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Thread: SFW Does Not Belong In ALASKA

  1. #1
    Member Riptide's Avatar
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    Default SFW Does Not Belong In ALASKA

    Overhaul of deer regulations called a victory for elite hunters
    By brett prettyman
    The Salt Lake Tribune
    http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/home/50889688-76/wildlife-deer-percent-utah.html.csp
    Published Dec 20, 2010 11:03AM
    Updated Dec 20, 2010 09:24AM

    The moment, critics say, represents everything thatís wrong with the way Utah sets its wildlife management policy.
    Byron Bateman, president of the powerful lobbying group Sportsmen for Fish and Wildlife, had just finished speaking before the Utah Wildlife Board as it pondered the stateís most dramatic changes to its deer-hunting laws in two decades. Bateman then walked up to Jim Karpowitz, director of the Utah Division of Wildlife Resources, and handed him a check for $391,000.
    Later that day, the board passed the sweeping overhaul, regulations that were largely crafted and promoted by Batemanís SFW. The changes, which go into effect in 2012, will reduce the number of deer-hunting permits by at least 13,000 annually and dramatically increase the cost of a general-season hunting tag in Utah.
    Critics charge that opportunity for the average hunter is being lost at the expense of the well-heeled, who are more interested in trophy animals and believe these new laws are the best way to produce more. And everyone, beginning with the DWRís top big-game biologist, agrees the changes do nothing to address the plight of the stateís dwindling deer herds.
    *****MOD NOTE*** The rest of the article was deleted according to the forum rules. It can be found in the link contained in the quote above. **Thanks -LuJon
    Last edited by LuJon; 12-20-2010 at 19:45.
    Wade Willis


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    Moderator LuJon's Avatar
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    Sorry to have to cut up your post but that is a copyrighted article so I will do my best to trim it without losing your point...


    That said, I also have not seen anything beyond this article regarding what changes were actually made. I have heard that the "increase" was about $6/tag. That is less than ABCHA has called for in license increases in AK. I am not saying they are a good org, I just want to know exactly what changes they made. On the surface cutting the regions into smaller zones and working to increase buck/doe ratio doesn't exactly scream elitist...

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    Member AlaskaTrueAdventure's Avatar
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    Riptide,
    Over the last few years there has been some bits and pieces of information concerning SFW and their efforts to become entrenched within Alaska and our F&G Dept. But honestly, not many of us, myself included, have kept up with this movement.

    Could you either 1) Take many minutes and write out a summary of SFW and why it is a bad thing.....which is time consuming, or...
    2) provide any addition links of information where we might be able to find additional, more indepth stuff??
    Point those of us who are interested i the correct direction...

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    Member Vince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlaskaTrueAdventure View Post
    Riptide,
    Over the last few years there has been some bits and pieces of information concerning SFW and their efforts to become entrenched within Alaska and our F&G Dept. But honestly, not many of us, myself included, have kept up with this movement.

    Could you either 1) Take many minutes and write out a summary of SFW and why it is a bad thing.....which is time consuming, or...
    2) provide any addition links of information where we might be able to find additional, more indepth stuff??
    Point those of us who are interested i the correct direction...

    while your at it.. i would like correlation between SFW L48 and SFW AK.. as i have been told there are a lot of differences between them... and that the AK chapter does not get involved with Allocation issues, nor does it want to be associated with the rich hunter persona that is developing in the L48 chapters...
    "If you are on a continuous search to be offended, you will always find what you are looking for; even when it isn't there."

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  5. #5

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    While you are at it, show me another org that has put their money where their mouth is.
    "96% of all Internet Quotes are suspect and the remaining 4% are fiction."
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    Member jmg's Avatar
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    13,000 permits lost is a whole lot of permits, that's for sure. The article does not mention much about Utah's deer populations though. Are they in bad shape? Is this a necessary change to protect the population? The article only mentions that they were dwindling, and that the goal was to go from 15 to 18 bucks per 100 does. It doesn't really say where the state is at now - 5 bucks per 100? 10? Without that information, it is hard to tell whether SFW's plan is good for the deer, or only good for rich hunters as the article says.

    Given the vagueness of the article, however, one thing is pretty clear. Giving the board a check for $391k right after they pass your proposal was a very, very bad idea. Sometimes it's about deer, sometimes it's about money, sometimes it's about both. But it is ALWAYS about per perception, and that move right there made anyone and everyone who is not affiliated with SFW in the state of Utah perceive them as a bunch of elitist hunters who are buying their way to trophy bucks. Not only will that turn off everyday hunters, it will turn on the PETA type folks for more fodder that we only shoot animals to hang them on our wall. Sad.
    Never count your days, but rather, make all of your days count.

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    Member AlaskaTrueAdventure's Avatar
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    Akres,
    Perhaps my previous questions could be addressed by you...your post #5 apparently is in support of SFW. can you help me flatten out the learning curve concerning SFW?

    (It is possible that there is simply no substitute for lenghty, indepth effort. But, still, I'm overtly looking for the easy way in and out.)

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlaskaTrueAdventure View Post
    Akres,
    Perhaps my previous questions could be addressed by you...your post #5 apparently is in support of SFW. can you help me flatten out the learning curve concerning SFW?

    (It is possible that there is simply no substitute for lenghty, indepth effort. But, still, I'm overtly looking for the easy way in and out.)
    I am only loosely familiar with SWF's deeds here in Alaska. The one I am most familiar with, is that of their efforts and monies spent in Predator/Black Bear Control in Unit 16B. Their money/effort/involvement has resulted in a few dead bears. Gotta give 'em credit, when due. No other org has put up one cent, one minute nor one dead bear. So far, I have been impressed by their actions and deeds in Alaska. The other orgs...well...obviously we have all read right here on this very forum and in the news, what they have to SAY about the issues confronting us...but talk is Cheap, Internet Ink is worth it's weight in Gold.
    "96% of all Internet Quotes are suspect and the remaining 4% are fiction."
    ~~Abraham Lincoln~~

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    Member Vince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akres View Post
    I am only loosely familiar with SWF's deeds here in Alaska. The one I am most familiar with, is that of their efforts and monies spent in Predator/Black Bear Control in Unit 16B. Their money/effort/involvement has resulted in a few dead bears. Gotta give 'em credit, when due. No other org has put up one cent, one minute nor one dead bear. So far, I have been impressed by their actions and deeds in Alaska. The other orgs...well...obviously we have all read right here on this very forum and in the news, what they have to SAY about the issues confronting us...but talk is Cheap, Internet Ink is worth it's weight in Gold.

    was some work and funding done by SFW AK on Alexander creek also if i understand... What do you know about that?
    "If you are on a continuous search to be offended, you will always find what you are looking for; even when it isn't there."

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  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince View Post
    was some work and funding done by SFW AK on Alexander creek also if i understand... What do you know about that?
    Not much, other than some Pike got erradicated and a few beaver dams got busted up. I have not closely followed their efforts. Been a little bit busy doing my own erradication effort. Maybe the guys from Trout Unlimited, UCI Setnetters Association or some of the Lodge Owners in the area, can relate what they saw while they were out there....
    "96% of all Internet Quotes are suspect and the remaining 4% are fiction."
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    Member AlaskaTrueAdventure's Avatar
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    ..similar thread in game management forum....

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    Member Vince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlaskaTrueAdventure View Post
    ..similar thread in game management forum....
    yeah but that one will soon implode... Wade is a little less inclined to do so...
    "If you are on a continuous search to be offended, you will always find what you are looking for; even when it isn't there."

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    Click on the following link http://www.outdoorlife.com/articles/...rd-elk-part-ii to get further clarification on Utah's game management philosophy. This philosophy is largely driven by the local SFW chapter (Idaho's chapter is very similar as well). I'm not saying that all SFW chapters share the same agenda, as my interaction with Wyoming's seems to be very different. However, I would heed caution when any entity starts endorsing "pay for play" hunting opportunities. It is a slippery slope that will definitely end hunting as we know it. Whenever states start taking tags from the general public to auction to the highest bidder, giving them free reign to hunt any weapon during any open season (August through January), hunting quickly transitions from an equal opportunity endeavor to an elitist activity. Personally, I hunt hard every year to bag trophy animals, but would never advocate diminishing the average hunter's opportunities in favor of "trophy game management."

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    I know a little about the pike issue. SFW bought a couple of gillnets and donated them to the effort to eradicate pike here in the Valley. Backcountry Rob volunteered and spent a week killing pike this last summer. SFW did good there, I guess. I'm neither pro nor con at the moment, I'm waiting to see what else develops.
    If a dipnetter dips a fish and there is no one around to see/hear it, Did he really dip?

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