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Thread: Nelchina Near Hit

  1. #1
    Member Mkay's Avatar
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    Default Nelchina Near Hit

    A lot of folks say when you get nearly shot you should call it a near-miss, I prefer to use proper English and say near-hit, a near-miss lands one in the hospital or morgue. Anyway, started hunting, and I use that word loosely, the elusive caribou off the Denali Highway on the Swede Lake trail promptly Thursday morning at the butt-crack of dawn. Ran into quite a few characters, a few right out of Deliverance, but persevered on. Actually did some stalking on some small bulls and cows for a day and a half. Decided to bag it around 1500 Friday in anticipation of the circus to come that weekend. Forgot to bring my orange cammo and Kevlar, bad decision.On the way back some small bulls cross the trail and I wait for them to get about 100 yards away and off from the trail. The .375 man-portable, crew- served, arm cannon does the rest. As I stand over my "meat-bull" with the abbreviated rack, I hear a loud whizz/thack behind me. Then another whizz. I look back at the trail and people are screaming at me, pointing to the ground, I completely misinterpret this and think I have shot 2 caribou with a deflection. Finally another couple of shots which seem to go right over me and I finally get it, and hit the ground. In my bid to make like a pancake I look up and notice a small bull stumbling away from me about 10 feet away. The shooting dies down and several minutes I see man in his late 60's approach my position, rifle well in hand. At this point old Dan'l Boone says something to the effect of "Don't worry I'm a good shot and wouldn't hit you". At this point I would normally retort with some smart-ass comment, or perhaps a little ironic witticism, but he still was armed and I was not. I pointed in the direction that his wounded caribou had gone in, and wished him well. He trudged back about 10 minutes later, and of course, no caribou. He asks if he can help, and I say no, you have done enough. As I clean up I go over and see blood spots in an almost straight line going over my kill and back to the road. I'm done with this, whatever it is, cause it ain't no hunt.
    My child was inmate of the month at Mat-Su pre-trial Correctional facility.

  2. #2
    Member Vince's Avatar
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    yeah i have been nice with some of my post. some of the things i seen before it crowded up were gross to say the least... dad.. with young boy.. (8-10) shooting 500+ yards for the kids first bou.. shooting on the lake 7 times bullets ricocheting. left two wounded on the lake... watched 27 animals die in 25 min. watched more limp away... minimum shot was 500 yards with bullets bouncing off ice, that had 200 animals on it.

    glad your okay... and my kids wondered at first WHY we did not have one. i drove back 60 miles and found a few with NO one around them.

    seen it packing in fast yesterday.
    "If you are on a continuous search to be offended, you will always find what you are looking for; even when it isn't there."

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    Forum Admin Brian M's Avatar
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    That's exactly the kind of stuff that I was concerned about, and why I didn't choose this weekend to take my nephew up there to try to find his first caribou. That choice may come around to bite us in the butt if the hunt closes down early, but I really didn't want us to get into a "race" for caribou with other hunters all over the place. Nothing wrong with folks filling their freeers, but I'm hoping it will stay open and provide us with a bit more relaxed hunting experience.

    Glad you're safe, Mkay. Well done on bringing one home.

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    Mkay,

    Glad you survived. It's tough for me to read these storys and keep my mouth shut.

    I am surprised to hear all of this about "Tier II hunters".

    For you guys heading up for the circus keep in mind how you behave today may come back to bite all of us later.

    Anybody still want to see this hunt go registration?

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by northriver21 View Post
    Mkay,

    Glad you survived. It's tough for me to read these storys and keep my mouth shut.

    I am surprised to hear all of this about "Tier II hunters".

    For you guys heading up for the circus keep in mind how you behave today may come back to bite all of us later.

    Anybody still want to see this hunt go registration?
    I agree with you there. I have to wonder whether the irresponsible hunters are from those who have the experience and "time served" to qualify for the tier II or if they may be made up mostly of those who got the permits from transfers from others? I know there were a lot of people who got tier II permits who had already shot a caribou this year and planned to transfer their permits to other members of their family who, in many cases, were less experienced hunters. I'm sure there are other contributing factors as well, such as people getting the feeling of urgency due to the shear number of other hunters in the area and the feeling that if they don't hurry, they won't get their caribou. Some people can get tunnel vision and forget to take the normal precautions.

    Be safe out there. With a lot of people around, everyone needs to be extra careful. It's 1000% better to come home empty handed than to make a mistake.

  6. #6
    Member Vince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anchskier View Post
    I agree with you there. I have to wonder whether the irresponsible hunters are from those who have the experience and "time served" to qualify for the tier II or if they may be made up mostly of those who got the permits from transfers from others? I know there were a lot of people who got tier II permits who had already shot a caribou this year and planned to transfer their permits to other members of their family who, in many cases, were less experienced hunters. I'm sure there are other contributing factors as well, such as people getting the feeling of urgency due to the shear number of other hunters in the area and the feeling that if they don't hurry, they won't get their caribou. Some people can get tunnel vision and forget to take the normal precautions.

    Be safe out there. With a lot of people around, everyone needs to be extra careful. It's 1000% better to come home empty handed than to make a mistake.
    i bet i talked to 70 folks this weekend.... they all had ONE thing in common...

    twas the first time for them

    i knew it was a meat hunt and a road hunt and could wait...to shoot one away from everywhere
    "If you are on a continuous search to be offended, you will always find what you are looking for; even when it isn't there."

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    Member Hoyt's Avatar
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    How does this hunt work? There were a ton of people out there. Is it subsistence? How many permits do they give out? My buddy and I made the mistake of heading down from Fairbanks to run the dog on birds. I didn't realize the hunt was going on until we got down there (I shoulda checked I guess) we did hunt a few spots before we said screw this. I'm glad we wear orange when upland hunting! Left there, and headed back up top Delta, which was good because we were able to hunt in peace, and bag some Sharpies! It was kind of funny though, becasue we saw a ton of people glassing from their trucks, and we would walk around the corner and see a ton of bou.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoyt View Post
    How does this hunt work? There were a ton of people out there. Is it subsistence? How many permits do they give out? My buddy and I made the mistake of heading down from Fairbanks to run the dog on birds. I didn't realize the hunt was going on until we got down there (I shoulda checked I guess) we did hunt a few spots before we said screw this. I'm glad we wear orange when upland hunting! Left there, and headed back up top Delta, which was good because we were able to hunt in peace, and bag some Sharpies! It was kind of funny though, becasue we saw a ton of people glassing from their trucks, and we would walk around the corner and see a ton of bou.
    This is the unit 13 Tier II caribou hunt. It is considered a subsistence hunt, but many dispute this for a variety of reasons (don't need to get into that here, different discussion). This specific hunt was set up as a result of a court decision that determined the tier I hunt illegal and required it to be changed to a different system. The season just started on October 21st and runs until March 31 unless shut down earlier by emergency order. As a result of the subsistence nature of the hunt, it is legal for people to transfer their permit to someone within 2nd degree of kindred, thus you get a lot of "new" hunters hunting a substence permit thus resulting in a portion of the chaos of what you saw. Another aspect is that there were around 3,700 permits given out, yet there is a quota of about 1,500 animals to be taken before the hunt is shut down, thus some people are in a hurry to get their animal while the hunt remains open.

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    Member Hoyt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anchskier View Post
    This is the unit 13 Tier II caribou hunt. It is considered a subsistence hunt, but many dispute this for a variety of reasons (don't need to get into that here, different discussion). This specific hunt was set up as a result of a court decision that determined the tier I hunt illegal and required it to be changed to a different system. The season just started on October 21st and runs until March 31 unless shut down earlier by emergency order. As a result of the subsistence nature of the hunt, it is legal for people to transfer their permit to someone within 2nd degree of kindred, thus you get a lot of "new" hunters hunting a substence permit thus resulting in a portion of the chaos of what you saw. Another aspect is that there were around 3,700 permits given out, yet there is a quota of about 1,500 animals to be taken before the hunt is shut down, thus some people are in a hurry to get their animal while the hunt remains open.
    Thanks you for the information! I really appreciate it! At risk of opening a can of worms, if this is a subsistence hunt ( I admittedly don't know much about the subsistence hunts because I live in Salcha which I think disqualifies me) why are there a bunch of folks form populated areas like Anchorage/Fairbanks hunting? My upland buddy coined a term that I thought was funny, when he called it "super subsistence," due to the hoards of people cruising around with 100K set ups (F350+cabover+trailer+multiple atv's). I guess we just had a different idea of subsistence hunting. Like I said I really never looked into the subsistence hunts, and the requirements for it.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoyt View Post
    Thanks you for the information! I really appreciate it! At risk of opening a can of worms, if this is a subsistence hunt ( I admittedly don't know much about the subsistence hunts because I live in Salcha which I think disqualifies me) why are there a bunch of folks form populated areas like Anchorage/Fairbanks hunting? My upland buddy coined a term that I thought was funny, when he called it "super subsistence," due to the hoards of people cruising around with 100K set ups (F350+cabover+trailer+multiple atv's). I guess we just had a different idea of subsistence hunting. Like I said I really never looked into the subsistence hunts, and the requirements for it.
    Rather than get into it here, I would recommend you look into the numerous threads in the "hunting" section with "Tier II" in the title. There is an almost unlimited amount of discussion about exactly what you are asking. Lots of opinions on all sides. Makes for some interesting reading if you have the time.

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    Member Hoyt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anchskier View Post
    Rather than get into it here, I would recommend you look into the numerous threads in the "hunting" section with "Tier II" in the title. There is an almost unlimited amount of discussion about exactly what you are asking. Lots of opinions on all sides. Makes for some interesting reading if you have the time.
    I'll do just that! Thanks again for the information. Have a good one.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoyt View Post
    Thanks you for the information! I really appreciate it! At risk of opening a can of worms, if this is a subsistence hunt ( I admittedly don't know much about the subsistence hunts because I live in Salcha which I think disqualifies me) why are there a bunch of folks form populated areas like Anchorage/Fairbanks hunting? My upland buddy coined a term that I thought was funny, when he called it "super subsistence," due to the hoards of people cruising around with 100K set ups (F350+cabover+trailer+multiple atv's). I guess we just had a different idea of subsistence hunting. Like I said I really never looked into the subsistence hunts, and the requirements for it.
    is it different if you're from glenallen and have an f350 with camper+trailer+multiple atv's?

    just wondering....

  13. #13

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    Sorry to hear about your experience Mkay. Thanks for the information. Hopefully I can get time off in the middle of a week to try and get a caribou. Was hoping to wait until the horns were dropped off the bulls anyway but that may not be much of an option.
    It is nice to know that there are "ALASKANS" out there, no matter where they live.

  14. #14
    Member AK Ray's Avatar
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    Sounds like the early 1970's in Nevada when they still had over the counter tags for everyone including non residents. Half of the Central Valley of California, their cousins from Las Vegas and others would arrive on opening day and shoot all day. Fist fights over a deer that several guys shot into. I was just big enough to carry my dad's lunch and the canteen. Spent half the morning behind rocks.

    We moved up the mountain well away from the roads and things quieted down.

    I've lived in the big city for all but 2 of my 28 years in Alaska. I have met folks that have been here for less than half that time and they get tier II tags. Some married into it, most did not. I guess I should apply.

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    Member Hoyt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sh View Post
    is it different if you're from glenallen and have an f350 with camper+trailer+multiple atv's?

    just wondering....
    Is what different? Go ahead and clarify what you're trying to get at here. As I stated, I'm not a subsistence hunter, and due to that fact, have never had a hand in subsistence hunting. I've lived here for a long time, but like I said I've never been part of a subsistence hunt. I guess I just had a different idea of what that entailed (cultural, need). I guess I didn't expect a mini Steese caribou hunt. As I've stated on this forum before to each his own. I understand it's a meat hunt, been involved with those before (Steese). The only reason I brought up location (Atown/Banks), is because I thought that was one of the qualifying requirements for a subsistence hunt. I wasn’t trying to make a correlation between being from a bigger town and having those expensive items. Like I said, I guess I just had a different idea about what substance meant. Having seen all that money (no matter what community it came from) rolling around out there the other day, I can clearly see it’s not about “need.” Like I said, I have no experience with that type of hunting. I was just making observations and asking questions, because I simply do not know much about the situation down there.

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    I know of some folks who straight up lied about all the time they spent hunting in unit 13. I was going to put in granted I hunted 13 and spent alot of my weekends riding the trail this summer. Any how I stopped cause I would have had to do some fibbing to get a tier tag and I'm a paranoid type guy and did not want the state knocking on my door wanting to see my reciepts to prove I spent mostof my time in unit 13. I was probably more qualified to hunt there than a majority of folks. If I had a tag I would of went in on fish lake trail we saw plenty of bou in there in august probably still there or drive the 20-25 miles cross the middle fork of the gulkana alot bou back in there or go into eureka ride 20 miles back cross the little nelchina alot of bou back there too. Plenty of options to get away from folks and have a decent hunt. So with that anyone want to do that shoot me a pm and I can take you back there I have two wheelers and a Polaris ranger!

    John

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by 323 View Post
    I know of some folks who straight up lied about all the time they spent hunting in unit 13. I was going to put in granted I hunted 13 and spent alot of my weekends riding the trail this summer. Any how I stopped cause I would have had to do some fibbing to get a tier tag and I'm a paranoid type guy and did not want the state knocking on my door wanting to see my reciepts to prove I spent mostof my time in unit 13. I was probably more qualified to hunt there than a majority of folks. If I had a tag I would of went in on fish lake trail we saw plenty of bou in there in august probably still there or drive the 20-25 miles cross the middle fork of the gulkana alot bou back in there or go into eureka ride 20 miles back cross the little nelchina alot of bou back there too. Plenty of options to get away from folks and have a decent hunt. So with that anyone want to do that shoot me a pm and I can take you back there I have two wheelers and a Polaris ranger!

    John
    I'm glad you mentioned this 323. When the permits first came out, I asked the question if anyone had any idea how many folks lie to get the permits. It was kinda funny because it didn't take long and people commented that they get tired of everyone questioning the results and blaming people for fibbing on their applications and ultimatly writing off the poster (me) as disgruntaled for not getting a permit. I also know of someone who "really stretched the truth" and got a permit so I guess it does happen a few times. I wonder if some of these are the folks that are carelessly hunting as Mkay has experienced.

    The folks like Vince and Brian M and others who have hunted this for decades pick areas where there are not a lot of people and go off road to get a quality hunt. It seems that folks who have relied on this hunt for a long time hunt it very responsibly so I would guess that alot of these ones shooting on the road and wounding animals and in general being jack%$s are new to the hunt, for one reason or another. I hope nothing bad happens with this because I hope to participate in another ten years or so when I qualify and would hate to see F&G shut it down due to poor hunter behavior.

  18. #18

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    Lot's of liars put in for this hunt for sure! Kinda "pisses off" those of us who don't lie... A "Legitimate Poacher" might describe the liars. Is that a word? Maybe a random audit of applications would help this situation.

    That said, I'll be up there looking for a meat cow in a few days. Good luck to everyone on your meat harvest.

  19. #19
    Member The Kid's Avatar
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    I don't know how many people lie to get a tag and even if noone lies I still don't quite understand how it works. Example, I put in listing honestly that I buy stuff in Anchorage, spend 1 to 3 weeks in the area and have lived here for 4yrs, meanwhile my buddy answers honestly with the same answers as me except he has lived here 12yr. I got a tag, he didn't, still don't know how it works, oh well.

    On a related note I took my GF who also drew a tag, up to hunt the circus today. Holy crap, Yahoos everywhere, one guy started blazing away at a herd we were putting the sneak on from an easy 800yds, just letting them fly. Luckily we weren't in the line of fire, although we were a bit dismayed as we were only about 400yds and closing. Oh yeah and he was using the super steady shooting position know as offhand, some peoples children.
    We did manage to find a band of 25 or so that being about 3/4 of a mile from the road were of no interest to most of the people there. Two monster bulls in the band, but she made me proud by choosing to shoot a cow for the sake of the table. Dropped her like a bad habit with my old 06 on the first shot, her first shot at any biggame. Got butchering duty tommorow.

  20. #20

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    SO... Guys with 4 yrs. of residency in AK are recieving Tier 2 tags!!! (No offense KID, they gave you a tag!) But, It used to be that you needed 30+ years of history with the herd, and even then, you weren't guaranteed a tag. There were a couple years that you needed 50+ years. What the Hell is Fish and Game up to?

    My family has been eating the Nelchina herd since 1952. And we hope to continue the tradition that my grandfather started, 7 years before Alaska became a State!

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