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Thread: Herculiner off of a Scott canoe

  1. #1
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    Default Herculiner off of a Scott canoe

    I posted a thread last year about trying Herculiner on the bottom of a canoe to protect it from rocks. No one that I could find anywhere had done it to the whole canoe, so I tried it. Summary: Don't waste your time, unless you're doing it for casual beach landing now and then. For a loaded canoe coming down stream and hitting gravel bars, it is not tough enough. So today's lesson is on how to remove the Herc. After many hours and a variety of electric and hand tools, I finally discovered how (relatively) easy it is. Cover whatever you want to get the Herculiner off of with thick rags. Soak the rags w/ gas. Cover w/ visqueen and seal up somewhat. Come back in the morning and start scraping w/ a sharp, 1" wood chisel, or the like. The Herc should be pretty soft. If it is real thick and still hard, soak it again and wait. The thin layer that the chisel leaves can be sanded off later, after it re-hardens. Herc is not designed to come off, so you'll have to fight a bit, but the gas makes is 20 times easier than plain Herc. It did stick to the canoe pretty dang well. It looks, acts, smells, etc, like a glorified tar, and it probably says on the can that it is a petroleum based product. I had no can around, and no one who carries it was open when I started, so I just used T&E. Now that my canoe is clean again, I am going to have a place in Anch spray on some RhinoLiner HardLine. It is a much harder, tougher product. Results will be posted after beating it up. j

  2. #2

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    Interested on how this works if only for a skid plate on front,rear, and keel area.

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    Default casual only

    Light duty use only, in my experience.

  4. #4

    Default how about splash zone epoxy

    I use it for the stern and bow. It seems to work well.
    You wouldn't want to coat the whole thing but it's good for patching and for certain areas that take a lot of abuse.
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    Default canoe?

    Marty: What canoe, and how are you using it? Loaded heavily, running into gravel bars at fair speeds, or just beaching, etc. That would be good to know. Thanks. j

  6. #6

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    Did it slow the canoe down. Would like to put it on the keels only.

  7. #7
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    Default did me

    I am sure that it slowed me down, as that much rough surface HAD to be a bit bad. Unfortunately, I did not run the canoe beforehand; in a hurry. I don't think you'd notice a whole lot on the keels only, unless you are paddling. Try to apply it without the stippled roller, if you can, but that may not pick up the rubber chips in the mixture. I applied it by the book, and it was naturally pretty rough. If you clean and sand paper the fiberglass, I think it will stick well; it sure did to mine.

  8. #8
    Moderator Alaskacanoe's Avatar
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    Default bed line spray ( rhino hide)

    I use the bed liner type spray on the keel line of my rental canoes.
    you have to get someone that sprays the stuff commercially to do it for you, as it is a two part, mixes at the spray nozzle and is heated to about 185 degrees as it comes out.
    they can spray this material smooth so it does not create any drag.
    1/4 inch thick is more than enough and may be more than needed.
    they tape off the keel with the tape that has dental floss in it, so it will cut a perfect edge as it comes off.. you have to pull the tape immediate as sprayed before it gets fully set,, ( less than a few minutes)
    I have used this for several years now with not one single failure.
    the material adheres to several materials. including polyethylene ( coleman/pelican) Royalex, fiberglass etc.
    it seems to have an expansion rated during temperature changes that move faster or in concert with the expansion and contraction of the materials the boat is made from.
    I have had very little success repairing poly or royalex canoes in the past, but this seems to work and extremely tough.
    after 3 years of rentals there is absolutely no wear,
    any canoe without this treatment has keel damage.
    The reason I know this is because when I have not been able to spray one, I have damage in just a few trips with rentals/////// my man that sprays the material, I do it for several canoes at once.
    last time I did it I had about a dozen canoes sprayed. this is the only way I can afford the process, as he was able to do all of them at once. the price per canoe was about 130 bucks or so.. or about the same price as the kevlar keels you can purchase from REI etc.. but for my money,, the bed linder material is much better.
    Max
    When you come to a fork in the trail, take it!

    Rentals for Canoes, Kayaks, Rafts, boats serving the Kenai canoe trail system and the Kenai river for over 15 years. www.alaskacanoetrips.com

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    Default way different

    Max: That is a way different process than painting something on yourself, like I did, and it sounds like a very different product. Two-part, and heated sounds like it would give an entirely different animal. What brand is this stuff, and what specific material of that brand? And, if you don't want to say publicly, PM me w/ the name of the place that does it. I looked at one company's stuff in town, and it was not very hard, as I recall. The Rhino HardLine that I got a sample of seemed much tougher. I'll have to take the sample downtown and compare them side by side. The only place I know of that sprays the Rhino is in Anch; Total Truck, maybe? Pls advise. Thanks. john

  10. #10
    Moderator Alaskacanoe's Avatar
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    Default not rhino hide brand

    you are right, it is not from the Rhino hide brand, and according to the fellows at the truck shop in Anchorage, and also my neighbor that did my canoes. you can get many different types of spray liner materials.
    The fellow that does my jobs for me is in the industrial lining business and does lots of oil field jobs etc. He has told me the specif name of the product, but I did not absorb the information very well... lol
    anyway, the fellow that does my jobs is Tony Bosela from Sterling here on the Kenai. He is in the phone book.
    I will be having about 14 of my new Scott canoes done this June,( about june 22nd) and anyone wanting to be in getting yours done, can just email me.
    like i said, he charged me about 130 per boat last time, and I did lots of the labor in prep. I wash the canoes, then use MEK cleaner or Acetone,,(can't remember now which one), and then we used the Brown Scotch brite pads to rough up the area we were spraying on each canoe. then be tapped them off and put brown paper on the canoe surfaces we did not want exposed. Then he went to work doing a canoe at a time.
    moving the canoes into his garage and onto saw horses. He would spray and then quickly removed the tape with the dental floss in it to make the clean edge, and then brought in the next canoe.. It takes about 3 guys keeping really busy to do the job in short order..
    Tony is very particular about his work and does great job.
    I am going to ask him this time to spray as minimal as possible.
    because the material was so tough, it showed no wear, and I think I could go about half the thickness this time.. about 1/8 inch ..
    anyway.. call Tony if you like.. he does not come here on this site and he is not trying to hunt up some business here.. you asked for information and I am passing it along..
    P.S
    last year I had a canoe that I sold to a great fellow from Anchorage. the canoe needed some fixing due to a scout troop getting the canoe too close to a campfire... ( Roylex material) and it was really messed up in the area were the heat got close. My neighbor Tony was not available to spray the canoe,so we took the canoe to a shop in Anchorage to have them spray some bedliner material over the affected area.
    the amount the fellows at that shop wanted was way to much for my liking. It was like $250 bucks to spray an area about 16 inch square..
    they had us over a barrel though, because the fellow that bought the canoe wanted to use it right away, and it was to far for me to take it back to Sterling and try and coax Tony into the spray job.. so I split the difference with the good fellow and he had them spray it with the bedliner material they were using..
    I won't divulge the name of the outfit in Anchorage that did the job, but I was not impressed with their attitude and when I suggested a few ideas about how I have used similar products and how I prep the canoe before spraying, I was met with condisending looks and little or no response.
    The good fellow that bought the canoe from me is a active military that has served in the gulf defending our country and bringing change to that part of the world.. he is one of our hero's . He was met with as much the same disrespect from the fellows at the shop we were at, and it was all I could do to stop myself from loading that canoe up and taking it elsewhere.. were it not for his desire to get in the canoe done the next day for some duck hunting,, I would not have let those fellows work on the boat...
    I did not hear of any problems and I asked that he call me if it did not work,,,,,,, It must be just fine, or I would have heard...
    Max
    When you come to a fork in the trail, take it!

    Rentals for Canoes, Kayaks, Rafts, boats serving the Kenai canoe trail system and the Kenai river for over 15 years. www.alaskacanoetrips.com

  11. #11

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    Sounds like the stuff Max uses is the best alternative for most applications.

    The zspar splash zone is very expensive. Here is the link http://www.go2marine.com/product.do?no=79357F

    But if you are going on an extended trip and need to make repairs, it is very hard to beat. It is TOUGH. But I sure wouldn't want to coat the entire bottom, or even the entire keel. You could buy another canoe for the cost of doing that. However, for the stern where it takes a lot of hits with rocks its hard to beat.

    My canoe is fiberglass, but I haven't found anything it won't adhere to . It's really an epoxy putty material, you form it with your hands and fingers, you don't paint it on. It can be applied on a wet surface, even under water.
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  12. #12

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    I have looked at Max,s canoes and the stuff works. You can hole your canoe in one trip down the Swanson, the black rocks and dark water make it a obstacle course. The canoe paint on the rocks helps somewhat. I will be bringing my Scott down this spring let me know if you got some lined up to do?

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