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Thread: Wanton Waste - caribou, moose, swans

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    Default Wanton Waste - caribou, moose, swans

    FAIRBANKS ó Two Fort Wainwright soldiers seen shooting trumpeter swans at Meierís Lake near Paxson in September will be charged with several big-game hunting violations after law enforcement officers discovered they shot more than just swans during a two-day foray.


    Read more: Fairbanks Daily News-Miner - 2 Fairbanks men accused of wanton waste after swans caribou moose killed


    Edited to comply with forum rules.
    Last edited by stid2677; 02-01-2011 at 15:54.

  2. #2

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    One of my biggest issues with this article is that they continually refer to these two people as "hunters" rather than the more accurate term of "poachers" or "shooters". Using the term "hunters" just hurts the rest of us.

    Hopefully, if the charges are accurate, these guys get hit hard.

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    Member Hunt&FishAK's Avatar
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    Default Truly Disgusted

    I dont care if they are military, nail em to the wall! Think they can just come up here and do what they want how they want.........just SICK....I hope they get discharged and banned from here forever. Dont even wanna think about what they got away with......



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    Throw the book at em!!!

    I will assure you they were straight up hard casses to deal with professionally. From a miltary standpoint..they will get chaptered out of the military and sent home....they will never return after this run in with the law.

    Kudos to the Cabin owner and the State Troopers for investigating this...shame we cant see this on the TV show..as much as I would hate to see a Soldier get thrown through the crap..would set the tone to abide by the laws while stationed here for the ones that are coming up.
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    Gross! Why did you omit their names? They are in the article and deserve to be posted here!

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    Quote Originally Posted by skagway View Post
    Gross! Why did you omit their names? They are in the article and deserve to be posted here!
    Because it is against our rules.

    Copied from our rules page.
    We do not allow posting and discussion of violators and their alleged violations listed in police blotters, state trooper reports, newspaper articles, websites, etc.

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    I agree that they need to extend the full arm of the law on them, just remember though not all military members come up here and do these stupid things. As another post here says don't group them as hunters, they are not hunters nor sportsmen just ignorant poachers. I tend to see it from both sides as I have been serving for 20 yrs and consider myself a hunter. It is truly sad that there are people out here to give all of us that abide by the laws and enjoy this great state and country a bad name. I hope they make an example and show that this will not be tolerated. Kudos to the cabin owner and the AK State Patrol/US Fish and Wildlife!!

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    That story could be from the 40s, the 50s, the 60s... there is a long and not so proud history of that kind of stuff happening with military personell. In fact there was quite a public outcry in the 50s when Air Force guys were strafing sheep with their aircraft in the interior. Transciency breeds carelessness, and the military would be well advised to give an orientation to soldiers and airmen raw to Alaska who are interested in hunting and fishing here, and those who break state laws should also get some sort of an infraction from the service in addition to their punishment from the state.

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    Moderator stid2677's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sayak View Post
    That story could be from the 40s, the 50s, the 60s... there is a long and not so proud history of that kind of stuff happening with military personell. In fact there was quite a public outcry in the 50s when Air Force guys were strafing sheep with their aircraft in the interior. Transciency breeds carelessness, and the military would be well advised to give an orientation to soldiers and airmen raw to Alaska who are interested in hunting and fishing here, and those who break state laws should also get some sort of an infraction from the service in addition to their punishment from the state.
    The military does brief soldiers when they arrive. Military members are no different than any other group of people. Every group has people with low or no morals. Having served over 20 years and being a leader, I can assure you these malcontents will be dealt with. They will receive punitive actions from both the military and civilian authorities. The main defendant was not though highly of by his Commander before this incident, the article stated that he had been demoted for other offenses.

    They were military, but lets not start bashing the military. All groups have rotten apples, lets just deal with the law breakers.

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    Pretty dang sure I ran into these idiots right after they took the moose on Lake Louise road. I have a call into the troopers...

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    Quote Originally Posted by sayak View Post
    That story could be from the 40s, the 50s, the 60s... there is a long and not so proud history of that kind of stuff happening with military personell. In fact there was quite a public outcry in the 50s when Air Force guys were strafing sheep with their aircraft in the interior. Transciency breeds carelessness, and the military would be well advised to give an orientation to soldiers and airmen raw to Alaska who are interested in hunting and fishing here, and those who break state laws should also get some sort of an infraction from the service in addition to their punishment from the state.
    Come on Sayak, this activity isn't unique to those who serve. You can't tell me that every one out there that isn't military/transient is an altar boy and never does anything wrong. The fact that these two are military is essentially irrelevant. Ever hear of Point Hope?????

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    The Military is a slice of American pie, all colors, religons, emigrants and all, and I thank them....however, with such also comes a fairly equal percentage of Idjits, Morons and Dumbchits.........unavoidable.

    Hey, they were caught and stopped while mid spree
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    If the men in question committed the crimes then they should be punished under whatever laws apply. As a member of the military I find it sad that these men (if guilty) are associated with the armed forces.

    As far as the men being military, Steve could have not said it better...the military is the same as any other organization.....replace military, with oil workers, Wal-Mart employees, doctors, native residents, etc ...you get the picture

    Last note...I'll bet if you had the data and could add up all the game violation committed by the military, as compared to the total number of Soldier, Sailors, and Airmen who have been stationed in Alaska, hunted, and departed without incident, I would be willing to bet it is only a fraction of a percent of infractions committed by military personnel.

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    Member sayak's Avatar
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    Never said that it was only military people. There are low-lifes in every sector of the population, and probably 90% of the military folks wo hunt and fish are upstanding, law abiding folks. But as I said, this has been an ongoing issue since territorial days when Gen. Buckner tried to strong arm the territorial game wardens into granting special privileges to the military. When a person is not a resident of the state, and has no intention of becoming one, but still wants to harvest fish/game for their "Alaska experience", they may take liberties hoping to get away with it. Like the tundra truck boys of a couple years ago... remember?

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    Remember the Pt Hope Caribou: http://www.adn.com/2009/03/16/725368...e-caribou.html

    There are examples from all types (long time Residents, Natives, Military etc...) of unacceptable behavior.

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    I really disagree with you sayak. There's roughly 8 to 10,000 military members rotating in and out of the state every year. Why that estimate? Take the total military population and avaerage every 3 years, a third rotate. So lets say 5000 a year. So since the tundra guys, 2 years ago, it took over 10,000 military people before something like this happened. What's that percentage? I'm retired AF and they will definitely pay in both jurisdictions, civilian and military. Something that cannot happen to those that chose not to serve.
    I vote to punish them to the max extent of both military and civilian, and it can be done.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill S. View Post
    I really disagree with you sayak. There's roughly 8 to 10,000 military members rotating in and out of the state every year. Why that estimate? Take the total military population and avaerage every 3 years, a third rotate. So lets say 5000 a year. So since the tundra guys, 2 years ago, it took over 10,000 military people before something like this happened. What's that percentage? I'm retired AF and they will definitely pay in both jurisdictions, civilian and military. Something that cannot happen to those that chose not to serve.
    I vote to punish them to the max extent of both military and civilian, and it can be done.
    And that's OK.

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    These guys are a real class act and I hope the judge throws the book at them but lets get off the bash military idea and just call them people!

    Some of you guys and gals on here might like to look up the term "iceberg beliefs" and learn how to get over them! If you want a class on it drop me a pm and I will gladly sit down with you over a cold one and help you out.

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    There's often a noticeable presence of military folks in the blotter, but I'd offer what I hope is an unbiased explanation.

    When you look at the greater State population, you have a fairly even/normal graph of age distribution. When viewing the average ages of those in uniform, they tend to be, in greater part, notably younger. And I'd also wager that a greater proportion of them are from suburban or urban settings, where the whole hunting ethic/ettiquette is foreign..

    I'm not trying to make excuises; I think they should take their punishment, including some of those outlined in the paper's comments section. But I'd also ask, sincerely, does anyone posting here remember their own youth, associated indiscretions/crimes, and making poor decisoins?

    I plan to one day write a book about (some of) mine, should I live that long, and if the writing isn't guaranteed to get me killed in some violent way for disclosing stuff about others I adventured with. Even more benign, but more humbling than the truly risque' stuff, included the fact that I killed some song birds with my first .357 Magnum revolver during my early adolescence. A deplorable thing by my current view of nature.

    With the military, you tend to have a LARGE group of persons who are primarily young, often full of angst, visiting a place they're not necessarily connected to, etc. All of that contributed to poor judgement. I don't excuse it, but I also understand why there appears to be a greater presence of them in the blotter.

    Imagine gathering 10,000, 20,000, 50,000, or 100,000 teens in a limited location or two in Anchorage and Fairbanks, then after intense training, etc., cut them loose in groups to go out and blow off steam. I bet we'd be reading about it for weeks, months, or years. Seriously.

    Again, I'm not looking to excuse any thing these two did, but I also think there's some basic math to these equations some times.

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    And by the way, I'm -rarely- seen by anyone who knows me as being particularly pro-military -or- pro-police. Just for the record.

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    I wonder how many shots it took from that .17 caliber rimfire round to drop that caribou.

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