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Thread: BOG Proposals

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    Moderator Daveinthebush's Avatar
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    Default BOG Proposals

    I just read the entire proposal booklet and came up with these that might be of interest to some. Since I only hunt 6 and 13 they were the ones I knew the most about.

    Pro. 86 page 81 limit non-resid. to 1 deer unit 6
    Pro. 80 page 83 eliminate shooting bears from boats in unit 6
    Pro. 29 page 18 allows guides to register 6 bear bait
    stations in unit 6.
    Pro. 114 Page 106 archery season moose unit 13
    Pro. 117 Page 108 CLOSE MOOSE SEASON in Unit 13 -T-II only
    Pro. 160 Page 153 reguire guide/client agreement prior to draws in unit 13 sheep.

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    Member Chisana's Avatar
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    Default

    I was just reading the proposals earlier today as well. The Chugach sheep proposals are interesting. Instituting a drawing hunt for sheep in 13D would limit me since I hunt there every other year or so, but I think the quality of the hunts there will skyrocket if a drawing is adopted. One concern I have is for spill over effects. Where will displaced hunters go, or will they choose to not hunt and wait to draw?

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    Member fullkurl's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Chisana View Post
    I was just reading the proposals earlier today as well. The Chugach sheep proposals are interesting. Instituting a drawing hunt for sheep in 13D would limit me since I hunt there every other year or so, but I think the quality of the hunts there will skyrocket if a drawing is adopted. One concern I have is for spill over effects. Where will displaced hunters go, or will they choose to not hunt and wait to draw?
    Excellent points, F.

    Indeed the quality should improve. We might see book rams annually there, the area has yielded fine rams in the past.
    As for "spill over?" well, its probably more like "move over!"

    Question: Can guides hunt the same draw areas year after year if they are contracted? Are they subject to some special requirement to hunt special permit areas year after year?


    Frank

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    I like the one about tier2 moose in 13. what a joke, it would remind me of...ummm....oh I dont know, maybe the nelchina caribou hunt. Where the the real hunters hunt (about 10%) and the rest are liars.

    If they are even thinking of changing it (luckily these are just proposals), they gotta make it a draw.

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    Member Chisana's Avatar
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    Frank,

    I think you are right about moving over! I believe any guide could register to guide in drawing permit areas, but am not sure if that is what you were asking about.

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    Member ak_powder_monkey's Avatar
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    Dangit they didn't look at my proposal to allow hunting in the Eagle River valley with shotguns that are breachloading. Lame
    I choose to fly fish, not because its easy, but because its hard.

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    Member tccak71's Avatar
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    Unhappy Link, BOG Meetings

    Can someone post a link to these proposals? I am especially interested in the 13 moose. That would be devastating to me. Been hunting there too long to go down without a fight.

    Anyone know when the BOG meeting are this year?

    Tim

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    Member bushrat's Avatar
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    Default proposal link

    Tim, here ya go; it explains when the meetings are held too.
    http://www.boards.adfg.state.ak.us/g...ok-March07.pdf

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    Member tccak71's Avatar
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    Default Thanks Mark

    Appreciate the link (I still need to look at it though). Honestly, I'm not familiar with the process and I'm scared to death to see 13 go to Tier II or a draw. Has there been any recent aerial surveys in 13? I can't believe that the moose population is so depressed that it would require eliminating a general season.

    Tim

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    I do not envision the BOG adopting a Tier II only hunt in GMU 13. According to the harvest data available online and the 2004 Moose Management report, the hunting pressure has declined from 6110 hunters in 1996 to 3472 in 2002. According to the 2006 data, there were only 2,640 hunters, so pressure has decreased. Subsistence users also have Federal subsistence hunts in GMU 13. Albeit the moose population has declined, however, it does not yet warrant a restriction in hunters.

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    Member tccak71's Avatar
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    Thumbs down Draw?

    Are you kidding? Why not keep it open with a general season hunt? Why would anyone want it to go to a draw? All a draw does is limit everyone's opportunity to moose hunt. I don't get it.

    Tim

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    Member Alasken's Avatar
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    Look at who wrote the proposal tccak71.

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    Member tccak71's Avatar
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    Default Ahtna

    wrote it, I saw that. I'd rather not take it laying down though. I'd rather fight it all the way and prevent Tier II and/or a draw.

    Tim

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    Forum Admin Brian M's Avatar
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    Doesn't Ahtna already have plenty of land that only they can hunt on without an access permit? Seems like that would be enough territory to ensure that their shareholders are able to hunt moose to their hearts content.

    Boy, if this proposal makes any headway, I'll be right there with you Tim. Antler restrictions are already in place to prevent overharvest. There is no need to move to a Tier II or drawing.

    -Brian

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    Forum Admin Brian M's Avatar
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    Does anyone know what % of proposals are typically adopted? Just a ballpark average figure? I'm under the impression that the vast majority are shot down, but I'm not certain on that.

    -Brian

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    no one hunts moose in my guide area, and there used to me alot of good bulls back in there about ten years ago. in about 20 hours of flying each year and 10 weeks in the moose country each year, i see about a half dozen moose and maybe one bull. maybe. and there been no resident or non res hunting pressure in that area for years. moose still seem to drop or hold steady at population...six. thats upper unit 13. its gone to pot for moose and it certianly isn't the hunters that are doing it.
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    Member chrisWillh's Avatar
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    Would more preditor controll be called for then? My family usualy hunts in 13A and we usualy get at least bull a year, but we do see a few other hunters.

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    Member BRWNBR's Avatar
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    i'm trying to control the predators, took ten bears outa there last year, six black and four grizz and saw another three or four dozen at least.
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    Member bushrat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B_M
    Does anyone know what % of proposals are typically adopted? Just a ballpark average figure? I'm under the impression that the vast majority are shot down, but I'm not certain on that.
    Brian, the BOG proposals remind me in a way of what editors call the "slush pile." If you send in a manuscript to a publisher, and you aren't known or have an "in," it goes in this giant slush pile. Editors eventually weed through this, because they know there may be some good stuff amidst the overwhelming majority of crud.

    Since anyone can submit a proposal to the Board, the board has the same problems that editors face, having to weed through all the slush.

    Whenever I first read the proposal booklets, I go through all the proposals from ACs, ADFG and Public Safety, and various orgs or agencies. These are the ones that are likely viewed with more scrutiny by an overworked Board. They're the ones that are "known" from the past. Then it's a matter of going through the proposals sent in by individuals. A few are darn good, well researched, logical. Most are pretty far out in left field, shooting for the moon so to speak.

    Proposals like # 117 by the Ahtna Subsistence Committee have as much chance of passing as I do in becoming the next governor <grin>. Actually, it's far more likely I'll be the next governor than it is they are going to make Unit 13 a Tier II hunt only!

    When editors go through the slush pile, they say they can generally tell within the first paragraph if something is good or not. The first line of 117 says "Eliminate the general moose hunt in Unit 13."

    I imagine when Board members read that, they bust a gut laughing...then move on to the next one.

    There are some very astute proposals in this batch that I've run across. I've been asking biologists about a possible shift in seasons because of climate changes, warmer falls...I see the guiding-industry org has requested a five-day shift, moving all dates five days later in one unit. Interestingly, they bring up the amount of leaves on willow and alder still present that hinder spotting of moose; last fall was the latest I've seen willow leaves stay on, and warmer weather is definitely affecting hunts and animal movements. I think that is a pretty astute proposal, even though it may be grounded in what benefits a particular industry.

    There is also a proposal by a good friend of mine that seeks to ensure us hunters have maximum opportunity to hunt goats in future, by managing these ungulates like we do others and limiting the take of females via education and harvest requirements. Also, darn astute proposal. I will leave it to others to look that one up <grin>.

  20. #20
    Member martentrapper's Avatar
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    Default

    Having a tier 2 hunt in any area of alaska is NOT really dependant on a BoG proposal. Tier 2 is goverened by specific population vs. demand figures. Each area, sometimes by unit, sometimes by sub unit, is determined to have an "amount necessary for subsistence". I assume some areas of the state, like unit 14 around Anch. might not do this, but most of the state does. So F&G and the BoG decide how many of the species are needed to meet subsistence needs. This is an important figure, and it can be changed, generally by the BoG.
    Through population surveys, each area is then assigned an "allowable surplus". This number is set by F&G.
    As long as the "allowable surplus" (AS) exceeds the "amount necessary for subsistence"(ANS) a given area cannot go into tier 2. This is goverened by state law. As the AS comes close to the ANS, registration hunts, draw hunts, and other methods may be used to lower the human harvest. If AS falls below ANS then, by law, the area must go into tier 2. F&G will generally make the proposal to go into tier 2.
    For ahtna or any other group to convince the BoG to take an area into tier 2, they must convince the BoG that the ANS number for that area is too low. Since ahtna, or anyone else, can't control the AS number, their only chance is to try and alter the ANS number.
    Any of you interested in that particular proposal I suggest talking to the area bio, and seeing what F&Gs stance on this whole thing is.
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