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Thread: Closure of Tulusak&Kwethluk Rivers

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    Default Closure of Tulusak&Kwethluk Rivers

    They closed them today do too low counts of kings.
    Every type of fishing is closed.

    Last year it was a disaster in counts for both rivers.

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    WOW. Mind-boggling chinook failures in major drainages statewide.

    Copper River (Klutina, Gulkana)
    Cook Inlet (Anchor, Kenai, Susitna)
    Kodiak (Ayakulik, Karluk)
    Bristol Bay (Nushagak)
    Yukon

    .... and now the Kuskokwim is added to the list.
    "Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." Zane Grey
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    Yep we joined the ranks.
    The state&feds also had comercial fishing this spring and a part of the target was kings.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Badriverman View Post
    Yep we joined the ranks.
    The state&feds also had comercial fishing this spring and a part of the target was kings.
    IT's your Habitat. If you guys would have taken care of your Habitat, you could have escaped the Dreaded Closure. But you, like the rest of us, ignored the warning signs and refused to manage it properly, so you get what you deserve. This is the Official State Fish and Game stance thus far, so there has to be merit to it.
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    Doc, Kenai is not a collaspe and neither is Susitna. Not sure why you listed them. Also, people start to put returns in a short term time frame. This may just be a return to the PDO runs of the past. We will see.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerka View Post
    Doc, Kenai is not a collaspe and neither is Susitna. Not sure why you listed them. Also, people start to put returns in a short term time frame. This may just be a return to the PDO runs of the past. We will see.
    A run filled with Jacks/Dinks and Closure of the vast majority of the drainages, IMO constitute a "collapse". Any way it gets spun, it is a poor, poor year for the Kings.
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    No way is the Susitna River a collapse by any measure. You fail to put effort in perspective with run strength. The word collapse is other emotional word that provides no useful information. Look at the escapement numbers and whether there was a harvestable surplus. Most systems if not all had some harvestable surplus.

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    Nerka,

    Not picking on you, but I'm genuinely curious. How many days a season do you personally spend on any Su system waters? How many years have you spent time during consistent times of the season?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerka View Post
    No way is the Susitna River a collapse by any measure. You fail to put effort in perspective with run strength. The word collapse is other emotional word that provides no useful information. Look at the escapement numbers and whether there was a harvestable surplus. Most systems if not all had some harvestable surplus.
    Surely you jest!!! The Deshka barely met the minimum, ALL the Roadside Fisheries were CLOSED PREMATURELY, others will not meet the minimum, when the final tallies are done this week by arieal surveys. I call that a Collapse. What yardstick are you measuring with?
    "96% of all Internet Quotes are suspect and the remaining 4% are fiction."
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akres View Post
    Surely you jest!!! The Deshka barely met the minimum, ALL the Roadside Fisheries were CLOSED PREMATURELY, others will not meet the minimum, when the final tallies are done this week by arieal surveys. I call that a Collapse. What yardstick are you measuring with?
    Akres, there was harvestable fish taken in every fishery. Single aerial surveys are not very useful if you understood anything about fish counting. Too much pressure on west side streams is due to growth in the valley and Anchorage - they cannot produce enough fish to be sustainable for that size of fishing population. Akres, I think bushrat was talking about you. I see his point.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerka View Post
    Akres, there was harvestable fish taken in every fishery. Single aerial surveys are not very useful if you understood anything about fish counting. Too much pressure on west side streams is due to growth in the valley and Anchorage - they cannot produce enough fish to be sustainable for that size of fishing population. Akres, I think bushrat was talking about you. I see his point.
    Nerka, I agree with and understand a lot of what you say since you have worked in the comm fisheries and know what you're talking about. You've certainly changed my views on the relationship between sport and comm fishing and how each can be viable and sustainable and necessary. That being said, please refrain from the personnal attacks. I know that may sound "touchy feely" and believe you me, I'm prolly one of the last people on this earth to go that route, but this is a place for debate and good B.S.'in about fishing. Thanks for all of your insight into the fisheries though. I've learned a lot in only the past few weeks just keeping an eye on these threads. Keep it up!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akers View Post
    IT's your Habitat. If you guys would have taken care of your Habitat, you could have escaped the Dreaded Closure. But you, like the rest of us, ignored the warning signs and refused to manage it properly, so you get what you deserve. This is the Official State Fish and Game stance thus far, so there has to be merit to it.
    Yes what would you say to the state for bullying the fish board into having commercial fishing when the board wanted to hold off?
    Same with their keeping numbers from the public?

    The state has always done what IT wants too out here.

    Family does not fish those rivers for kings.

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerka View Post
    Akres, there was harvestable fish taken in every fishery. Single aerial surveys are not very useful if you understood anything about fish counting. Too much pressure on west side streams is due to growth in the valley and Anchorage - they cannot produce enough fish to be sustainable for that size of fishing population. Akres, I think bushrat was talking about you. I see his point.
    Nerka, it wasn't the "west side streams" that were affected/closed in the Su Drainage. hmmm...the Bio's sure place a lot of stock in the "single aerial surveys". I think so too. Figured you would, upon reading your posts.

    I'm siding with Pid on this one. Me thinks you have read so many papers that you have trouble seperating the wheat from the chaff. Me also thinks you have vewy leetle time with waders in the water.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badriverman View Post
    They closed them today do too low counts of kings.
    Every type of fishing is closed.

    Last year it was a disaster in counts for both rivers.
    They have not met goals since 2007.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fishNphysician View Post
    WOW. Mind-boggling chinook failures in major drainages statewide.

    Copper River (Klutina, Gulkana)
    Cook Inlet (Anchor, Kenai, Susitna)
    Kodiak (Ayakulik, Karluk)
    Bristol Bay (Nushagak)
    Yukon

    .... and now the Kuskokwim is added to the list.
    That is wrong. The Kuskokwim is open to fishing. The Susitna (at the Deshka where Kings are enumerated) met it's goal. The Kenai met it's goal.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Akres View Post
    IT's your Habitat. If you guys would have taken care of your Habitat, you could have escaped the Dreaded Closure. But you, like the rest of us, ignored the warning signs and refused to manage it properly, so you get what you deserve. This is the Official State Fish and Game stance thus far, so there has to be merit to it.
    Please reference where ADFG has taken the stance that this closure is a result of habitat.

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grampyfishes View Post
    Please reference where ADFG has taken the stance that this closure is a result of habitat.
    OMG: You really do need to get out to the Public Meetings more. There was one last night. Did you miss it?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akres View Post
    A run filled with Jacks/Dinks and Closure of the vast majority of the drainages, IMO constitute a "collapse". Any way it gets spun, it is a poor, poor year for the Kings.
    According to ADFG, a "collapse" would be the decline in abundance to a level that a rebound in abundance is uncertain.

    Akres, I agree that the returns are critically low in some systems, and fishing is poor. But do you have any evidence that the King stocks will not rebound?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Akres View Post
    Surely you jest!!! The Deshka barely met the minimum...
    The Deshka made well above it's minimum at 18,000. Minimum goal was 13,000. The sportfishery was liberalized to bait.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Akres View Post
    OMG: You really do need to get out to the Public Meetings more. There was one last night. Did you miss it?
    You have no idea about my participation. So rather than speculate, why don't you simply back up your claims about ADFG's stance that the Tulusak and Kwethluk closures were a result of habitat? Tell us who said that, and we can contact them and confirm habitat is where we should concentrate our efforts.

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