kimber rifles! Most guys with the push, control round feed Winchesters have no problems!

    As to the difference in caliber, .277 vs. .284, the 284 has more surface on the base, and at the same pressure, with the same bullet weight, you might gain a tiny bit more velocity, plus Iíd jist about betcha, that there are more 7mm bullets available than 270.

    I only have one load for any given gun.. So as long as somebody makes a good 140-150 grainer I'm good!












    I suggest a 280 Rem., Itís a great performer. But, be sure your scope is mounted high enough, because itíll boot you quite a bit more than a 243.

    Gotta keep it low Smitty...I gotta short neck!

    Smitty of the North
    Thanks Smitty

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smokey View Post
    I think you can throw the 270, 280, 7MMMag, 270WSM, 7WSM all in a pile and read ballistic charts and tech data till your eyes cross and it won't mean doodly squat!
    Bottom line is the 280 is the best of the 270 and 7MMMag features combined into a superb round that just makes the owner of one ( or more ) walk with that aire of confidence and satisfaction of owning the best there is!
    I looked at the WSM's and just can't get excited - to me fat ctgs just don't look right - besides some say if ya consistantly spank em out at max velocity your likely to erode the throat pretty fast if your a target puncher - like 1000 rounds maybe??? I Dunno???
    Think of it this way EKC - on prom night you coulda:
    A took out the ugly girl that was "friendly"
    B took out the good lookin "country gal" that would make ya feel good
    C or took out the high maint cheerleader that would dump ya for a chance at your buddy the QB
    Now, the 280 is like B - looks good, feels good, and just keeps lovin ya no matter how ruff ya get!

    The 280 to me just gives you all a 7mm round can give ya in performance without taking the next leap making it into a sharp recoiling more shooter punishing round like a 7Mag or WSM can do....
    It's real hard to find any fault with the 280(don't tell Smitty I said that...he'll use it against me). From what I'm hearing the recoil difference between the 280 and WSM is almost nil.

    Ya know what...my wife was the head cheer leader and the Home Coming Queen and she still cooks what I kill. She turned out to be a whole lot less maintenance than I thought I was buying into.... maybe the WSM will surprise me too!

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by 1Cor15:19 View Post
    I've "felled" more than a few animals with both calibers (.277 & .284) and if there is anything to choose between them for big game inside 400 yards I've yet to find it. However when ranges get stretched there is simply no comparison--the .284 has significantly higher B.C. bullets. .277 bullets hover around .500 at the top end and .284 projectiles are readily available over .600 (20% improvement). So when you compare the same class cartridge, i.e 270 vs. 280, 270 WSM vs. 7 WSM, 270 Weatherby vs. 7 RM, you find the .284 cartridges have a flatter trajectory and less wind drift with the same recoil and rifle weight than the .277 counterpart. It's as close to a free lunch as you can get in ballistics. There is no denying the superiority of the B.C. of .284 projectiles, but that fact is moot at the range that most guys use their rifles. At common hunting ranges they (.277 & .284) are like the two proverbial peas in a pod.

    I've a much loved 270 Winchester that I hunt with and shoot quite a bit, but I'll not buy another. The .284 clan is simply a better choice in my case.
    Now there! I think you hit the nail on the head! I loved my 270 but for the reasons you stated, I'm considering moving on!

    Pretty convincing!

    Also there is a chance that this gun could be my only ever long range thumper....paper punching and windy day, late season coyote getter. A coyote is the only animal that I will shoot at when the distance gets greater than 400 yards!

  12. #12
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    Pick either. The field performance will be identical and the ballistic differences too minuscule to mention. This is one of those examples where some folks tend to over think and point out measly performance differences. They are both great cartridges, and just too similiar too matter. I remember reading in one of the reloading manuals where some guy was claiming that some .257 caliber was "ballisticly superior" to a 243 and I just think to myself.........wow.....talk about over thinking. Now if you were comparing a 280 Rem to a 35 Whelen......that's a substantial difference worthy of conversation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mainer_in_ak View Post
    Pick either. The field performance will be identical and the ballistic differences too minuscule to mention. This is one of those examples where some folks tend to over think and point out measly performance differences. They are both great cartridges, and just too similiar too matter...
    At most ranges you are absolutely correct mainer, but what advantage there is lies firmly on the .284 side. When comparing the ballistics between the cartridges the elevation is not substantially different, but with readily available bullets the 7 WSM will shoot significantly inside (1-2 MOA) of the 270 WSM. I'd call that significant (rather than minuscule) for the few guys that want to stretch the cartridges' potential.

    FWIW--the LR target shooting crowd has shunned the .277 caliber entirely. I can't say for certain that I've never seen a .277 rifle on the firing line, but I do not recall one. On the other hand, .284 cartridges are certainly one of, if not the most, common calibers in the sport.
    Foolishness is a moral category, not an intellectual one.

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    Member Smokey's Avatar
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    Lotsa good stuff here guys for sure!
    I have a feeling in ten years you will still be able to find 270 and 7mm mag ammo on store shelves, not sure about any of the others we have kicked around.
    EKC, I sure have helped a lot of coyotes become "good coyotes" in the last 30 years with a 280...
    Wish I could tell you there was a big reason I fell in love with it but aside from no belt to deal with and less thump than say a 7Mag that was about it - just liked it alot and still do.
    I need to have a chat with your lovely wife also, are you sure she had glasses BEFORE she went out with ya?
    When asked what state I live in I say "The State of Confusion", better known as IL....

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    Moderator Paul H's Avatar
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    A chambering is only as good as the component bullets available for it, and that's where the 7mm trumps the 270.

    For hunting use, flip a coin, you'll never be able to see a difference in the field. But for a rifle looney, you can't dispute the 7mm's flexibility due to the available componet bullets.

  16. #16

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    My vote is for the 7mm, but like some have already pointed out, that's because that's what I grew up on. My first hunting rifle was a 7mm-08, and it was followed by a 7mm Remington Mag. Needless to say, I like the caliber regardless of how miniscule the advantages of it may be on paper.
    NRA Life Member, Prior F-16 crew chief.

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    For the guy who is not a Mr. Moneybags or reloader, the price of and availability of .270 Win might be a deciding factor. $15 at Trustworthy for Federal 150gr. How can you beat that today for a box of black bear/caribou/moose killin' ammo?

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    Man, I just grin when I see folks STILL doubting the longevity of the WSM cartridges. Sure the '06 and 308 are going to sell and sell but the magnum game is seeing more, not less WSM's than ever before. My 270WSM is a dream to shoot, mild recoil and plenty accurate. Honestly I still want a 257 Weatherby and a 280AI but that is more for the fun of owning them than any need. To go a step farther all I will likely ever need is a good 308 for all of my hunting but where is the fun in that?

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    Member Smokey's Avatar
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    I agree Sayak, the 270 will likely live forever
    LuJon- now ya done it buddy, we all know the 308 ( and don't even whisper 30-06 ) would do it all and with style and affordability.
    All these other guns is just for scratchin the buying itch!
    When asked what state I live in I say "The State of Confusion", better known as IL....

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    elmer:
    No need to argue. I've been around the block between WSM's, .270's, 280's , 30-06s, 7x75's. 7-08, .308 and more. They are all good. The WSM's are here to stay: period. Having said all that, I'm back to the 270Win. and 30-06. Your brass is cheaper per bag. The .277 bullets are available by the dozens - from 90gr. to 160gr.. Someone above here said the components are limited with the .277. That is categorically false. Factory ammo is much cheaper when compared to the WSM's. There is nothing that the good old 270WCF can't do in the lower 48 or Alaska.
    My thought would be to re-evaluate your optics - scopes, binocs and a spotter. THAT is where I would invest my money in.
    Now if you have an itch to scratch, that is a different kettle of fish..............keep us posted.

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