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Thread: Safety Gear Requirements?

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    Default Safety Gear Requirements?

    I have a 19' 1974 Grumman sq. stern freighter with a 1974 J. Klingel lift and a 1974 Evinrude 9.9 hp (originally) that's been jetted and re-carbed to 15 hp, though the cowling still reads, '9.9' on it.

    Does the CG or State of Ak require that -all- of the safety gear for any standard power boat be also carried in/on such a craft??

    What are the legally required safety items for such a boat.

    I tried to wade through the State's various web sites re. this series of questions, and if they -all- apply to this vessel, I'll need to take it to a welding shop and have it lengthened and widened to stow all the stuff!!

    Flare gun and flares?!

    Life ring(s)?!

    E-kit??!!

    Fire extinguisher??!!

    Air horn/bull horn??!!

    Sherpas to carry all these items when we land, or before we depart??

    Thanks...

  2. #2
    Member Rick P's Avatar
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    Got popped this weekend on this, according to the CG LEO if you don't want a fine you have to meet ALL the safety requirements for any power boat. Including your list and bow and stern lights! Thing is if your smart all this will fit in a small tackle box and you may very well need everything on the list. Here is one way I have saved space, your required to carry a auditory signal device, horn. Nothing in the law says it can't be a whistle, I have one on my key chain, it's with me all the time that way I have it if I need it on the water or land.

    We where required to carry all the stuff in our sea kayaks when I guided as well, seemed like a giant PIA till we needed it!
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    Thanks Rick.

    I knew there was a lengthy list of emergency gear, but I also thought there used to be a beam and hp limitation re. applicability. (i.e., If your boat was narrower/shorter than 'X', and the hp was below 'X' number of ponies, there were exemptions.)

    How much was your ticket, or did they give you the option of coming into their shop later and proving you'd procured the items in question??

    So, did the helpful LEO explain how you're supposed to run bow and stern lights on a canoe with an outboard motor?? Was he helpful in locating water-proof battery housings for the lights, assuming they're magnetic-mount and battery-operated?? (Which is the ONLY thing I can think of to apply in this instance..)

    Whaddaya' s'pose Joe Vogler would've said about the requirement to place a stern and bow light on a Grumman canoe??

    I noted in the regs that it stated that the 'horn' couldn't be a human powered item, which I assumed meant 'voice operated.' I could also see someone losing their ability to force enough air through a whistle to cause it to operate audibly, too.

    I guess I've got my LOUD amplified bull-horn, complete with sirens, and that at least offers the ability to communicate clearly in something greater than mere tone.. But it's also untenably large and voice-operated to some degree...

    I'm not opposed to the canned air horns; it presents an opportunity to 'motivate' my older son in the early morning, as well.

    Aerial flares? I can take them or leave them, as I'm not planning on any ocean voyages right away with the thing, and aside from the imagery of being stuck on a barren sand bar with no wood, I usually carry fire-proof matches to start a fire with, which would be visible much longer than a flare, and likely present less of a hazzard re. forest fires.

    But a life ring??!! Perhaps I should name the vessel, and get one of the fancy graphics shops to imprint the boat's name on the life ring..

    I've already commented re. their running lights..

    To think that all of this is aimed at keeping me from endangering myself..

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    Member Rick P's Avatar
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    I totally agree with the tone of your post. My ticket was $150, to be forgiven if I come in with the goodies they want me to add.


    He suggested I get a set of the self contained battery powered lights, "like the ones at sportsman's". I do spend a bit of time on salt with my HB so I will use them when the situation warrants it........no you wont see me running the little su lit up like a X Mass tree! I use a white water throw bag instead of a rescue ring, there about the size of a zip lock sandwich bag. The LEO who did my inspection didn't have an issue with the throw bag or the whistle, maybe I got luckier than I thought.
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    Member Rick P's Avatar
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    Almost forgot my Tohatsu, and many others, has a power feed from the motor.........I have a depth finder and a auxiliary power outlet that run off a battery, the battery is charged by the out board.
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    As I move in the direction of a 4-stroke motor, I'll keep in mind the availability of auxiliary plug-ins these days. Hadn't even occurred to me... Like I said, it's a '74! ;^>)

    FYI, over the last hour or so I've been involved in finger-tip store research re. pricing these items and locating them. The variance in pricing can -easily- save a person over $50; maybe even $75, depending on where one looks.

    Also, (and this might be of use to you.. in your current dilemma involving the same issues), I spoke at length with a fellow at a boat shop who runs a 17' Osagian sq. stern canoe with a motor on it, and he'd received a ticket re. bow and stern lights too. He stated that the LEO who wrote him the ticket was incorrect, and he beat the ticket in court. While he indeed had to waste his time in court, the law, per his conference with me, specifically and technically states that the bow and stern 'running lights' must be displayed between the hours of 30 minutes before sundown, and thirty minutes after sunrise. If operating later than 30 minutes after sunrise, and ending operations earlier than 30 minutes before sundown, the lights are -not- required to be displayed... His ticket for the running lights was dismissed!

    I take that to mean the lights don't even have to be present if you're not operating within the time-frame that would require their use. And that's over $60.00 of the list for the c-clamp-style water-proof battery-operated bow and stern lights!!

    FYI.

    And thanks for the help... Seriously. I wasn't going to start calling stores and taking their clerks' time until I knew for sure I needed all this stuff.. And apparently I need most of it..

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    I better go shopping.
    Wasilla Real Estate News
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    I talked to one of the no-lighting victims again today. He said he's seen the tickets go as high as $300.00, depending on how many infractions were involved.

    There's LOTS of folks in the bush who live a suibsistence (or similar) lifestyle for whom a $300.00 fine, or the purchase of a bunch of less-than-necessary gear, would be a bank-breaker.. $300.00 buys a lot of flour, rice, and beans..

    Another friend on the Kenai pointed out earlier today that many of the seiner skiffs that are longer than 15' run no light masts on the bow or stern, as they'd get tangled in nets, and he questioned whether those that run without lights receive citations for this... out on the salt water. Yet they're ticketing canoes!!

    Anyway, the best clamp-on bow and stern lights I've found run on 4 AA batteries, are adjustable for height, are bouyant, water-proof, and apparently offer a replacement LED lamp instead of the Krypton bulb they come with, which likely extends their life-time, per set of batteries, by ~100 times (+/-).

    The cheapo lights that also come with a clamp-on application (available at a well-known dept store) tend to run a standard flashlight bulb on 2 'D' cell batteries per fitting, which, by my experience, means that if you're in a situation wherein darkness requires you to run those lights, you've got roughly 1' 30" maximum before you're either illegal once again, by virtue of a burned out set of batteries, or digging through a 40 lb. ruck sack filled to the gills with 'D' cell batteries...

    I feel safer already...

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    Default Power boat safety stuff

    We have a kit we send out with our rafts and such.
    the kit is a pelican box, in bright orange color.
    it fits all the stuff you need inside.
    I bought the " Shaker" style flashlights that you used to be able to buy at costco etc. so no batteries needed.
    just shake the light for a minute and you have flash light.
    LED bow and stern lights have been already mentioned, and will conserve power like no other...
    Whistle instead of horn... get the plastic kind instead of a metal one,, the plastic will not rust.
    First Aid Kit.. don't skimp and if you buy a premade kit, add some stuff to it that will really aid incase its needed.. for cuts etc... I put extra latex gloves in also, and extra pain medication.. Also a couple of good lighters and some starter material.. in each kit I put 8 each hand warmers/ toe warmers.
    these really do not take up any space but could save a person from hypothermia if you use them right..
    Remember they only work if kept dry..
    Max
    When you come to a fork in the trail, take it!

    Rentals for Canoes, Kayaks, Rafts, boats serving the Kenai canoe trail system and the Kenai river for over 15 years. www.alaskacanoetrips.com

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    Member Rick P's Avatar
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    Max
    Nice too see you again. You just discribed the kit we used to pack for our sea kayaking trips.
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    Smile Required safety equipment

    I really hate to be the one to crash this party/thread....but here's the 'lowdown' on the minimum required safety equipment for a 19' canoe/outboard:

    You must have state registration, proper numbers/sticker and original registration must be onboard.

    You must have a type I, II, III or V wearable CG approved PFD for each person on board and a type IV throwable (seat cushion style works fine)

    You must have a means of making an efficient sound signal (whistle).

    You must have Visual Distress Signals (daytime only - orange distress flag works) or night signals if operating between sunset/sunrise

    You don't need a fire extinguisher if there are no enclosed compartments.

    You need to show appropriate navigation lights when operating between sunset/sunrise or in periods of limited visibility (one all-round white light if running less than 7 knots - a flashlight works).

    Simplified: Wear a life jacket with a whistle, flashlight, distress flag and your registration in the pocket; sit on a seat cushion, have your numbers/sticker on the bow and go boating....
    Last edited by CG Boating Safety; 07-08-2010 at 13:44. Reason: left something out...

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    Member Rick P's Avatar
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    Dose that change when you jump to a 21 footer? Are you required to have the lights on board? I cary more equipment than that and The leo who did my inspection wrote me a $150 ticket for the registration, didn't have the slip in my wallet but the numbers and sticker are in place. He also gave me a warning for no lights or flares in the middle of the day! Sure wish I had gotten a name and badge number, he wasn't on the same page as you.
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    Default Lights in Daytime?

    Maybe the name and badge # are on the ticket ?

    That's totally not cool to get even a warning in daytime for no lights, it's in the regs clearly, unless I guess, he knew you were operating at night, like he asked and you said yes you were. They can call you on non functioning running lights on a Commercial boat in daytime as they are somewhat assured you are operating at night also.

    But on a sport boat, in daytime, in June(?) I would imagine you could call 'em on it if there is still a way to contact the specific guy to ask for sure.

    Thanks CG, for the simplified clarity
    Ten Hours in that little raft off the AK peninsula, blowin' NW 60, in November.... "the Power of Life and Death is in the Tongue," and Yes, God is Good !

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    By all appearances Rick, the State's currently involved in a push of some sort to enforce this issue on -all- boats in excess of 15'. And, as a result, there are apparently -some- LEOs who are not accurately aware of the day vs. impaired visibility/night time issues with the running lights, etc., etc.

    No one in an official capacity told me -anything- re. a simple white light sufficing for running lights, but then, my 'motor vessel' does significantly greater than 7 nauts too.

    I simply find the lack of classification for what are -obviously- limited use craft to be thoughtless and representative of the one-size-fits-all attitude that bureaucracies are so well known for.

    A final example before I give this a rest; I can take a 14' 10" sleek, aerodynamic speed boat on the water with a 65 hp high-performance motor on-board that'll do 100 mph across a smooth surface. According to the regs, I don't have to acquire the majority of the safety gear the CG and State mandate, simply 'cause it's under 15' in length. And, as my firend on the Kenai pointed out, the seiner skiffs aren't hassled (that he knows of).

    But if my boat's over 15', such as the Grumman sq. stern freighter canoe is, I need to satisfy the entirety of the list, with the exception of the fire extinguisher, due to the assumption that if my gas tank is portable and not enclosed, and it catches fire, I can toss it over-board, as opposed to a fixed tank in an enclosed compartment. (And the last time you saw someone manually grab a burning gas tank was.... when???)

    Yeah, yeah I know; "mortorized propulsion is a privledge, not a right," and "if we didn't have government, we'd have anarchy.." (and fewer convictions for corrupted power brokers and gate-keepers..)

    Happy motoring... ;^>)

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    Member Rick P's Avatar
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    Just to be clear the ticket was for lack of the paper registration. He gave me a stern warning about the lights, which I don't have at all yet.

    Totally agree with you though, why give me crap for stuff I don't truly need? Having a bad weekend maybe? I'll have to check the ticket and bring this stuff to the CG attention.
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    Rick:
    PM'd you. Give me a call. Mike

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