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Thread: A 20 ga slug outperforms HG loads

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    Default A 20 ga slug outperforms HG loads

    yet nobody advocates a 20 ga as a "moose stopper". The 20 ga is .62 caliber, so if a 460 or 500 is so much better than a 357, then why aint a .62 a lot better yet? Projectile wt and velocities are very close, 20 ga slug and super dooper hg, and the 20ga autoloader can get repeat hits 3-4x as fast as anyone can manage with a monster revolver. So why kid yourself about these things? Only brain or spine hits offer the sort of instananeous stop that is needed when something charges you. Having lots of recoil, blast and flash is no help for trying to hit the brain of a charging critter, especially with a handgun, and without ear protection.

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    Default 870 - rifled barrel

    my son has a 870 with factory scope-rifled barrel,
    we shoot Hornady SST 250 grain FTX Slug
    if you check the ballistics 1560/1485 velocity/energy,, zero at 150 yards

    no big pistol with factory loads can boost being able to zero better or be accurate in two inch groups

    1/4 inch steel plate at 60 yards the 250 sst leaves a very big dent

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    Fords and Chevys, manhood and image.

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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    I would guess that nobody asked.Both preform about the same but you can carry a pistol on your hip.Myself being a Ford I carry a 12.
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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    Sure, and we can make the same argument about the 375 H&H. But it's just much easier to carry a large handgun, and have it on you, than it is to pack a shotgun or rifle around. I know that sometimes I'll lay my rifle down and be ten or fifteen feet away. Hopefully that won't be when I need it most. A handgun in a secure, accessible holster is there when you need it most. And anyway, a lot of the time its about what you like, not about what is the most practical. If that were the case, you wouldn't have a 20 ga. at all. And big revolvers are fun. Shotguns are just pellet sprayers. Oh, but I'm being subjective now, like the OP. And anyone who's trying to hit the brain of a "charging critter" with anything is probably kidding themselves.
    "A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise, and independence to the mind."

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    OP... Let us know ---- how so?

    Not to rain on your post - but wrong... a 20ga. (of any configuration) slug does not outperform the factory S&W 460 or 500.

    Think you might want to do some practical testing... you'll find the S&W 460 and 500 have a much better long game as well as outputting the shotgun.

    One simple test: go out and fire the 20 Ga. SST load heck use a Brenneke 3" magnum (both can be a dandy for accuracy and follow-up shots - your right on this) at a frozen dead standing spruce tree (not rotten) in your neck of the woods from 75 yards. Do this a few times - won't need particularly thick, frozen, sickly spruce. Then do same the the 460, 500, or the plain ol' .30-06.

    Please illustrate results on here proving 'outperformce'

    Establish this truth for yourself vs. the Hyperbole on here.
    Brian Richardson

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    OP's being awfully quiet........ Probably hiding in troll land......
    "A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise, and independence to the mind."

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    As far as I've been able to tell the 20 ga is the same, more or less , as the .600 Nitro. I've been kicking around the idea of getting one of H&R's Ultra 20 ga slug guns, brass 20 ga shells and a .600 mold. The .600 Nitro threw a 600 grain slug 2100 fps+. I'd like to throw a 600 grain slug about 1500fps, call it the .600 Nitro Light.

    Just not wacko enough yet.
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    Strictly, in terms of Terminal Performance,,,,
    I have my doubts that a 20 gage soft lead slug, would penetrate nearly as far as hardcast handgun loads.

    in anything from 44 Mag. on up.

    Smitty of the North
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    Default Nope, you jist can't make a shootgun into a rifle, I don't think.

    Quote Originally Posted by .338-06 View Post
    As far as I've been able to tell the 20 ga is the same, more or less , as the .600 Nitro. I've been kicking around the idea of getting one of H&R's Ultra 20 ga slug guns, brass 20 ga shells and a .600 mold. The .600 Nitro threw a 600 grain slug 2100 fps+. I'd like to throw a 600 grain slug about 1500fps, call it the .600 Nitro Light.

    Just not wacko enough yet.
    It's an interesting comparison. However, there are some notable differences.

    The shootgun barrels ain't rifled.

    Nor, are they regulated to shoot the same place at whatever range, even if they were accurate enough.

    Then there's the 600 fps difference in velocity, assuming you could get 1500 fps, considering the amount of pressure the shootgun would stand.

    It would probably, be better to use slug cartridges designed for the shootgun.

    What'chew got then, is a DB Shootgun loaded with slugs. Not a 600 Nitro Express, by any means.

    Smitty of the North
    Walk Slow, and Drink a Lotta Water.
    Has it ever occurred to you, that Nothing ever occurs to God? Adrien Rodgers.
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    upto: You go on ahead and carry that 20 gauge scattergun in the brownbear woods. More power (or less) to ya. I'll stick with my 460 slinging 400 or more grains of HARD lead at the same velocity, from a much shorter, quicker handling and easier to carry firearm. ;-)

    The other 299,300,000 people can have it.

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    Member .338-06's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smitty of the North View Post
    It's an interesting comparison. However, there are some notable differences.

    The shootgun barrels ain't rifled. Why yes, yes they are.
    Nor, are they regulated to shoot the same place at whatever range, even if they were accurate enough. H&R=single shot
    Then there's the 600 fps difference in velocity, assuming you could get 1500 fps, considering the amount of pressure the shootgun would stand. The H&R Ultras Slug guns are on their rifle receivers and weigh 9 pounds. H&R partner 20 ga shotguns weigh 6 pounds
    It would probably, be better to use slug cartridges designed for the shootgun.

    What'chew got then, is a DB Shootgun loaded with slugs. Not a 600 Nitro Express, by any means.

    Smitty of the North
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    I may be slow, but I get where I'm going!

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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    For those thinking big bore thumpers here is a great thread with lots of pages and it get better as you go.

    http://www.go2gbo.com/forums/index.p...c,79991.0.html
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

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    I think the original poster has been educated by some posts from some pretty wise fellas so lets cut him some slack. Man I've been shooting guns for 40 years and can still come on here and learn a few things weekly...it's what keeps me coming back. So my advise to upto is next time your seeking input ask it in a question form rather a dogmatic statement.

    I have skinned and bomed out hundreds of Iiowa whitetail that have been shot with every sort of 20 ga slug offered. I have a coffee can full of slugs that didn't get clear through average size deer......I wouldn't use them for defense on anything bigger than a mountain lion or wolf. I've also seen big whitetail shot in one end with an exit hole on the other when shot with a 41 or 44 mag.

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by upto View Post
    yet nobody advocates a 20 ga as a "moose stopper". The 20 ga is .62 caliber, so if a 460 or 500 is so much better than a 357, then why aint a .62 a lot better yet? Projectile wt and velocities are very close, 20 ga slug and super dooper hg, and the 20ga autoloader can get repeat hits 3-4x as fast as anyone can manage with a monster revolver. So why kid yourself about these things? Only brain or spine hits offer the sort of instananeous stop that is needed when something charges you. Having lots of recoil, blast and flash is no help for trying to hit the brain of a charging critter, especially with a handgun, and without ear protection.
    A wide meplat hard cast slug in a 20 GA would indeed beat any bullet out of a 475 or 500 revolver. Most slugs are to soft for adequate penetration on really big game, but a hard cast heat treated slug would indeed be VERY EFFECTIVE and yes I would most certainly feel well prottected with such a load

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    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    Brenneke 437gr slug 1,476fps 2,120fpe
    S&W Corbon 500gr 1,500fps 2,499fpe
    Now left only to be a turd in the forrest and the circle will be complete.Use me as I have used you

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Amigo Will View Post
    Brenneke 437gr slug 1,476fps 2,120fpe
    S&W Corbon 500gr 1,500fps 2,499fpe
    What is your point? The larger diameter 20 gauge slug will leave a larger wound channel. FPE is irrelevant.

    My 416 Rigby with over 5000 FPE shooting a 400 grain partition penetrated 30" and left 1" wound channel at best. The 12 gauge shooting a 730 grain heat treated hard cast of 730 grains at a bit over 1200 FPS penetrated 29" and left a 3 1/2" to 4" wound channel. The 12 gauge made the 416 Rigby look anemic with only about 2334 FPE. Energy number will not rank lethality


    Damage of the 12 gauge with the "Dixie Slugs" 730 grain Terminator slug


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    Quote Originally Posted by .338-06 View Post
    No, not a Nitro Express. Maybe a Nitro Express Lite
    Perhaps, my conclusions WERE, a bit hasty.

    Smitty of the North
    Walk Slow, and Drink a Lotta Water.
    Has it ever occurred to you, that Nothing ever occurs to God? Adrien Rodgers.
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  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Richardson View Post
    OP... Let us know ---- how so?

    Not to rain on your post - but wrong... a 20ga. (of any configuration) slug does not outperform the factory S&W 460 or 500.

    Think you might want to do some practical testing... you'll find the S&W 460 and 500 have a much better long game as well as outputting the shotgun.

    One simple test: go out and fire the 20 Ga. SST load heck use a Brenneke 3" magnum (both can be a dandy for accuracy and follow-up shots - your right on this) at a frozen dead standing spruce tree (not rotten) in your neck of the woods from 75 yards. Do this a few times - won't need particularly thick, frozen, sickly spruce. Then do same the the 460, 500, or the plain ol' .30-06.

    Please illustrate results on here proving 'outperformce'

    Establish this truth for yourself vs. the Hyperbole on here.
    This is a more realistic test, you are not going to be shooting wet newspaper or soft meaty tissue if you need a big caliber and penetration on big game like brown bears, cape buffalo rhino, kudu, or elephant, all these animals will require a slug capable of taking on very hard dense bone and tisue. I think the frozen tree is a better test median, still not as dense as some of the bigger bones on some big game. still a better choice is the shotgun if one is timid to handgun recoil or less than efficient with the big hammers.

  20. #20
    Moderator LuJon's Avatar
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    Personally the 20 gauge just doesn't fit in my holster very well, and furthermore I can't see on good reason to carry a 20 gauge when it takes up exactly the same amount of space as a 12.

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