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Thread: Phantom jet intake question

  1. #1
    Member OzAK's Avatar
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    Default Phantom jet intake question

    Anyone out there have or seen Phantoms alleged weedless SportJet option? Would be worthwhile at times in this neck of the woods for me. Thanks, OzAK

  2. #2

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    Phantom has some information on their website but the dealer in Alaska doesn't have anything we can put our hands on yet. I'm hoping they will have something here for the boat show this year. Information has been very slow to date.
    "He should have been packing a more powerful gun...you have to be a very good shot or very lucky to stop a brown bear with a .357 Magnum." - Rick Sinnott, Alaska Department of Fish and Game biologist after a double attack by a grizzly.

  3. #3
    Member OzAK's Avatar
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    Thanks Outdoors, have looked at their website. When is the sport show? Sent you a couple of PMs

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    OZAK PHANTOM developed the weedless great for use in the border areas in the lower 48 tested extensivley and it really works awsome.
    Marita sea & ski has some video on it and I think there is some on there website (phantoms) looks like it would work great in our area for duckweed (hate that stuff filled my jet at the Susitna Early this year)

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    I have what they are calling the weed grate on my Phantom Sniper. I am not happy with it. Not only will it not go through weeds it drags the boat down. I took it off and gained 10mph by my GPS. If you look at there website you will see them running all over the weed infested lake. That is one reason I drove from Texas to Washington to get a Phantom. I took my boat to a lake here to see if it would run the weeds it lasted about 10 seconds in the weeds.

    I also had the hardcore bottom put on my boat. That was a mistake it is not holding up any better than a bed liner would.I have asked for a refund but now they won't return my emails. If you are get a bottom protection get UHMW.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by garquest View Post
    I have what they are calling the weed grate on my Phantom Sniper. I am not happy with it. Not only will it not go through weeds it drags the boat down. I took it off and gained 10mph by my GPS. If you look at there website you will see them running all over the weed infested lake. That is one reason I drove from Texas to Washington to get a Phantom. I took my boat to a lake here to see if it would run the weeds it lasted about 10 seconds in the weeds.

    I also had the hardcore bottom put on my boat. That was a mistake it is not holding up any better than a bed liner would.I have asked for a refund but now they won't return my emails. If you are get a bottom protection get UHMW.
    Now that's the kind of information we are looking for---testimonials from customers

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by garquest View Post
    I have what they are calling the weed grate on my Phantom Sniper. I am not happy with it. Not only will it not go through weeds it drags the boat down. I took it off and gained 10mph by my GPS. If you look at there website you will see them running all over the weed infested lake. That is one reason I drove from Texas to Washington to get a Phantom. I took my boat to a lake here to see if it would run the weeds it lasted about 10 seconds in the weeds.

    I also had the hardcore bottom put on my boat. That was a mistake it is not holding up any better than a bed liner would.I have asked for a refund but now they won't return my emails. If you are get a bottom protection get UHMW.
    Garquest, would you mind posting some pics of the grate?

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    You can see pictures at garquest bowfishing on facebook. I can't seem to post picture here.

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    Member f0zzy2's Avatar
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    Thanks for the info and pics garquest. Hope you dont mind me posting a link to your facebook
    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Belton...g/268511551378

  10. #10

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    Garquest-
    Thank you for the pics and email. It reinforces 2 things many of us suspected.
    1) To date, there's no viable option that enables jet jockys to operated in weeds with confidence.
    2) To date, there's no spray on bottom protection that offers the full benifits of UHMW.

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    I love this site for this reason right here. Sooner or later someone you will know if something works or it don't. Thank you GarQuest....

  12. #12

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    I looked at GarQuest's pictures and find it hard to believe the bottom divots in the hardkor were done at idle. You can tear UHMW in the same manner but it takes one heck of a hit and what I've read about Hardkor it's stronger, wears less, and has no seams. I'm curious to hear Phantom's (or anyone else's) response on the bottom impact and how they feel it happened. I'd also like to see the photo's from the otherside of the impact area.

    As to the weedless system, I think it's designed for running at one set speed across a weed infested lake - not increasing and decreasing the RPM's while running under normal river conditions. I was interested in using it here in Alaska but am now leaning towards buying a second boat set-up with a Go-Devil or Mud-Buddy motor.
    "He should have been packing a more powerful gun...you have to be a very good shot or very lucky to stop a brown bear with a .357 Magnum." - Rick Sinnott, Alaska Department of Fish and Game biologist after a double attack by a grizzly.

  13. #13

    Default Mud Buddy

    I have an in-line twin 23HP Mud Cuddy long tail (i.e two 23 HP engines - one crank connected directly to the other).

    I am torn between using the engine to build a mud buggy or to sell it because I no longer use it after upgrading to a larger jet boat that I also use on the ocean.....

    Anyway,

    PM me a message if you are interested in the twin 23HP Mud Buddy.

    There are past posts on this forum (including some by me) that discuss the mud motors at length.

    Good luck with whatever you choose.

  14. #14
    Member OzAK's Avatar
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    Time to weigh back in. To all that have replied, thanks. To give credit where it is due, I talked with Mel (Halibutgrove) about the grate as there was no info available when I started this thread. He was more than helpful, all I had to do to get info on the unit was to show up in Wasilla and he would show me the grate. Turned out I didn't need to go as I was sent some pics from a friend who knew a guy that had it on his boat. Might even be you Garquest, or perhaps someone in Alaska. Anyway, the one he (Mel) had then was off his diesel SportJon which is configured a bit differently than the SJ but was the same basic idea. He told me the same basic thing you have said Garquest, it slows the boat down and he was less than thrilled with it, but for what it was intended to do, would probably be OK. He had never run weeds with it. 10 MPH on a GPS was never mentioned, he said perhaps 5MPH or so if I recall. Details not that critical in this case, and again, the diesel grate is a bit different than the SJ one. He had installed a "standard" stomp grate for whatever other testing/boating he was doing so he could perhaps gain back what was missing. For all your help and info HG, thanks.

    Moving along in this quest for info, I called Phantom, talked to Derek I believe. Told him what I was looking for and that I had bought a 2008 SportJon from them and being the helpful guy that he is, told me sure we can sell you a weedless grate, it will be $1500 and I would have to SEND MY BOAT TO THEM. Yikes!! That's way outside my scope of can-do or wanna-do items. So far from the photos I see no rocket science there, it's an inboard jet powered jonboat for heavens sake. With all this supposed voodoo patent pending super secret mumbo jumbo about this thing floating around in cyberspace, and now with at least one if not two reports from owners coming in to this forum about what it isn't, makes me wonder. The info I got from another source was similar in the area of the Hardkor performance or lack of. The damage to the Hardkor was such that it had divots in it and the individual (don't know his name) had said that when he contacted Phantom they told him to "...just patch it with some (insert favorite brand of epoxy, marinetex, etc here), sand it smooth and continue on..." I'll have to say that this info comes second hand but I did see and read the e-mails about all this, and have gotten the photos of the grate. I looked at the Hardkor damage photos and there was a long drag mark leading up to the rough looking divot(s) and they were pretty deep, close to down to the base metal if not all the way through. That sums up what info I've come across.

    Now for another tidbit from the forum memory banks. I think it was this forum but might not have been, might have been on a Harbercraft forum, but nonetheless. Weed grate construction. AlaskanOutdoorsman I think is not too far off the mark on the running at a steady speed through the weeds may be part of the operational key. That said, a few years ago a forum member posted some info that he had from experience with his families jetboat (large inboard I do believe). They had some property at Ellamar in PWS and every time they got ready to go there his Dad would change out the standard "River Grate" and install the weed grate. He described it as a grate made like a collection of "fingers" that were not attached in any way at the back of the intake opening. Mind you they were running through the ocean in PWS and the sometimes more than occasional raft or plenty often fair-sized blobs of kelp and the like and not worried about river gravel. He said the weeds didn't stay on the grate but just slid off the back end and caused little to no problems. Wouldn't work so well to keep gravel out but if you need to run weeds there probably isn't much gravel about. Anyway, good food for thought.
    In my neck of the woods it would be better if it could do both as the situation exists to start and end the trip in the river (coupla skinny spots) with the weedy work in the middle. I'm working on my solution to the problem with the goal in mind to: Not slow the boat down, keep the bulk of the gravel where it belongs, and not get all bound up with weeds. Has anyone tried this before? I know they have, this is not untried theory. There are a bunch of patents out there on it too. Doesn't mean I couldn't come up with a meaningful alternative. All I'm looking to do is cut the hassle time down as much as possible when the jet starts to clog from debris of any type. Spring runoff, flood stage flotsam, fall leaves, weeds- all add up to a lot of problems and quite a bit of extra fuel burned to get the same job done because of inefficiency. Maybe I'm on a losing trial, but thats what makes it fun for me, meeting the challenge. Have welder, will try. For now, Oz

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    Member tjm's Avatar
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    Good bit of info there OZ....thanks...

    Just for fun....how 'bout a fresh pic of that black beauty of yours...
    ------------------------------------------------
    pull my finger....

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    Member OzAK's Avatar
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    Default Your request for a pic

    DSCN0269.jpgStill a couple of the best ones I have. I'm working on an album, it's slow. Or is it me?HPIM2627.jpgI find I have a lot of pics from inside the boat but not from the outside. I shall have to remedy that.

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by OzAK View Post
    Time to weigh back in. To all that have replied, thanks. To give credit where it is due, I talked with Mel (Halibutgrove) about the grate as there was no info available when I started this thread. He was more than helpful, all I had to do to get info on the unit was to show up in Wasilla and he would show me the grate. Turned out I didn't need to go as I was sent some pics from a friend who knew a guy that had it on his boat. Might even be you Garquest, or perhaps someone in Alaska. Anyway, the one he (Mel) had then was off his diesel SportJon which is configured a bit differently than the SJ but was the same basic idea. He told me the same basic thing you have said Garquest, it slows the boat down and he was less than thrilled with it, but for what it was intended to do, would probably be OK. He had never run weeds with it. 10 MPH on a GPS was never mentioned, he said perhaps 5MPH or so if I recall. Details not that critical in this case, and again, the diesel grate is a bit different than the SJ one. He had installed a "standard" stomp grate for whatever other testing/boating he was doing so he could perhaps gain back what was missing. For all your help and info HG, thanks.
    Oz, there's some serious inconsistencies in Gargquest post. His boat was GPSed at 41mph before leaving the factory with the grate. There's no way that without it the boat will now do 51mph. At most they've seen 2-3mph drop on top speed. The grate on the spj is designed much different then the one on my diesel at the front. It dropped the WOT speed by about 4mph on the diesel but after I made a modification it now drops maybe 1mph off WOT. On the diesel it changed the handling characteristics slightly by not allowing the rear end to slide as easy acting as a rudder. The diesel grate is also probably twice as wide. The grate is not an end all solution to prevent weeds, you must be moving with some speed in order for it to function effectively. It's definitely not going to allow you to idle around in a weed patch for obvious reason. The patent definitely wouldn't stop you from building your own I don't believe, just won't allow other manufacture to market or sell without purchasing the patent. We'll most likely have one up here before the spring season starts for someone to test and run themselves.

    .

  18. #18
    Member tjm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OzAK View Post
    DSCN0269.jpgStill a couple of the best ones I have. I'm working on an album, it's slow. Or is it me?HPIM2627.jpgI find I have a lot of pics from inside the boat but not from the outside. I shall have to remedy that.
    wooo doggie!....still gotta' be the sexiest Phantom out there...sitting on a 4K King to boot...couldn't help but notice the grab handles on the front...nice...

    so, you going to take one for the team and order up one of those weedless grates for testing?...then you could report back to us....I've got the perfect fishing hole in mind too, thus far I've had to bum rides from those noisy fan boat things to get there......(sorry Grem, my head is still throbbing...lol)....



    see, here's an example of the poor hearing of some fan boaters....here he is dancing a jig, he thinks we're cheering him on so he keeps going....but, sadly, they were boos and begging to end the show....



    so you would be saving me from similar public embarrassment by getting to the bottom of the weedless grate....
    ------------------------------------------------
    pull my finger....

  19. #19
    Member OzAK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halibutgrove View Post
    Oz, there's some serious inconsistencies in Gargquest post. His boat was GPSed at 41mph before leaving the factory with the grate. There's no way that without it the boat will now do 51mph. At most they've seen 2-3mph drop on top speed. The grate on the spj is designed much different then the one on my diesel at the front. It dropped the WOT speed by about 4mph on the diesel but after I made a modification it now drops maybe 1mph off WOT. On the diesel it changed the handling characteristics slightly by not allowing the rear end to slide as easy acting as a rudder. The diesel grate is also probably twice as wide. The grate is not an end all solution to prevent weeds, you must be moving with some speed in order for it to function effectively. It's definitely not going to allow you to idle around in a weed patch for obvious reason. The patent definitely wouldn't stop you from building your own I don't believe, just won't allow other manufacture to market or sell without purchasing the patent. We'll most likely have one up here before the spring season starts for someone to test and run themselves.

    .
    I have yet to see a SportJon that would crack 50, though I've heard it said they have. You hear lots of things, like elephants can fly etc. Perhaps if I had run it bare bones with no additional weight from mods,perfect bottom, etc, maybe it would, but I have my doubts Mine, after all the additions, mods, standard stomp grate of my own construction, UHMW on the entire bottom and 6" up the sides, brand spankin' new off the trailer as soon as it was broken in and test run by me, GPS'ed at 44. It's not quite that fast now, got some time on it, but more importantly it's got a little wear & tear on the bottom that slows it down a bit. Had an altercation with a rock in the Delta River in a channel I shouldn't have been in, it was a hit to be seen. Too bad no one was videoing that one. The kind that everyone winces and shakes their head and wonders if everyone is OK. That said, still runs 41-42 with a fair load, almost never run it empty with a light fuel load anyway.
    As far as the effects of the weedless, in the boating world , in my experience, you never get something for nothing and it would seem that the weed grate is no different. I always figured, due to physics, any boat with any type of grate like that installed, had to be moving to prevent debris buildup. Again, no rocket science involved. Anyone that figures otherwise hasn't spent much time digging junk out of their jet intake sitting up to their inexperienced chest in ice cold river water and wondering why we were up in that nasty little channel anyway. Fortunately my chest wasn't the one that was wet. I use a pike pole or a rake designed for that purpose.

    As I type this there is the complete bottom end of a Merc Sportjet upside down on my bench and a fistfull of parts, materials, scribbles and drawings scattered about as I figure out my way of going about this thing. So no T, I won't be taking one for the team, just building my own. I'd rather help the team out that way anyway. Can't say how it will differ, but there will be some changes, always are when I am creating something that needs to work for how I use it. Phantom has gotten enough of my $$ at this point, indirectly through Compeaus, and there's no way I'd send the boat to them, and probably little chance of me messing around going to Wasilla either, although I'm glad to hear that Phantom will let them bring one in and install it here if someone wants one. Seemed ridiculous after seeing what the installation looked like in the pics.

    TJM, there are matching grab handles on the rear as well, and they come in very handy at times. The pic with the trailer was just before a Valdez trip with the arch, side rails, and downrigger mounts installed. My canvas fits under and around it all and completely covers the back deck to keep increasingly balding head dry while fishing. It's no ocean boat, but gets the job done in decent weather. Add the 9.9 Merc longshaft kicker and it's a pretty sweet combo.

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by titobandito View Post
    [...] PM me a message if you are interested in the twin 23HP Mud Buddy.
    Thanks, PM sent.
    "He should have been packing a more powerful gun...you have to be a very good shot or very lucky to stop a brown bear with a .357 Magnum." - Rick Sinnott, Alaska Department of Fish and Game biologist after a double attack by a grizzly.

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