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Thread: Trust Our Fish Biologists

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    Member fullbush's Avatar
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    Default Trust Our Fish Biologists

    Lord knows I am trying to keep my yap shut on fish politics or any politics in this forum..I just want to enjoy this awesome forum not argue! ALTHOUGH (LOL) Our Salmon fisheries and management are the model of the world. Our runs are as vibrant as ever. Politics and arguing about allocations does nothing but divide us as Alaskans. The ADF&G has the formulas to insure vibrant salmon runs (barring natural disaster) forever. The management of the resource number one priority is proper escapement. Number 2 is commercial yield. #2 was derived because it was the departments best tool for measuring run strength. It makes no sense to keep a fishery closed to commercial until they have escapement numbers because it may be too late and over escapement is devastating (tho natural). Arguing the subsistence/ personal use is a sure fire way to bring all kinds of negative attention our way from outsiders and federal agencies itching to take over. Ever heard the term don't kick a sleeping dog? I think we need to keep our yaps zipped and leave everything status quo, or we're all gonna be out of luck. W/ the exception of the cook inlet gillnetters, we all have it pretty dang good and would hate to see us all end up like the cooks inlets gillnetters.....outta luck
    So lets let our biologists run the show and hopefully all board driven decisions will be science based and not emotional
    the next time somebody whines about another gear group getting more (boo hoo) we need to collectively remind them we ALL have it good

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    Great post.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fullbush View Post
    Lord knows I am trying to keep my yap shut on fish politics or any politics in this forum..I just want to enjoy this awesome forum not argue! ALTHOUGH (LOL) Our Salmon fisheries and management are the model of the world. Our runs are as vibrant as ever. Politics and arguing about allocations does nothing but divide us as Alaskans. The ADF&G has the formulas to insure vibrant salmon runs (barring natural disaster) forever. The management of the resource number one priority is proper escapement. Number 2 is commercial yield. #2 was derived because it was the departments best tool for measuring run strength. It makes no sense to keep a fishery closed to commercial until they have escapement numbers because it may be too late and over escapement is devastating (tho natural). Arguing the subsistence/ personal use is a sure fire way to bring all kinds of negative attention our way from outsiders and federal agencies itching to take over. Ever heard the term don't kick a sleeping dog? I think we need to keep our yaps zipped and leave everything status quo, or we're all gonna be out of luck. W/ the exception of the cook inlet gillnetters, we all have it pretty dang good and would hate to see us all end up like the cooks inlets gillnetters.....outta luck
    So lets let our biologists run the show and hopefully all board driven decisions will be science based and not emotional
    the next time somebody whines about another gear group getting more (boo hoo) we need to collectively remind them we ALL have it good
    Full disclosure? Are you a fed biologist, guide, longliner, sport fishermen, subsistence user, etc?

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    Member thewhop2000's Avatar
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    Default Trust...

    But verify!! RR
    If a dipnetter dips a fish and there is no one around to see/hear it, Did he really dip?

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    Member fullbush's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 270ti View Post
    Full disclosure? Are you a fed biologist, guide, longliner, sport fishermen, subsistence user, etc?
    If "full disclosure" is asking where I fit in the mix I'll answer you. I am a 47 y/o Anchorage born fish assassin. Thats right, I do my best to kill as many fish as I can in my life time w/o remorse or pity. Which is exactly why I shouldn't be in the making regulations on fish policy business. Since birth I have an unnatural urge to wreak havoc on fish, it didn't matter what body of water my dad stopped whether it was a mud puddle or the yukon river, I would immediately engage in slaughter to the amazement of all who witnessed. I decimated the local anchorage stocks w/in bicycle range. I was very young when I decided that it was my calling to fish for a living. I knew it would be a disaster if I became a fishing guide simply because I really don't get along well w/ other humans so I knew that was out. It was only logical that if I was going to be a professional fish assassin I was gonna have to go solo. I tried several venues including set netting w/ our neighbor in bristol bay when I was 12. I was definately one happy happy boy when I discovered how many fish I could slaughter in one day and decided this was for me!!! My dad suggested PWS and copper river, well the rest is history, when I got out of the Air force in 1982 I became a PWS drift gillnet fisherman and have never looked back. I still sport fish as much as possible and still keep a decent marriage! The fishing in this state is every bit as good as when I was just lil' tusker, actually its better thanks to the ADF&G biologists past and present
    Sorry about the long winded details but I wanted peeps to have "full disclosure"

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    That was funny!

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    Member Hunt&FishAK's Avatar
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    i live eatin fish of all kinds so therefore i catch as many as i can. Eat Fish!



    Release Lake Trout

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by fullbush View Post
    l
    the next time somebody whines about another gear group getting more (boo hoo) we need to collectively remind them we ALL have it good
    Quote Originally Posted by fullbush View Post
    I became a PWS drift gillnet fisherman and have never looked back
    Makes sense... Carry on.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 270ti View Post
    Makes sense... Carry on.
    The only thing making sense to me is that your posts seem some what inflammatory. After all who else but a politician or a special rights individual cuts and pastes portions of a statement? it construes the whole ball of wax in the favor of however your argument leans...
    If you want response from me in the future, please don't play games I found this web site to enjoy and possibly learn something as well as teach something and so far I've had a blast

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    I read two sentences of the original post and had to stop to put on my hipboots. The naivete is...well...breathtaking.
    Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocre minds. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Albert Einstein

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    Default Right on!

    Right on Fullbush--if we could keep the politics out of fisheries and let the local biologists do their job--we the people, (all user groups) and the resource would all be better off. Unfortunately the political interference includes the Regional office, Headquarters, Board of Fish, Legislature, and Governor. People with the most money of course tend to have the most power to influence. We all know the past Governor who was bought off by an Anchorage millionare who got his then attorney named to the Board of Fish. This Board ignored the recommendations of biologists and even refused to listen to certain Department reports, including those that delt with habitat concerns. We are all paying the price for that move in the poor Kenai sockeye returns that are a direct result of decisions made by that Board that have taken too many years to undue. Those that don't believe the over-escapement agruement need to take a close look at the data, and better yet just take a look at the emaciated sockeye smolts that migrated to sea following these escapements. A picture, or actual sighting, is worth a thousand words. Take the time and do your homework before you challenge the biological data presented by those doing the actual work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 270ti
    Quote Originally Posted by fullbush
    Quote Originally Posted by fullbush
    the next time somebody whines about another gear group getting more (boo hoo) we need to collectively remind them we ALL have it good
    I became a PWS drift gillnet fisherman and have never looked back
    Makes sense
    Sour grapes from a charter operator toward a commercial fisherman...Of course. Because if 270ti can't attack the merits of the discussion, he just attacks the person saying them.

    Some things 270ti conveniently left out...

    "I still sport fish as much as possible..." - fullbush

    "Politics and arguing about allocations does nothing but divide us as Alaskans." - fullbush

    Nitroman and 270ti, anyone can take cheap shots and criticize. Justifying that is another story, and I don't doubt that fullbush's point about science-based management rather than emotional-based management has you frustrated.

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    Member fullbush's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grampyfishes View Post
    Sour grapes from a charter operator toward a commercial fisherman...Of course. Because if 270ti can't attack the merits of the discussion, he just attacks the person saying them.

    Some things 270ti conveniently left out...

    "I still sport fish as much as possible..." - fullbush

    "Politics and arguing about allocations does nothing but divide us as Alaskans." - fullbush

    Nitroman and 270ti, anyone can take cheap shots and criticize. Justifying that is another story, and I don't doubt that fullbush's point about science-based management rather than emotional-based management has you frustrated.
    Thankyou Grampy I figured as much. From what I've read for the most part members here are straight forward and civil minded. Nothing irks me more than somebody taking part of a statement and twisting it. Its just proof they don't have a valid argument and shows their true colors as jealous little men that don't have what it takes to come on out and slap it out on their own. Its the age old have nots versus the haves. Personally I don't have time to banter w/ them, because I'm to busy jockeying for position against the haves.

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    Member BlueMoose's Avatar
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    Talking Funny Thing

    Well Grampy and Full-Blush I am glad you two are having a group hug and slapping each other on the back however.

    Some valid topic points on the thread full spoken like a true capitalist I like it however broad based statements and sentimental reactions based on faulty logic are not to the benefit of the people by the people. You look at it without a Dawg in the Hunt truly look at it subjectively and things don't add up.

    Discussions on Bio-Mass, Harvest Rates, Escapement goals and management, allocation, laws and court rulings did not make for an equitable outcome.

    Love the passion for a fishen assassin! But read Joe Lures post twice :-)

    Joe Lure great retort!

    Employee: Oh Look it's raining Poop Pills. Supervisor: That's not poop pills it's rain! Employee; Oh good for a minute there I thought I was going to be crapped on!

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitroman View Post
    I read two sentences of the original post and had to stop to put on my hipboots. The naivete is...well...breathtaking.
    Chest waders.. You might get some over the top of those hip boots. It's DEEP....

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    Quote Originally Posted by fullbush View Post
    I knew it would be a disaster if I became a fishing guide simply because I really don't get along well w/ other humans so I knew that was out.
    Since you called me a jealous little man..

    Sorry you didn't have the qualifications to be a fishing guide. It's really a good job. I'm going to miss it and I am already regretting quitting one of the more sought after capt jobs in my area. I guess the commercial fishing I'll be doing out of my own commercially registered boat with my commercial limited entry permit that I've owned for several years will have to pay for my multiple big game hunts this next year.

    Don't feel bad though. A written test that is graded, random drug testing program, sea time, twix card, no felony convictions, needing to show up to work on time, and other qualifications have also pushed many others away from the guided sportfish industry too. Not to mention you actually have to get customers and treat them right to stay in business.

    Good luck with your career as a gill net fisherman. I wish you the best.

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    BlueMoose, all I have to do is look in my freezer and remember how easy it was to fill...Thank you science-based management. And all I have to do is watch it slowly get reduced by those here undermining the very thing that supplied it...Thank you emotional-based management.

    270ti, Ok...the substance of your posts is bashing people...we get it. Too bad you don't have more to offer on the topic. BTW, fullbush didn't call you a jealous little man. He called "somebody taking part of a statement and twisting it" a jealous little man. Apparantly you think you fit the bill.

    If there's something in particular fullbush originally posted that you want to talk about, then lets do it.

  18. #18
    Member fullbush's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 270ti View Post
    Since you called me a jealous little man..

    Sorry you didn't have the qualifications to be a fishing guide. It's really a good job. I'm going to miss it and I am already regretting quitting one of the more sought after capt jobs in my area. I guess the commercial fishing I'll be doing out of my own commercially registered boat with my commercial limited entry permit that I've owned for several years will have to pay for my multiple big game hunts this next year.

    Don't feel bad though. A written test that is graded, random drug testing program, sea time, twix card, no felony convictions, needing to show up to work on time, and other qualifications have also pushed many others away from the guided sportfish industry too. Not to mention you actually have to get customers and treat them right to stay in business.

    Good luck with your career as a gill net fisherman. I wish you the best.
    I apologize if the jealous little man crack annoyed you. Its intended purpose was achieved however because I finally got some decent dialogue out of you. I wish you all the luck in whatever endeavors you embark on as well.

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grampyfishes View Post
    270ti, Ok...the substance of your posts is bashing people...we get it. Too bad you don't have more to offer on the topic.
    Actually, I makes posts all over this site. I even exchange PM's with many people freely giving them information about the area I live in.

    I'm glad you have found your calling as a anti charter, anti sportfishing, pro commercial fishing spokesperson on the "Alaska Fisheries Management" forum. You even respond to posts that are not even directed at you. I would suggest that you expand your posting to some other forums too. It's a good site.

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    Because someone chooses not to side with your irrational, partisan, anti-commercial fishing sentiment, it doesn't make them anti-sport or anti-charter.

    Again, if there's something in particular fullbush originally posted that you want to talk about, then lets do it.

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