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Thread: .358 Norma Mag loading ? for the experts

  1. #1
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    Default .358 Norma Mag loading ? for the experts

    It looks like I will be inheriting a .358 NM shortly & I've got a couple of questions.
    First, I understand that the 358 NM brass can be made from .338 WM brass. Is this correct?
    If that's the case, can I open the necks with a .358 Win die initially, & then reload using a .338 sizing die & then sizing he neck with my .358 Win die?
    I have a set of 358 Win. dies already that I use for my .358 x .444, & see .338 dies used occassionaly.
    Don't find many sets of .358 NM dies used.
    Vance in AK.

    Matthew 6:33
    "But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you."

  2. #2
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    Default "For the Experts"...?

    Vance,

    Not gonna work! I've been reloading for the 358 Norma since about 1972.

    1. The 358 win dies are too small in the body to allow the 358 Norma to enter.

    2. The 338 WM brass is too short in the head to shoulder dimension and will have excessive case stretching just forward of the belt. Technically the 358 headspaces on the belt but with that much gap in shoulder it will cause early failure of case separation.

    3. 358 Norma brass is available and is about $85/100. Graf & Son has Norma available now. Why mess with the 338, which will fail on the first firing. I know this has been done and with some success, I have done it that's why I don't recommend it.

    4. 358 Norma dies are available, Redding or RCBS for about $45.

    What is your rifle? Not many commercial makers of that caliber. Husky and Schultz & Larsen and Sako are the only ones I have seen. Several custom rifles are around though.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



  3. #3
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    Default

    Thanks Murphy.
    Guys like you ae the reason I ask the questions here.
    I'll check with Graf on the brass. I hadn't found prices like that anywhere.
    Also I'll check into dies again. Checked a few years ago & couldn't find anything under about$80.
    As to the rifle itself, as much as I hate to admit it I don't remember for sure what it is.
    It's a custom the belongs to my brother in law down in AZ. As I recall (not sure though) it was built on a Mauser action. The one thing that sticks out most is that I remember it having a blonde Fajen stock. I hate blonde wood!!!!
    Unfortunately he's lost the sight in his right eye to diabetes & has lost much of the vision in his left too & no longer has any use for the gun.
    When he gets around to shipping it I'll hit you up for some load data.
    I haven't rifle hunted in years, just bow & handgun but I wouldn't mind playing with this one.
    Vance in AK.

    Matthew 6:33
    "But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you."

  4. #4
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    Default Oops!!

    Vance,

    I lied about the brass. Actually typed in the wrong price it should be $85/100, that's what I paid for the last batch. You can also buy it per 20 in a box.

    Also Redding dies are $46.00, my cost plus shipping. I order form Graf every other week and shipping on flat rate priority is about $15 for several pounds. I could include with my stuff and shipping would be minimal. I order brass, bullets and dies from them often.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



  5. #5
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    Default

    I sold my 358 Norma dies along with the last rifle in that caliber. Now I wish I had them back.... I am such an idiot...

    Anyway,, I have bought 358 Norma brass at Mountain iew Sports and at Great Northern Guns up in Los Anchorage...



    The best loads out of my old rifle were 250 grain Speer flat based spitizers.
    79 grains of IMR 4350 gave 2895 fps using Norma Brass and a 250 CCI magnum primer. It was a hot load.

    So I backed it off to 78.0 grains of IMR 4350. This gave me 2,720 fps average. There was only a 9 feet per second spread. This grouped at 2.5 inches at 300 yards.

    This was from a 21.5 inch custom Model 70 Win. With what appeared to be a 1-10 twist. It had a pretty tight chamber and I loaded the OAL just short of the lands.

    I tried the 225 grain Sierra Boat-Tails. But they actually went slower with more powder and they were all over the place for accuracyt in that rifle.

    Norma Factory Loads chronographed at 2685 fps using the factory 250 grain semi spitzer. They were also very accurate at a 1 inch group at 100 yards.



    xx
    Floatplane,Tailwheel and Firearms Instructor- Dragonfly Aero
    Experimental Hand-Loader, NRA Life Member
    http://site.dragonflyaero.com

  6. #6

    Default .358 Norma

    There is a set of Redding dies on Ebay right now. I purchased brass this year from MidWay for I think 100 bucks per 100.

  7. #7

    Default 338 brass

    If you open your necks to 375 then put a ghost shoulder for forming they don't stretch at the base. I used 4350 for yrs then switched to imr 4895 and have had great results loading and shooting. If your going to hunt brown bears the 280 Swift is the way to go.

  8. #8
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    Default

    Thanks for all the help guys.
    I found an outfit called Conley Precision Cartridge that sells ammo at a halfway reasonable price (250 gr Hornady interlocks for $43 or 250 Partitions for $55) so I may buy a couple of boxes of that for my brass.
    I don't shoot rifles much so I'll probably watch for a used set of dies & get into this one cheaply.
    Or I'll do like I usuallydo & order dies & bullets & come up with a good load & then stick it in the closet ;-)

    I will be printing this page for reference data though.
    Thanks again.

    And Murph, if I decide to order dies or brass I'll PM you.
    Vance in AK.

    Matthew 6:33
    "But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you."

  9. #9

    Default 358 Norma Mag

    I've used 338 brass for loading my 358 Norma for 20 years and never had a problem. The only thing is the neck is a little short when expanded but it's no big deal. It will "grow" with firing but by the time its grown into the proper length (about 5-6 full house firings) it will be time to think of pitching it anyway. Winchester 338 brass is tough and I've never lost a case. Norma 358 brass I have used is soft as butter and won't hold near the pressure as resized Winchester brass.
    As for loads, 75.5 gr. of H4350 gives 2810 fps. with a 250 Nosler partiton in my 23" barreled Sako. I usually use a 225 Partition, 69.5 gr. of H4895 for all around use at 2975 fps with sub MOA accuracy. R-19 works for the heavy 280 gr Swifts at 77 gr.at just under 2700 fps. All these are max loads in my rifle. You know the drill. Good shooting.

  10. #10
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    Default

    Then sir there is Neal who has a set of dies and around a hundred pieces of brass for the awesome 358 Norma Mag!

  11. #11
    Member Matt's Avatar
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    Default

    Vance,

    Just a thought, try ebay. That's what works for me when I need brass for my 358 Norma. I have no shortage of brass for that cartridge.

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