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Thread: How does live bait kill fish??

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    Default How does live bait kill fish??

    Reading the rules and regs for fishing and hearing people talk on hear about it. I keep hearing that catching fish with live bait increases the chances of the fish dying once it's released... i just can't understand why? -sorry for the noobish question..

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    Member Gr is for Greg's Avatar
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    Default My thoughts:

    This is just my opinion / observation: a fish caught with bait is more likely to swallow. I've fished trout with worms plenty of time, and the best way to get them (if you're planning on keeping them) is to let them play with it long enough for them to move past nibbling and take the whole thing down the gullet. When the hook is down their throat, it's very hard to remove without killing the fish. You're not even supposed to try if you don't want to keep it; it's recommended to cut the line and release the fish hook-in. That's why hooks are required to be un-coated steel or something else that will rust out relatively quickly.

    On the other hand, I'd say most / all fish I've caught on flies have been hooked in the mouth somewhere. They may hammer the fly, but they don't tend to try and throw it back right away. I have not done much fishing with lures, actually, so I'd be interested to see if it's the same with those.

    Anyway, I claim to be no expert on fishing, period, so I may be way off.

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    Well live bait as in live fish is a good way to introduce invasive species to an area.

    Bait is a good way to get a fish to swallow a hook, and hook placement is the primary factor in catch and release mortality. Fish caught on bait tend to be hooked in the gills, throat and tongue, whereas fish caught on lures tend to be hooked in the lips. Fish hooked in the gills throat and tongue tend to die after release, fish hooked in the lips don't.

    Also some egg cures have been shown to kill juvenile salmonoids in aquaria
    I choose to fly fish, not because its easy, but because its hard.

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    Default

    thanks guys, i guess that makes since... so im assuming that if the fish is hooked in the lip, the chances of survival are the same then?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Abu_Garcia View Post
    thanks guys, i guess that makes since... so im assuming that if the fish is hooked in the lip, the chances of survival are the same then?
    A fish hooked in the lip will probably get away without any significant harm, especially if you crimp the barb on the hook. But even if you keep the barb on your hooks, it's still relatively easy to remove the hook with a good pair of forceps. The fish's lips seem to be made of cartilage or something like it. There's not a lot of blood flow, so you don't get much if any blood when you take the hook out. It makes hole in the fish's mouth that looks like it's about as serious as an earring.

    A hook in the back of the throat, and the fish is probably going to be bleeding just from the fight to bring it in. Try to remove it, and you make it worse, lots of blood. And yeah, like Powder Monkey says, bait-caught fish get the hook in the gills a fair amount as well. You don't have to rip too much gill on a fish before they're a goner. It's like taking a shot in the lungs, basically. Lots of blood flow. I've had fish with hooks in the gills die on the line.

    So no, fish caught in the lips do just fine as long as you remove the hook without tearing them up. Even fish that have fought through snags on the back, side, and face seem to do okay, although it's not pretty. Back of the throat or gills, though, and it's lights out.

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  6. #6

    Default Circle hooks

    If you plan on using bait then give the fish a break and use circle hooks. It sticks them mainly just in the lips. Just ask all those halibuts with sore lips. I am now tying all my MOAL leeches and dolly llamas with circle hooks and all my other streamer patterns as well. Tight lines.

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    Default Let us know how that works out....

    I've been curious about the use of circle hooks for that purpose.....the way a circle hook is intended to work is to essentially leave the throat or gut and eventually work into the jaw as the line is tightened....but, as all the halibut guys say...if you set the hook normally...you pull it out of their mouths...so does thishave to do with the ball of bait on the hook...or the hook itself.

    Kinda of hijack, but I am looking forward to someone trying it and reporting,

    Thanks

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    Member ak_powder_monkey's Avatar
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    I think in some areas barbless circle hooks are the only legal way to use bait (Puget sound maybe )
    I choose to fly fish, not because its easy, but because its hard.

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    If your going to fish catch and release,ive always just crimped my barbs shut and even clipped two of the hooks off the treble.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ak_powder_monkey View Post
    I think in some areas barbless circle hooks are the only legal way to use bait (Puget sound maybe )

    I debarb all of my hooks except for the ones on my subsistence skate.
    Now what ?

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    Default What About Scent?

    Thanks guys for clearing that up for me...

    What about scent, i heard somewhere (don't remember where) that scent is considered live bait??? Please tell me thats not true!

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    Member ak_powder_monkey's Avatar
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    yup any scent you put on your lure to attract fish is considered bait
    I choose to fly fish, not because its easy, but because its hard.

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    Default Gets interesting...

    You can't use scent as an attractant in waters closed to bait fishing, but to the original question of how bait kills fish, I would be interested to know whether applying scent to a fly or lure increases the odds of the fish swallowing it.

    So from a question of legality, if you are fishing in waters closed to bait fishing, you may not use a scent attractant. But, if you are fishing waters open to bait fish, but are intending to catch-and-release, is there a problem using scent? I wouldn't know - I've never used a scent.

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    There would be no problem catching and releasing with a scented (or baited) lure in a bait allowed area....your intent is not tied to what's on the end of your line. (pun intended).

    As to scent and what it can do on an artificial fly (but aren't they all?). I once was fishing for rainbows on a nice southwestern AK stream in late August (bait allowed). The fish were full full full full full...did I mention they were full, very slow fishing even though I could see them. Well, I had a little bottle of shrimp scent in my salmon bag from which I put a big squirt of it on my flesh fly....first through 6th cast was WHAMMO. A hooked fish on each cast, and throughout the evening as the "bite" continued, many of them were deeper than I care for. I haven't done it since, but rest assured, anything scented will cause deeper hookups.

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