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Thread: All other things equal would you rather have a 375H&H or 338WM for big bear and moose

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    Default All other things equal would you rather have a 375H&H or 338WM for big bear and moose

    I apologize in advance as this topic has probably been beaten to death. But I couldnít find what I was looking for by searching so I figured Iíd just ask outright. If someone wantís to just give me the Readerís Digest version of the debate thatís fine.

    Hereís my situation. I have a Winchester 70 Safari Express in 375H&H that Iím selling (on Gunbroker.com if anyoneís interested). I love the 375, but this gun is just too nice and too heavy to use for the kind of hunting Iíd like to do. I toyed with the idea of refinishing it and getting a lighter stock. But it occurred to me that the better move might be to sell it and to get something like a new Remington XCR.

    So now that Iím making a change I thought I would take a minute and revisit the caliber question. I donít need this to be a really versatile rifle. Itís not going to be a ďone gunĒ kind of thing. This would be a gun for big, dangerous critters inside of 200 yards. Mostly what Iíd like to be able to do with it is hunt moose and bears.

    Having said that, whatís the consensus on the 338WM vs. the 375H&H? All other things being equal which of these calibers would you rather have for this kind of hunting? Is there anything the 375 will do that the 338 won't, or vice-versa? Is there any other cartridge I should be thinking about?

    Thanks,

    Ben

  2. #2

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    You're kinda asking us to split your hairs lengthwise. Fans of each will put them forth but nuthin will be solved for you.

    I love the 375, but it's second on my list and the 338 is third. My favorite is the 358 Norma, which falls nicely between the two and offers features of both. Is it better? Nah. If I had all three calibers in identical rifles, I'd close my eyes and happily use whichever my hand grabbed first.

  3. #3

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    your current rifle is going to go up in value if it is a decent gun. the caliber you have is a great one for what you are decribing, put a synthetic stock on it and use it. in a few years the safari grades could be worth a pile, the xcr's will prolly be worth what they are today.....food for thought. the key thing in defending yourself against people eaters is getting the bullet in the right place, if the gun you have is too much weight or recoil you better consider that, you stand a better chance killing a bear with a 243 if you get the shots right, then a 375 that you can't get on target with.

  4. #4

    Thumbs up Toss Up

    You already have a 375 and it's too heavy, for a reason: RECOIL. If you lighten this rifle it will only increase it's recoil. This 375 rifle is built on a magnum action which is larger and heavier than a standard long action(338). The 338 will produce a lower recoil pulse than a 375 in the SAME weight. The 338 will produce about 15% less power than a 375 though. As we get older we sometimes are less tolerant of recoil.While shunned by some and overlooked by many a muzzle brake can tame felt recoil to a degree. The dream rifle you seek is out there, look hard. Get the rifle that fits you, not the rifle that people want you to have.

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    Ben is that M-70 a claw extractor M-70 (pre-64 or pre-64 style) or one of the push feed types?

    I love both. (the 358 Norma being my real favorite too) but I would think of making longer shots with a 338 Win Mag.


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    Lightbulb You have the perfect rifle don't sell it...

    The latest Mod 70's in Safari Express were built on the Pre '64 model with new improvements.
    without getting gun-tech on you, I would recomment the 375 Holland & Holland for big Bears.
    The old expression "Go Big or Go Home" is not a bad idea for Dangerous Game. Yes the 338 win mag is very effective. But the 375 is better, stronger, faster to drop a Bear in one shot if hit in the right places both will kill a bear equally as dead!

    Rifles can be viewed in Two categories:

    1. Tools you use

    2. Works of Art you hang on the wall

    Decide if it's a tool and use it, or declare it as an Artistic example of machining and woodworking and sell it and get something you will use as a tool.

    "One mans trash is anothers treasure" holds true in all cases. Some will say hunt the Mod70 others will say keep it nice as an investment piece. The bottom line is don't hunt it if you think you will worry about ruining it. This will spoil a good hunting trip. Trust me on that one been there and done that.
    God, Guns and Guts is what made America Great

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    Thanks guys.

    Float -it's the pre-64 style with the claw.

    I tend to be a beautiful is as beautiful does kind of guy when it comes to rifles. Case in point is that my synthetic stocked guns often have this sticky back sandpaper-like material on them that I buy at marinas. It's meant to put on boat decks or docks so you don't slip. It may look a little funny, but it's a $2.50 way to get something that feels like checkering on a smooth synthetic stock. I like the positive, sure grip over the rifle that it gives me. It tends to wear off over time, but for another $2.50 you can start all over again.

    So I tend to go for function over beauty. But that said, I find that I'm unwilling to sacrifice an already beautiful gun in order to enhance its functionality. I'm also hoping that this gun may have a temporarily inflated value that I can cash in on, what with USRAC not making the model 70s. And going to a $400 Kevlar stock would only solve one problem. I bet that the matte blue on the gun wouldn't stand up to really wet weather without rusting. I guess it just seems silly to spend money making this what I want when for less money I could get something that's already meant for what I want to do.

    I may keep my eye on Ruger's "Alaskan". I'm guessing they'll actually sell in the $750 range. I just don't know about their new 375 Ruger cartridge yet.

    Ben

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    Generally 338's run about a pound lighter than 375's. Thus for a gun to be carried in the field, I'd take the 338. From a performance standpoint, I'd opt for the 375, though the 375 isn't that much more gun than a 338.

    Since I handload and like 35 bores, I got a 350 rem mag. Gives up just a touch of power, but it is shootable in a light gun, which is a good thing.

  9. #9

    Default .375 or .338

    For 30 years I have used a .338 Win. Mag. and 250 gr. bullets for moose and I know it is enough gun for a close encounter with a brown bear. My current Mod. 70 weighs about 8 lbs. I have a Pre-64 .375 that I look at all the time and don't hunt with. It weighs around 9 lbs. If I decide to go chase brown bears on a salmon stream I will take the .375 because it makes a bigger hole and throws heavier bullets better. It is a great brown bear and moose round. The .338 is a very good brown bear round and it is a great moose round. You will probably shoot alot moore moose then brown bears so I would never be without a .338 mag. in Alaska. But the .375 is the worlds best all around caliber so you don't ever want to be with out one!

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    375 HH =
    300 grain slug at 2600 fps for 4504 ft lbs at the muzzle and 3041 ft pounds at 300 yards.

    39.5 ft pounds of recoil at 16.8 ft per second in a 9 pound rifle
    Drops 15 inches between 100 and 300 yards.

    338WM=
    250 grain slug at 2700fps (same length barrel as above) for 4047 ft pounds at the muzzle and 2677 ft pounds at 300 yards

    31.5 ft pounds of recoil at 15 ft per second in a 9 pound rifle
    Drops 14.1 inches between 100 and 300 yards.

    Both using XFB type bullets with rather high BCs
    Floatplane,Tailwheel and Firearms Instructor- Dragonfly Aero
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  11. #11

    Talking Which gun, which gun

    You might as well buy one of each, just like the rest of us. If you're a big bore fan you'll end up with 'em both anyway.....It's just a matter of time.
    RIDE TALL, SHOOT STRAIGHT AND ALWAYS TELL THE TRUTH

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    .375 H&H ballistics

    Federal 300-grain SP (standard factory load, not HM nor HE)
    Muzzle = 2530 fps/4265 foot-pound
    100 yd = 2270 fps/3425 foot-pound. Drop = +2.6"
    200 yd = 2020 fps/2720 foot-pound. Drop = 0.0"
    300 yd = 1790 fps/2135 foot-pound. Drop = -11.2""
    400 yd = 1580 fps/1665 foot-pound. Drop = -33.3"
    500 yd = 1400 fps/1308 foot-pound. Drop = -69.5"
    ------------------
    .338WM ballistics with a similar bullet

    Winchester 250-grain SP
    Muzzle = 2650 fps/3899 foot-pound
    100 yd = 2467 fps/3378 foot-pound. Drop = +2.1"
    200 yd = 2291 fps/2914 foot-pound. Drop = 0.0"
    300 yd = 2122 fps/2500 foot-pound. Drop = -8.7"
    400 yd = 1960 fps/2134 foot-pound. Drop = -25.2"
    500 yd = 1807 fps/1812 foot-pound. Drop = -50.7"
    ----------------------

    The .375 H&H factory load is 30 fps slower than the Nosler 300-grain A-Frame factory load, while the .338WM load is just 10 fps slower than the standard factory load of 2660 fps. With the faster A-Frame load, the .375 H&H bullet hits the 500-yard mark 2" higher, or -67.3"

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    This poor old dead horse........

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    Buy a odd caliber and throw everyone off your trail.....


    xx
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarge View Post
    You might as well buy one of each, just like the rest of us. If you're a big bore fan you'll end up with 'em both anyway.....It's just a matter of time.
    You are so correct!
    Tennessee

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    Default This may help you decide


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    If you can shoot it well the 375 no doubt...

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    I always wondered ,,,how many brown bears does a guy really shoot .I have never shot one,but if I ever do its gonna have to be a beauty,because I think one is enough.Im more of a meat hunter,So ill stick with my .300 magnum,which is plenty for moose and caribou.I dont see just buying a gun for brown bears in my case......Uh -oh,, I opened another can of worms...LOL.my bad.

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    Yea, you might have dan. I vote .375H&H and I've used mine on caribou, black tails and black bears also. I take it when there's a good chance of running into a big bear or the bear running into me. But I totally agree, one brown/grizzly will be enough for me personally.

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    Quote Originally Posted by danthedewman1 View Post
    I always wondered ,,,how many brown bears does a guy really shoot .I have never shot one,but if I ever do its gonna have to be a beauty,because I think one is enough.Im more of a meat hunter,So ill stick with my .300 magnum,which is plenty for moose and caribou.I dont see just buying a gun for brown bears in my case......Uh -oh,, I opened another can of worms...LOL.my bad.
    In reality, most bears killed by hunters in Alaska are killed with "all around' rifles such as the .30-06, .300WM, and .338WM. The reason is simple: most Alaska hunters are not hunting bears, but moose, caribou, deer, etc., and kill the occasional bear that for whatever reason gets close enough. If you can shoot your .300 well, that's the best rifle you can use. My favorite is the .338WM because that's the only big game rifle I have and use, but there is nothing wrong with your .300WM.

    The poll (link that a previously posted) shows the most popular cartridges in Alaska.

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