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Thread: Dog nazi's

  1. #1
    Member mmusashi2k's Avatar
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    Default Dog nazi's

    Maybe I'm the one in the wrong here. Maybe I'm in the minority.

    My dog has accompanied me on most of my many hunting, fishing, hiking, etc. excursions for her entire 12 years and is a well behaved and outstanding companion. So I'm waxing nostalgic, reminiscing about the days before the cat walks on the Russian and all the exersize I used to get hiking up to the falls then down to the confluence and maybe even catching a few reds and I decide that since low numbers are reported I'll just go and have some uncrowded fun. The "bull" of the flock of "volunteers" that stood on the walkway says to me " the Forest Service would appreciate it if you had your dog on a leash no longer than 6 ft." Thank you says I and as I continue he repeats "I would appreciate it of you have your dog on a leash" and I replied "I appreciate that, thanks a lot." So we continue on our hike, encounter very few folks and after releasing a couple of spawned out reds and a trout that hit my chartruese r.r.fly I decide to check out the confluence. So we're almost there when the guy with the gun and badge hails me from the other side of the river and comes over and asks if I have a leash with me. I reply yes and ask "is it a law?" and he says yes so I put the leash on the dog and say thanks as I turn to walk back to the truck. He states that I don't have to quit fishing, that I just need to have a leash of less than 6 ft. on the dog and I reply " thank you very much but I have truly just lost interest in being here."

    Soooo, to make a long story long. My well behaved dog heeling at my side is annoying to folks but it is OK for the guys in the pickups at the parking lot to have their sub-woofers from hell blasting out so loud that I couldn't hear myself think? That's the last $11 of mine they'll see.

  2. #2
    Member Sierra Dragon's Avatar
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    I suppose the concern is less well trained dogs encountering bears. Bears in Alaska as you well know are not to be bothered, harrassed, barked at, or in any other way disturbed from doing what they naturally do. makes total sense!


    Personally I'm with you... I don't own a dog (4 boys is enough trouble for me) but I don't mind other people well trained and behaved dogs hanging out with them fishing. I think the forestry service sometimes takes bear protection a little too seriously.

    and I agree... I daily wish there was a way to ban stupidity.

  3. #3
    Member Raptor_1's Avatar
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    Sorry to hear that brother. Don't you wish you could jump in the delorian, crank 'er up to 88 mph, and head back in time sometimes before all the crowds?
    Alaska: We're all here cuz we're not all "there"

  4. #4
    Member mmusashi2k's Avatar
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    Yeah, I agree, a ban on stupidity would be nice. Pretty much the case with dogs is a blanket ban on all dogs that are off a leash. It doesn't change stupid dogs into smart ones, just tethers them. My dog and I have fished the Russian for many years, encountered dozens of bears and other dogs with never a problem but it is too difficult to suggest that owners of stupid dogs that are harrassing wildlife or bothering people get fined. Just lump them into to catagories-leashed and unleashed. I suppose it makes it easier on them to spot violators but it steps on my high and I am finding it harder and harder to get out for some relaxing fun amid all the new laws. We make the peninsula more and more enticing for folks to want to live, we build 500 houses a year and pave more and more roads to encourage 500 plus families per year to move here because it means a lot of money to certain people. People who have no interest in the outdoors and don't care if it is ruining it for Alaskans as long as the tourists have a place where they can easily go a kill some fish.

    A spot where my buddies and I have been snowmachining for many years is 15 miles down the lousiest road with a postage stamp sized parking lot and a few years ago I encounter a Forest Service employee who offers me $5 to take a survey. I decline the dough but answer her ? of "what can we do to improve this place" to which I stated please just leave it alone. This is why we come here. Well, sure enough there is now a new parking lot and the road is improved and now unskilled riders can go there easily and soon they'll be charging us to park there. Yikes!!! Do I have to relocate farther into Alaska and how long will that last?

    Apologies for turning this into a book.

  5. #5
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    A very well trained dog that is heeling at your side at all times, maybe a different story. But the majority of folks out there with "good" dogs, not so much.

    I was just down at Hope today and some guy with terrier/bull dog looking dog had it off the leash. He came in and started fishing next to me and my family. It was my wife, myself, and a 6, 4 and 1 year old. the dog comes over and starts sniffing my pack and an area where my kids had just been playing with some eggs, right next to my 1 and 4 year old. it would be very easy for my kid to take something that the dog is interested in and the dog simply gives a bite to defend what he thinks is his. he doesn't want to maul anyone, but that is how dogs work. i work in an ER and have taken care of plenty of dog bites (the majority) from "good dogs", usually the family pet. i don't think i should have to think of my 1 year old's safety from a dog while i'm out fishing.

    as i said, a dog that is heeling at your side and obedient is not the norm out there at all. you are an exception to the common off-leash crowd. most folks let their dog stray away, sometimes well out of site of them on a trail. i don't like when an aggressive (aggressive breed with a tail that is down) comes running up the trail on my 4 and 6 year old.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sierra Dragon View Post
    I suppose the concern is less well trained dogs encountering bears. Bears in Alaska as you well know are not to be bothered, harrassed, barked at, or in any other way disturbed from doing what they naturally do. makes total sense!


    Personally I'm with you... I don't own a dog (4 boys is enough trouble for me) but I don't mind other people well trained and behaved dogs hanging out with them fishing. I think the forestry service sometimes takes bear protection a little too seriously.

    and I agree... I daily wish there was a way to ban stupidity.
    It's not about bear protection. It is about adherence to rules that are written by simple-minded folks who are totally unaware that there is such a thing as a well trained dog. Our over protective big brother society simply wants us to conform to those rules that have been deemed as necessary to protect the ignorant masses (you and me).

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    Member mmusashi2k's Avatar
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    Ah, what I would do for a ride in the Delorean. There was a Delorean in the Soldotna parade the other day!

  8. #8
    Member Raptor_1's Avatar
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    Was a Michael J Fox look alike driving it?
    Alaska: We're all here cuz we're not all "there"

  9. #9
    Member mmusashi2k's Avatar
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    I can't imagine how anyone could fish with a 6, 4 and 1 year old present on a riverbank full of rusty fish hooks and all other hazards that might be present. I know when my kids were that young I was pretty much a babysitter when we went near the water. A hook baiting babysitter.

    Again, the leash just makes it an easy no-brainer ticket. Nobody would even dare to suggest that a dog that is pestering kids on a riverbank might be the one to target. It only makes it so that people with dogs don't want to go there. I won't go there anymore, so my dog won't be bothering you at the Russian. Not that she ever would have. I used to go there a lot but I have been pushed out.

  10. #10
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    simple answer, if you want to bring your dog fishing not on a leash don't bring your dog somewhere there is a leash law...

    I like dogs just as much as the next guy, but seriously not all dogs are good dogs, and dogs will be dogs. Its nice to see a leash law is enforced somewhere in Alaska.
    I choose to fly fish, not because its easy, but because its hard.

  11. #11
    Member mmusashi2k's Avatar
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    Default Uh, yeah

    I kinda got that. If you had actually read my posts you would see that that is, kind of, what this thread is all about. You know, the part where I once fished somewhere with my dog and now we can't do it anymore.

    Simply answer, if I want to fish with my dog, don't go anywhere where folks like you have installed leash laws. You know, the new laws that came with the boardwalks and stairs and higher access fees and all that stuff that makes fishing easier. Pretty soon we'll be able to cast from our couch and only have to get up to get a beer. Remember the part where I said that they won't be getting my $11 anymore? Well, that kind of means that I'm done with that mess so you can have it all to yourself.

    I no longer find any "quality" in this experience.

  12. #12
    Member coho slayer's Avatar
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    I see both sides to this. I understand it's frustrating for you because having your dog around is part of the experience for you. On the other hand, I can also see why a leash law might be in effect. When fishing the Russian River (or most other road-side salmon fisheries nowadays), it is not a "wilderness experience" like it once was. It's crowded chaos with hooks flying, people of every size, shape, and mannerism.

    I too take my kids fishing. One of my boys, the five year old, for some reason has a fear of black dogs. Other dogs are fine, but he freaks out at black ones. I can't tell you how many times I've had to pick him up because someone's very friendly lab or lab mix came loping over to say hi. I understand the dog isn't trying to hurt us, but that doesn't quell my son's fear.

    It's great if your dog is well-trained enough not to go up to people, but you sir are the rare one. Trust me. For every one of you, there are ten people who's dogs are allowed to run amok. And the other people around you have no idea the training, temperament, or intention of your dog. As a protective parent my hackles go up every time a strange dog runs up to my kids for precisely those reasons, and why I'm generally in favor of leash laws around the public. Look at it from another's perspective and you might think it makes some sense. Those laws aren't generally arbitrarily put into place, and it's not a personal attack on you or your dog.

  13. #13
    Member ysr_racer's Avatar
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    Funny thing about dog owners is they think everyone loves their dog as much as they do.

    Trust me, some of us don't.

    I love my grandkids, but you may not.
    brad g.
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    Visit my Sporting Clays website
    http://www.ysr-racer.com

  14. #14

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    I was just fishing on a river where a guy showed up with his dog. Bear questions aside, the dog chased people's casts into the river, chased their fish when they tried to land them, and growled at anyone who new who walked up. Meanwhile the owner was yelling at the dog the whole time without effect. How I wished for a leash law! As it was, the owner didn't leave, the rest of us did.

    You're dog may be perfectly well behaved, but you paid the "price" for most people whose dogs aren't.

    Why the objection to the leash? If you're dog is well behaved, it shouldn't have been the slightest inconvenience to either of you, while helping set the example for the other 99.9% of dog owners around water.

  15. #15
    Member fullbush's Avatar
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    mmusashi2k--I feel your pain! OMG do I ever. I've been a commercial fisherman in the sound my whole life. We used to stash our spare nets in the woods around the grounds. one day In the early 90's I went to change nets and notice a forest service boat where my net was stored. I motored over and 2 forest service employees were roping my net in their boat. The head honcho was busy getting the beads in his necklace untangled from my net when I addressed just W_T_F they thought they were doing. He started to walk to the edge of his boat to address me and his open toed sandal got caught on my web and he tripped. When he collected himself (wincing) he said it wasn't legal to store things on forest service property. I proceeded to get closer so there was no yelling (snatch him by the collar and get his face closer to mine so he didn't have any problems hearing me.) I said I'm glad you're here to give me a hand changing gear, but before we get started you should get on some proper foot wear because I din't want him to get hurt while on the job. Then I asked if sandals were normal work attire on a government work boat. Long story short these 2 helpful government workers helped me change nets. After we were done I made the suggestion that they point their forest service craft toward Whittier and thanked them for the assistance. I'm pretty sure he consulted the aura in his crystal he had hanging around his neck and decided he probably should go back to Vermont and pursue his education.

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    Summation, your dog is a rarity and few have the patience or talent to train a dog how to behave in the outdoors, much less around other distrcations and as a result there is a leash law.

    Have had many good dogs in my life that two were that good. The first a Golden Retriever, the last a Rott Shepherd Mix named Boo. Both demonstrated early on there was no need for a leash and both had never been at the end of a leash their whole lives.

    Boo and I would spend a week camped on the Big Manistee Salmon Fishing. Boo would sit on the bank behind me, though he loved to watch people reel in fish. If somebody close by had a fish on he would sit and look at me. If I knew them I would say OK and away he would go. Wade right out and watch them, then back to his spot.

    He was a great dog. He passes about a year ago and I still miss him. As for the topic..............there should also be a leash law for some kids.

  17. #17
    Member DRIFTER_016's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmusashi2k View Post
    Ah, what I would do for a ride in the Delorean. There was a Delorean in the Soldotna parade the other day!

    Did it come equiped with a Flux Capacitor?

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    I also see both sides of this. As much as people may think it's for the bears or other people and that's a good reason it also could be for the health and well being of the dog. There are a lot of dead salmon along a river bank and dogs are dogs. I know there has been more than one dog that has gotten sick or died from eating on the salmon. It doesn't sound like your dog is that dumb, but as Col Norman Vaughn told me one day over lunch "If you love your dog tie him up"

  19. #19
    Member DRIFTER_016's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by power drifter View Post
    I also see both sides of this. As much as people may think it's for the bears or other people and that's a good reason it also could be for the health and well being of the dog. There are a lot of dead salmon along a river bank and dogs are dogs. I know there has been more than one dog that has gotten sick or died from eating on the salmon. It doesn't sound like your dog is that dumb, but as Col Norman Vaughn told me one day over lunch "If you love your dog tie him up"
    I tie my pooch up when we are on the river but that didn't stop him from chewing on fish carcasses and costing me $500 at the vet in Soldotna.

    I keep him tied up for a couple of reasons. He is still young and inquisitive and I think he could get in to bear trouble plus he likes to visit with other people and I know that not all people love him as much as I do. On the same note I don't like kids and shouldn't have to put up with them running around being noisy, throwing rocks into the river etc. You want to bring your carpet crawling petrie dishes around tie them up or put them in one of thos kiddie cages please.

  20. #20
    Member TMCKEE's Avatar
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    mmusashi2k - I'm sorry to see your thread get pulled off track by those with poor reading comprehension skills. You are clearly stating your frustration at those things that once were, but now are not. I venture to say that we all have something like that, and we are all within our rights to b**** about it as necessary. Mine is the loss of the quail hunting grounds of my youth in AZ that have now been swallowed up by golf courses and housing developments. I've moved on to new hunting grounds but I sure miss those days gone by and mourn the loss of something I held dear.

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