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Thread: .44 Mag Hard Cast Ammo Question

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    Member oldmil007's Avatar
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    Default .44 Mag Hard Cast Ammo Question

    Hi,

    I'm hoping for advise from some of you folks that may have experience using heavy .44 mag Hard Cast ammo in the the 300 - 320 grain bullet size range. The handgun I'll be carrying these in is a S&W 629 w/ 6" barrel. The purpose is for self defense, in the rare case that a large and furry creature in Alaska decides it's really PO'ed at me. Last resort option, needless to say.

    I've Googled around a bit as well as done some reading here and found some manufacturers that I'm familiar with and some others not too much. Names that have come up so far are:

    Garretts
    Federal
    Cor-Bon
    Buffalo Bore
    Double Tap

    Hoping to hear from folks who may be familar with some of these cartidges. Might any of you folks have an opinion as to which you like best?

    I haven't tracked down all the ballistics info on each of the cartridges yet, but here's some sample info from Garrett's for example, http://www.garrettcartridges.com/44defendertech.html


    Lastly, am I right in thinking that it's maximum ft.lbs. of energy that going to determine stopping power? Garrett's has an interesting viewpoint on this. http://www.garrettcartridges.com/penetration.html


    Thanks for any advise you'ld like to throw this way.

    - Jay

  2. #2

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    Quote Originally Posted by oldmil007 View Post
    Hi,

    I'm hoping for advise from some of you folks that may have experience using heavy .44 mag Hard Cast ammo in the the 300 - 320 grain bullet size range. The handgun I'll be carrying these in is a S&W 629 w/ 6" barrel. The purpose is for self defense, in the rare case that a large and furry creature in Alaska decides it's really PO'ed at me. Last resort option, needless to say.

    I've Googled around a bit as well as done some reading here and found some manufacturers that I'm familiar with and some others not too much. Names that have come up so far are:

    Garretts
    Federal
    Cor-Bon
    Buffalo Bore
    Double Tap

    Hoping to hear from folks who may be familar with some of these cartidges. Might any of you folks have an opinion as to which you like best?

    I haven't tracked down all the ballistics info on each of the cartridges yet, but here's some sample info from Garrett's for example, http://www.garrettcartridges.com/44defendertech.html


    Lastly, am I right in thinking that it's maximum ft.lbs. of energy that going to determine stopping power? Garrett's has an interesting viewpoint on this. http://www.garrettcartridges.com/penetration.html


    Thanks for any advise you'ld like to throw this way.

    - Jay
    Any of the loads that you listed will work fine for you. I have shot a lot of the Buffalo Bore and Grizzly ammo fodder and both are excellent.

    FPE is not a good way to rate lethality

  3. #3
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    "stopping power" in a handgun is a bullet penetrating far enough to hopefully take out the CNS. Whether it's a .500 at 1000fps or a .430 at 1300. The lead has to get through the bone and muscle to hit something vital.

    I have shot the 300gr Federal CastCore in my SBH 44mag, 7.5 inch barrel over a chronograph. They were right 1300fps.

  4. #4

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    I have to say, control is as imortant as FPofE, IMO. I would find the heaviest, fastest bullet you can double tap into a pie plate at 10-20 yards.
    (If you do not reload)Whatver you chose, please buy Alaskan, and chose Alaska Backpacker Ammo or ammosmith.com.
    Thanks for your consideration!

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    Cor Bon is the way to go

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    What brands do you guys sell?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wildalaska View Post
    Cor Bon is the way to go
    Living the urban lifestyle so I can pay my way and for my family's needs, and support my country. And you?
    ".. ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country" JFK

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    Quote Originally Posted by tvfinak View Post
    What brands do you guys sell?
    Cor Bon, HSM and Fiocchi although Fiocchi is only 240 grainers

  8. #8

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    Off subject a bit, do you guys have any Cor Bon .380 DPX in stock?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Snyd View Post
    "stopping power" in a handgun is a bullet penetrating far enough to hopefully take out the CNS. Whether it's a .500 at 1000fps or a .430 at 1300. The lead has to get through the bone and muscle to hit something vital.

    I have shot the 300gr Federal CastCore in my SBH 44mag, 7.5 inch barrel over a chronograph. They were right 1300fps.
    +1 and I'd rather have a Ruger Redhawk or Super Blackhawk instead of your S&W 629 with heavy bullets you mentioned?
    Steve

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    Since the purpose of the gun is carrying for self-defense with factory loads why would anyone want the heavier bulkier Redhawk or SRH?


    Quote Originally Posted by S.B. View Post
    +1 and I'd rather have a Ruger Redhawk or Super Blackhawk instead of your S&W 629 with heavy bullets you mentioned?
    Steve
    Living the urban lifestyle so I can pay my way and for my family's needs, and support my country. And you?
    ".. ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country" JFK

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    If this thread also turns into a Redhawk vs 629 argument I am going to gouge my eyes out. This is getting ridiculous, open a new thread named redhawk vs 629 (aka. my frankfurter is bigger than yours) and fight about it till you are blue in the face. Getting back to the original question Snyd and Tailwind summed it up in the first few replies.

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    Anyone planning to carry for self protection needs to practice plenty especially with these hand cannon loads mentioned, don't you think?
    Steve

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    Quote Originally Posted by S.B. View Post
    Anyone planning to carry for self protection needs to practice plenty especially with these hand cannon loads mentioned, don't you think?
    Steve
    Ya, I seem to remember a post from Professor Murphy, one of our AOD Pistoleros, who said that shooting about 600lbs of lead is a good start. That's 600 POUNDS not 600 ROUNDS. That's about 12000 350gr boolits. I'm still working on it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tailwind View Post
    Off subject a bit, do you guys have any Cor Bon .380 DPX in stock?
    all out right now

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    Quote Originally Posted by tvfinak View Post
    Since the purpose of the gun is carrying for self-defense with factory loads why would anyone want the heavier bulkier Redhawk or SRH?
    Very simple! The S&W can not take the heavy recoil of 300 gr and over boolits for long. The cylinder unlocking pin can peen and you will not be able to open the cylinder. The cylinder latch can come unlocked and rotate the cylinder so the next needed shot will just go "click."
    Think part inertia!
    I would not go over 265 gr in a S&W 29 or 629 and it has nothing to do with pressure.
    True, you can shoot a heavy boolit slow but what does a 320 gr boolit gain at 900 fps? Anything that increases the recoil in a S&W can cause grief when the gun is needed. You need to sight in and practice a lot when recoil is increased and that shortens the time until failure when you need the gun most.
    Sorry, but it is true and is why I recommend a Ruger for heavy boolits.
    A S&W is a GREAT gun but don't defend it for something it can't do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bfrshooter View Post
    Very simple! The S&W can not take the heavy recoil of 300 gr and over boolits for long. The cylinder unlocking pin can peen and you will not be able to open the cylinder. The cylinder latch can come unlocked and rotate the cylinder so the next needed shot will just go "click."
    Think part inertia!
    I would not go over 265 gr in a S&W 29 or 629 and it has nothing to do with pressure.
    True, you can shoot a heavy boolit slow but what does a 320 gr boolit gain at 900 fps? Anything that increases the recoil in a S&W can cause grief when the gun is needed. You need to sight in and practice a lot when recoil is increased and that shortens the time until failure when you need the gun most.
    Sorry, but it is true and is why I recommend a Ruger for heavy boolits.
    A S&W is a GREAT gun but don't defend it for something it can't do.
    Bull Shoot, all that was cured with the last few engineering changes, about -4s. You need to get up to date about Smiths?
    Steve

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    First of all - a person shooting factory ammo esp the expensive custom stuff just isn't going to shoot all that much.

    After that I can testify that a 629 will last many many rounds of 310 gr bullets with heavy loads because that is exactly what I've been shooting for the past couple of years in my 629-3 and my gun still works fine. Newer ones are even better I understand.


    Quote Originally Posted by bfrshooter View Post
    Very simple! The S&W can not take the heavy recoil of 300 gr and over boolits for long. The cylinder unlocking pin can peen and you will not be able to open the cylinder. The cylinder latch can come unlocked and rotate the cylinder so the next needed shot will just go "click."
    Think part inertia!
    I would not go over 265 gr in a S&W 29 or 629 and it has nothing to do with pressure.
    True, you can shoot a heavy boolit slow but what does a 320 gr boolit gain at 900 fps? Anything that increases the recoil in a S&W can cause grief when the gun is needed. You need to sight in and practice a lot when recoil is increased and that shortens the time until failure when you need the gun most.
    Sorry, but it is true and is why I recommend a Ruger for heavy boolits.
    A S&W is a GREAT gun but don't defend it for something it can't do.
    Living the urban lifestyle so I can pay my way and for my family's needs, and support my country. And you?
    ".. ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country" JFK

  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by oldmil007 View Post
    Hi,

    I'm hoping for advise from some of you folks that may have experience using heavy .44 mag Hard Cast ammo in the the 300 - 320 grain bullet size range. The handgun I'll be carrying these in is a S&W 629 w/ 6" barrel. The purpose is for self defense, in the rare case that a large and furry creature in Alaska decides it's really PO'ed at me. Last resort option, needless to say.

    I've Googled around a bit as well as done some reading here and found some manufacturers that I'm familiar with and some others not too much. Names that have come up so far are:

    Garretts
    Federal
    Cor-Bon
    Buffalo Bore
    Double Tap

    Hoping to hear from folks who may be familar with some of these cartidges. Might any of you folks have an opinion as to which you like best?

    I haven't tracked down all the ballistics info on each of the cartridges yet, but here's some sample info from Garrett's for example, http://www.garrettcartridges.com/44defendertech.html


    Lastly, am I right in thinking that it's maximum ft.lbs. of energy that going to determine stopping power? Garrett's has an interesting viewpoint on this. http://www.garrettcartridges.com/penetration.html


    Thanks for any advise you'ld like to throw this way.

    - Jay

    Any of the makers that you listed make ammo that fits your needs. Also you should add Grizzly Ammo to that list.

    Foot Pounds of Energy is not the way to judge terminal performance, it is much more complex than that. Choose a well constructed bullet (hard cast are excellent in this reguard) in the 300 to 320 grain range and you are good to go in the 44 mag

  19. #19
    Member pinehavensredrocket's Avatar
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    i think you may be missing the point of "heavy hardcast bullets" by insisting on maximum velocity. in my m29's a heavy 300gr over unique with a velocity between 900-950 fps will penetrate 10' of pine. using 15" of wet newspaper the bullets were a pass through, and not recovered.
    in my view........go heavy bullets at a moderate velocity, and have a gun that penetrates like crazy AND shoots well.
    happy trails.
    jh

  20. #20
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    i forgot to mention using "leadhead" bullets....tmace@proshootpro.com. sometimes, bullet design, gas check, meplat is the issue with penetration problems. personally the lbt (large meplat) and kieth design are favorites.
    happy trails.
    jh

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