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Thread: can a freshwater guide go halibut fishing with friends?

  1. #1

    Default can a freshwater guide go halibut fishing with friends?

    I am a freshwater guide. Between Kings and Silvers, I take two weeks and go down to the Kenai Peninsula to spend time with my family. According to the news tonight, I cannot legally go halibut fishing with my Dad on his boat because I have a guide license. I cannot go on a friends boat or I am in violation. Is this correct? If you know, please comment.

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    Member captaindd's Avatar
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    The way NOAA see's it no. There are different post in the alaska fisherys management section try reading them.

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    Member Mel Roe's Avatar
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    We met with NOAA enforcement last night and that was one of the questions we had. As it is currently written captaindd is correct. You have a guides license and therefore you are guiding no matter what boat you are on. A CHP an ADFG logbook must also be on board.
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  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mel Roe View Post
    You have a guides license and therefore you are guiding no matter what boat you are on.
    This is one of the craziest regulations ever to come down. As "The Dude" said, this transgression cannot stand, man!

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    Member Albradley's Avatar
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    This is freaking retarded,When is this BS law gonna be questioned???
    There's a fine line between fishing....

    and standing on the shore like an idiot! ALLEN BRADLEY-TANGLE LAKES ADVOCATE/FANBOY

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    Member fullbush's Avatar
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    Yeah how are they supposed to know if you have a guides license unless you show it to them? Get real no LE officer that is checking you is going to run your name to see if you're a licensed guide, unless of course you're doing something wrong.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Albradley View Post
    This is freaking retarded,When is this BS law gonna be questioned???
    It is already being questioned. I have a feeling this is going to be changed. If you watched the channel 2 news the last 3 nights you would have seen the series they did on those of us that can't get CHP's and how it's effecting us. They included information about this ridiculous law and stated that steps are being taken already to change it.
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  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by fullbush View Post
    Yeah how are they supposed to know if you have a guides license unless you show it to them? Get real no LE officer that is checking you is going to run your name to see if you're a licensed guide, unless of course you're doing something wrong.
    If you're a guide fishing with your family you are breaking the law. The fact that the officer probably isn't going to find out that you're a licensed guide or not isn't a very good reason to just break the law. Sorry. I don't break laws just because I'm 99% sure I can get away with it.
    Year round saltwater fishing adventures in Homer, AK.
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  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by fullbush View Post
    Yeah how are they supposed to know if you have a guides license unless you show it to them? Get real no LE officer that is checking you is going to run your name to see if you're a licensed guide, unless of course you're doing something wrong.
    With the computer programs they have these days, all they'd have to do is enter all the contacts they made during the season, and run it against all licensed AK guides..

    They might not bust you out on the water that very day, but 6 months later you might be getting a visit from your friendly NOAA LE officer.

    BTW, word is that the Feds have been paying to send State Troopers down to special enforcement classes for the last few years, so they are trained on how to enforce these new regulations. I got that from a VERY reliable source.

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    Member AKCAPT's Avatar
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    They are trying to eliminate boats with green stickers fishing for halibut without a CHP on board. If you have a CHP you can fish for halibut or if you and your family go out on another guide, who has a CHP you can fish for halibut. You can't take your boat, with the green sticker out and take freinds out fishing for halibut. It would make enforment of the CHP very difficult if every non permit holding guide just old enforcment that the people on his guide boat were "just friends".... I will bet you a peice of freind chicken they don't change the rule.

    Intersting to hear them on the News say something like "This new law is going to reduce the fleet of guides by 30% in Southcentral Alaska"
    I thnk by now we all know that is a crock. What it is going to do is cause some of the real guides to make alternate plans like leasing a permit to stay in business. I do not know ONE guide in Seward who will not be fishing for halibut in 2011 as a result of this rule. Every guide has made the shuffle to get a permit, in way or the other. What that law is going to do is get rid of 25% of the licensed guides who were spectulating that they might want to be a guide or want to take a few trips a year to offset a boat payment. Then there might be 5% who feel that a permit is just not worth it for them. That is my take on this. Even the analisis at the Council stated that this program is not going reduce the harvest from the guided sector.
    Sorry I digress.....

  11. #11

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    thanks for your reply. You sound like you may just know what you are talking about. Do you give discounts for fishing guides to go out with you? It looks like that is the only way I am going halibut fishing this year. BTW what is wrong with taking friends to offset a boat payment? Not all of us have a big boat to access the resource or can afford to pay 150.00 to go on a charterboat out of Ninilchik.

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    Member fullbush's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muttley Crew Fishing View Post
    If you're a guide fishing with your family you are breaking the law. The fact that the officer probably isn't going to find out that you're a licensed guide or not isn't a very good reason to just break the law. Sorry. I don't break laws just because I'm 99% sure I can get away with it.
    1st off sgt. joe friday, I commend you for the civic pride you take, 2ndly you should contact your insurance company cause your boat left town and you missed it!


    Quote Originally Posted by 270ti View Post
    With the computer programs they have these days, all they'd have to do is enter all the contacts they made during the season, and run it against all licensed AK guides..

    They might not bust you out on the water that very day, but 6 months later you might be getting a visit from your friendly NOAA LE officer.

    BTW, word is that the Feds have been paying to send State Troopers down to special enforcement classes for the last few years, so they are trained on how to enforce these new regulations. I got that from a VERY reliable source.
    WOWZERS, things are coming to fruition w/ this new world order stuff! Thanx to exxon, our former gov, and reality TV we're now in the cross hairs

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    Member Cliffhanger's Avatar
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    I think I may have posted this on a previous thread:

    Rachel Baker with NOAA in Juneau says they are working on a revision to the rule that licensed ADF&G guides who do not have a CHP can take immediate family out fishing. She's says the "friends and neighbors" restriction will probably stand because of enforcement issues.

    I suggested to her that this part of the new halibut rules paints every licensed guide without a CHP with a broad brush: we'll all liars and law-breakers before the fact. It assumes that we are going to collude (take payment "under the table") with clients to lie to law enforcement when we get boarded and pretend these paying clients are "friends".

    I asked her if she thought there was any due process here. I didn't get a satisfactory answer on that one.

  14. #14
    Member Cliffhanger's Avatar
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    Default Online petition

    I've posted a link in the Fisheries Management forum where you can go an sign a petition against the CHP program. Please help. Thanks

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    Member captaindd's Avatar
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    In Valdez we started with 29 Charter boats in 2010 and 19 got permits. Three of the 19 sold their permits so we are down to 16.

  16. #16

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    Wow, that's quite a drop! How is the fleet going to keep up with the demand? I would imagine there will be a lot more private boats as this goes on. Charter prices will probably go up making the prospect of buying a boat easier to justify.
    Hike faster. I hear banjo music.

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    Moderator Paul H's Avatar
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    Honestly I think with the hit the economy has taken, and hence less folks coming up to Alaska, you would have seen less boats going out this year than last even if there was no CHP.

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    Member AKCAPT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by excalibur View Post
    thanks for your reply. You sound like you may just know what you are talking about. Do you give discounts for fishing guides to go out with you? It looks like that is the only way I am going halibut fishing this year. BTW what is wrong with taking friends to offset a boat payment? Not all of us have a big boat to access the resource or can afford to pay 150.00 to go on a charterboat out of Ninilchik.
    What I would suggest if you do not and are not going to get a permit and want to take your freinds and or family out for a halibut trip is to go prior to the begininig of your season or after you are done. remove the green decals and turn in the last page of the logbook that states you are done guiding for the season. At this point you are not longer guiding and your boat is not a guide boat without the decals.

    I will be happy to take any full time, Alaskan guide, who has been displaced from the halibut fishery by this measure, space available, on my boat, in May or September. Email me, through my website, and you can fly stand by; just tip the deckhands, thats it.

  19. #19

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    It seems strange that no-one will be allowed to guide on the ocean if they don't have a chp. what if some guy just wanted to do salmon charters? I am sure they could send out some kind of sticker with the chp to slap on a boat (maybe next to the big green sticker that is already there) to distinquish it as a halibut charter. I don't think every commercial longliner HAS to buy halibut ifq's so he can fish his gear for blackcod, or pacific cod. a guy jigging for p-cod could catch some halibut as well, but we trust all these fishermen to let the halibut go if they don't have halibut ifq's. why are guides assumed to be more inclined to break the law than a commercial fisherman? As far as this making it possible for someone to run an illegal operation, it has always seemed to me that someone taking paying clients is pretty noticable around the docks. they would be turned in pretty quick. there will always be some who break the law but we should be concerned with just how many new laws and restrictions we inflict upon ourselves just to try to stop the few bad apples.

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by twodogs View Post
    As far as this making it possible for someone to run an illegal operation, it has always seemed to me that someone taking paying clients is pretty noticable around the docks. they would be turned in pretty quick. there will always be some who break the law but we should be concerned with just how many new laws and restrictions we inflict upon ourselves just to try to stop the few bad apples.
    I don't know if you're familar with the Kenai River but there are signs at all the boat launches saying there's a $5000 reward for turning in an illegal guide. I asked the park rangers last year how many illegals have they caught and their answer was zero. Never caught a single one yet to date. Now we all know what's going on on the river but just because it's a law(with incentives) doesn't mean it will stop. It will be interesting to see how the first year goes with the CHP's and enforcement.

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