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Thread: You're kidding, right?

  1. #1
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    Default You're kidding, right?

    As much as we're reminded to keep this forum Alaska hunting posts only, and there's an advertisement for the Lighted Night Frisbee.......do I feel another book in the works???????? 50 Best Games To Play In Camp......Uh, While Hunting In Alaska(want to stay on topic).

    Unbelieveable!

    Joe Lothian, Sr.
    Anchor Point, Alaska
    Where there's a hobble, there's hope.

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    Default

    I did a double take on that myself!

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    Member dwhunter's Avatar
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    Default Ads

    It looks as though they are paid sponsor links. I can say from maintaining my own website and while I do it myself it is not cheap, monthly fees, my time etc. I would bet that paying to join this board would be an option if these banner ads were not posted.

    Doug

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    Default Sigh...

    Quote Originally Posted by ovis
    As much as we're reminded to keep this forum Alaska hunting posts only, and there's an advertisement for the Lighted Night Frisbee.......do I feel another book in the works???????? 50 Best Games To Play In Camp......Uh, While Hunting In Alaska(want to stay on topic).

    Unbelieveable!

    Joe Lothian, Sr.
    Anchor Point, Alaska
    Yeah. I hear you. I had hoped the ads would be on target. It could be that I need to tweak the internal page characteristics so that it is more clear to the advert provider what the website is about. The ads should be contextual, providing clues to useful goods and services for people in the conversation.

    As dwhunter pointed out, it's important to make a reasonable return from the website, and we're working on that. We'll be experimenting with various ways of doing this as we go along.

    BTW, we are considering a supporter system. I hadn't considered the possibility of setting it up advert free. Good idea.

    Thanks for bringing this up. David

  5. #5
    Member bushrat's Avatar
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    Default Advertising

    David,

    Not only are some of the ads entirely off-base, but many are for questionable (yet legal) "hunting" enterprises. One ad I followed says the Mulchatna herd is at half a million animals and that guide claims 100% success rate. Another advertises for high-fenced hunts of monster whitetails in which you pay a penalty if you decide to shoot a buck under a certain score.

    What would it cost in terms of "supporter" sponsorship to do away with these ads? If we all paid $10/year to support this site, could you do away with them? I wonder how members might feel about paying to be a part of this site...thoughts?

    Best, Mark

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    Default money

    Mark,

    Good post & idea. I followed the same whitetail advertisement and it smells.......most livestock lots do........I guess we overlook the fact that these sites, like AOD, are here to make money first, and the better the information, offered for free by "members," the more hits the site gets and the more money the owner makes. Wouldn't be surprised to see an SCI ad before it's all over with. Folks do most anthing for money.

    Mark, you know, one of those Lighted Night Frisbees would be just the thing to get you through those long winter nights up there. Snowshoe frisbee is gonna be big; I can see it now. Hopefully they'll have the Northern Lights or Aurora Borealis model for us Alaskans

    Mr. Johnson, ethics are important in more than just hunting!

    Joe Lothian, Sr.
    Anchor Point, Alaska
    Where there's a hobble, there's hope.

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    Default geez!

    Now we have Doctor Scorecard........great Alaska Hunting topic.

    Mark, now that I've thought a bit more about it, why should we, as "members," have to buy off the ethics of others??????? Makes us just like them, eh?

    Joe Lothian, Sr.
    Anchor Point, Alaska
    Where there's a hobble, there's hope.

  8. #8
    Member Adventures's Avatar
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    Default money

    The time and cost and effort that it must take to run a board this popular must be pretty substantial. Can't we put up with a few lighted frisbee adds and doctors adds? If people are willing to pay to advertise thier items here so that we may be allowed to continue to use this board to lean, make new friends, and sometimes even make a little money ourselves through the word of mouth or the classifieds section I say so be it. I have a very small website for my hunt/fishing booking business and it takes loads of maintenance i can only imagine the work that is done to this board let alone the new system, probably had to update his servers to make room for us to post our pictures and things.
    However, I do agree that the product or service should be ethical. I'm not a supporter of fenced hunts, and they certainly need to recalculate the numbers for the Mulchatna herd. I can possibly see the 100% success depending on how many clients they take out a year. Weather or noth they were trophys or not might be a different story.

    Bring on the frisbees, where do I order?

    Justin

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    Member AKArcher's Avatar
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    Thumbs down <Insert Crying Baby>

    That was a great idea Mark, and I would have to agree with Justin, the cost of running a forum that is this popular (which demands a lot of uptime) is pretty substantial. Hardware/Software/Maintenance/Engineering/Internet Bandwidth.... I would say easily $2-5K per month if not more.

    As far as the ads... Letís get serious about this...

    #1 This site is free for you to join. As noted above, it costs money to run.
    #2 If you donít like it, donít click on/read it.
    #3 Do you cut down the news papers for printing ads you donít like?
    #4 Do we have nothing else to do this summer besides griping about the ads?
    #5 NO ADS may equal NO FORUM, is that what we want???


    I say pay $10/yr and keep the advertisement. If the owners of this site truly have the distribution of Alaskan Outdoor Information as their #1 priority, then we will all gain. With 4000+ members, that $40K would go a long way in supporting this site... then maybe we could see less of the non-hunting/fishing ads, but if they are needed to keep this site up, then so be it.

    Lace up some boots, get a line wet, or crack open a cold one... but griping about ads on a web forum??? Sounds fun eh?

    I guess you can't please everyone in life, and those who "get for nothing" and "ask for everything" are the last on my list of who to please.

    Travis

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    Talking glow in the dark frisbee

    Quote Originally Posted by ovis
    As much as we're reminded to keep this forum Alaska hunting posts only, and there's an advertisement for the Lighted Night Frisbee.......do I feel another book in the works???????? 50 Best Games To Play In Camp......Uh, While Hunting In Alaska(want to stay on topic).

    Unbelieveable!

    Joe Lothian, Sr.
    Anchor Point, Alaska
    Sounds like a good way for some after dark trap shooting.

    -Carnivore

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    Default

    AkArcher,

    We all have opinions......I was just pointing out that everyone has to stay on an Alaskan Hunting topic so why shouldn't the webmaster set the example. I apologize, to you, for having an opinion contrary to yours but certainly respect your opinion without the name calling. I didn't think that was allowed here either......

    Joe
    Where there's a hobble, there's hope.

  12. #12
    Member AKArcher's Avatar
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    Default So hard to get what you mean...

    ...out on the table through a forum....

    I have done this before, so I will go ahead and apologize, I should have sent a PM to you Joe, vs. sending out here. But what I had to say didn't just go for you.(Probably should have started a new thread in "General Discussion" or something of that tone.)

    My apologies also for posting my comment in a way that gave anyone the idea that I was calling names. I was merely saying that it sounds like we (I am a member here as well) are whining about any little things that we find about this forum that doesn't suit our fancy...

    Yes, it is a free country, and yes it is a "free internet", we have the right to say and feel as we choose...

  13. #13
    Member dwhunter's Avatar
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    Default ads

    They should be easy enough to ignore if you do not like them. Now if they were constant pop ups I would then say something should be done.

    Doug

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    Member bushrat's Avatar
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    Default ads and supporter system

    Quote Originally Posted by Ovis
    Mark, now that I've thought a bit more about it, why should we, as "members," have to buy off the ethics of others??????? Makes us just like them, eh?
    Good point, Joe. I wouldn't want to buy off the ethics of others, really.

    I'd pay a reasonable "supporter" fee if it meant I didn't have to see any pop-up ads. I'd pay a reasonable supporter fee just to "pay to play," really. There is absolutely no way I'd pay to support this site if I still had to view pop-ups and I don't care whether that pop-up was for the most ethical hunting guide business on the planet or just the opposite. So, Travis, I'll have to respectfully differ in opinion on that.

    Joe made a good point; what's with the ads that have nothing to do with hunting? And I took it step farther; what's up with the ads that lead to questionable practices or outfits?

    Seems the bottom line is that, as David said, he needs to make a reasonable return from this site. I don't begrudge him that at all. I am not up on how these things work...perhaps David has little or no control on any hunting ads that appear, and in future we could have "Hunt Monster Mulies on 80 High-Fenced Acres in South Texas---100% Guaranteed SCI Record Book Entry"

    If that is the case, David, then I don't envy the finer details of having to fund the website <grin>. This is a work in progress. I'm sure bugs need to be worked out. Things tweaked. I'm open to a supporter system. I recognize that advertising contributes to the viability of the site. I have no problem with ads purchased by Alaska outfits. If it were me, I'd never (and I mean NEVER) allow advertising over which I had no control. But that's just me. Newspapers and magazines won't allow just any ads either. They have to meet standards of what they consider are okay for their subscribers, and what they, the owners, feel meets their own standards. Traditonal Bowhunting magazine won't publish atv ads, for example. They have a certain standard they uphold. You can't compare newspaper ads to internet pop-up ads that show up in the middle of a thread, beaming a flashing flashing flashing, mesmerizing off-and-on icon or symbol or whatever. I want to read what people have to say. I don't want it interrupted by some flashing ad to fill out a Dr. Scorecard.

    Just my opinion. Not real excited about it but appreciate Joe bringing it up.

    Mark


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    Default Adverts and where they come from

    There are two types of ads on our system currently, those we generate locally (these are 234 x 60 graphic ads for Alaska businesses) and those that come from an international provider.

    The latter we have relatively little control over. These are selected by software that attempts to match the advertising with the discussion.

    At its best, we get relevant advertising that provides clues to useful goods and services. At the other end of the spectrum, we get....well, you probably see my point.

    It would be nice to provide these forums as a public service, but we are not able to do that. Consequently, we are always looking for appropriate ways to provide some return. These are the best mechanisms we have found to date.

    You have probably noticed that we have been experimenting with various ways of providing advertising. The experiments will likely continue.

    I appreciate all perspectives on this. I don't have all the answers on this, for sure and I'm open to changing things around to make things better.

    David

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    Default

    I think it's fair to pay to play, but send the right message through your advertisements.......I also don't expect or ask for this to be a public service......there are many other popular websites w/advertisements that are hunting oriented although I've noticed a trend toward fenced hunts on some of these sites, too.......I'm sure Mr.Johnson was aware of the costs of operating a website before taking that giant step.......he has made great improvements and I appreciate those improvements......I believe the ads that I openly have questioned make the site look like so many others when this site is supposed to be showing Alaska in a great light from an ethical, outdoorsman's perspective........as silly as they look,if you want lighted frisbees with a glowing image of Elvis, fine.......if you want an SCI style record book for doctors, fine......but fenced hunts smell and make us all look bad......no way to defend that ethically or otherwise unless you just don't care about the future of hunting and are just concerned about making a buck.

    AkArcher,

    No need to PM me, I'm no shrinking violet......if you've got something to say, say it........ask me a question, expect an answer.......no hard feelings here.

    Mr. Johnson,

    I'd happily contribute to this site, but the fenced hunting ads would have to go first......no problem here with you making a buck, but I do have a problem w/those ads making us all look bad.

    Joe Lothian, Sr.
    Anchor Point, Alaska
    Where there's a hobble, there's hope.

  17. #17
    New member reuben_j_cogburn's Avatar
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    Default ads?

    This forum has ads? geez.... I usually zip to the post's so fast I never noticed. Maybe it's just because I'm tight with my money and they just get blocked in my head automatcally. I'll pay more attention! I'm looking for a lighted frizbee..... Know where I can get one?

    reuben.........

  18. #18
    Member martentrapper's Avatar
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    Default

    Originally Posted by Ovis
    Mark, now that I've thought a bit more about it, why should we, as "members," have to buy off the ethics of others??????? Makes us just like them, eh?

    Originally Posted by Bushrat
    Joe made a good point; what's with the ads that have nothing to do with hunting? And I took it step farther; what's up with the ads that lead to questionable practices or outfits?

    Originally Posted by Ovis
    I think it's fair to pay to play, but send the right message through your advertisements.

    Originally Posted by Bushrat
    Not only are some of the ads entirely off-base, but many are for questionable (yet legal) "hunting" enterprises.

    Originally Posted bvy Ovis
    I'd happily contribute to this site, but the fenced hunting ads would have to go first......no problem here with you making a buck, but I do have a problem w/those ads making us all look bad.


    Some of you may not want to "buy off" the ethics of others..........but I'd sure say your trying to sell your brand! Advising the website owner to make this a pay per view site so you don't have to see ads that you don't like seems a little pushy. Maybe Joe and Mark could start their own forum with only "ethical" ads.

    I've seen a few flashing banners on here, but no pop ups. Most of the ads I've seen are easy to bypass and ignore. I'm somewhat surprised that folks who aren't going to be hunting the mulchatna herd, or a fenced hunting area, anytime soon are reading so deeply into these ads. I hadn't read any of the ads yet. Now I know I don't need to...........some of you will do it for me.
    I'm more concerned with the volume of ads here, which has so far been tolerable.
    As far as pay to play............not sure, probably wouldn't favor it.

  19. #19

    Default

    On the many forums I visit there has always been talk of "paying to play." Basically, enabling a membership fee to post on the board. Realistically, how many successful (and I stress successful) forums do you see on the internet that have this idea in practice? Personally, I havnt noticed any. This would be a great way to discourage new members. And in my opinion would be almost certain death to almost any forum.

    How many potential members really want to pay to post on a forum? Its an amazingly effective deterrent. If this site required a membership fee I can tell you I would have kept my credit card in my wallet. Just imagine how many members, especially new members, this site would have. Possible advertising would go down. Would you want to advertise your business on a site with the same old small group of members? On top of all that just imagine how many other free sites would pop up around the internet.

    I know it takes time, money, hardware, software and many other things to run a thriving forum. If that means I have to deal with ads to keep the forum in the current state it is in so bet it. These ads are not so bad anyways. They can be easily tuned out, just like on other forums. When they become annoying, lock your computer up popups, that is when its out of control.

  20. #20
    Member calndux's Avatar
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    Default If we had to pay.....

    would people be able to post negative things about guides or other pay for service companies?

    P.S. I don't have a dog in this fight, just wondering for wondering sake.

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