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Thread: .375 300 grain Nosler Partition

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    Default .375 300 grain Nosler Partition

    After today's shooting session I think I have found my load. Loaded new Hornady brass behind 78.5 of H414 pushing 300 grain Nosler Partitions.

    Average velocity was 2707 FPS and accuracy was around 7/8" 3 shots at 100 yards and 1.1" with 5 shots. This is a tremendous load that should be suffice for any game on the planet save Elephant, yet only drops 8.8" at 300 yards with a 200 yard zero. I believe ME is somewhere around 4900 Foot Pounds!!!

    My question is....What are your guys' experience with 300 grain Swift A Frames? I am kind of intrigued on possably trying one last load with this bullet. I have heard they lack accuracy, but have no first hand experience with this caliber and grain weight.

    Also Im thinking that if a 300 grain Nosler Partition won't do the trick, and A Frame probably wont do much better.
    375 Ruger Hawkeye...Mice to Moose, Impala to Buffalo....1 GUN.....WORLDS PURSUIT

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    Default Wow

    I don't have any input on the A-frames other than they hold together well but that's one heck of a round you've got worked up there! I think congratulations are in order. It always feels good when something comes together like that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by idahotrophyhunter View Post
    After today's shooting session I think I have found my load. Loaded new Hornady brass behind 78.5 of H414 pushing 300 grain Nosler Partitions.

    Average velocity was 2707 FPS and accuracy was around 7/8" 3 shots at 100 yards and 1.1" with 5 shots. This is a tremendous load that should be suffice for any game on the planet save Elephant, yet only drops 8.8" at 300 yards with a 200 yard zero. I believe ME is somewhere around 4900 Foot Pounds!!!

    My question is....What are your guys' experience with 300 grain Swift A Frames? I am kind of intrigued on possably trying one last load with this bullet. I have heard they lack accuracy, but have no first hand experience with this caliber and grain weight.

    Also Im thinking that if a 300 grain Nosler Partition won't do the trick, and A Frame probably wont do much better.

    I am a Barnes slut, so you may want to factor that into what I am about to say... Partitions do not leave the body often enough to meet my expectations. But a friend shot a Kodiak bear with me taking pictures through a really good, long lens all the while. He used a 375H&H with the 300gr NP and made an amazing shot. One of the bullets went in the left ham of the bear, traveled full length, and exited EXACTLY through the left earhole and did absolutely no damage to the hide or skull.

    Aside from the hot brass tinking off my nice Canon lens it was pretty cool!

    I have shot two Kodiak bears for my self and been there when several more were shot with X bullets and various iterations of them. None stuck around for the autopsy...
    art

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    I will not go so far as to say I am a slut for Nosler but I have always had the utmost confidence in their Partition bullet. They perform.
    NRA Life Member since 1974

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    Premium Member MarineHawk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by idahotrophyhunter View Post
    After today's shooting session I think I have found my load. Loaded new Hornady brass behind 78.5 of H414 pushing 300 grain Nosler Partitions.

    Average velocity was 2707 FPS and accuracy was around 7/8" 3 shots at 100 yards and 1.1" with 5 shots. This is a tremendous load that should be suffice for any game on the planet save Elephant, yet only drops 8.8" at 300 yards with a 200 yard zero. I believe ME is somewhere around 4900 Foot Pounds!!!

    My question is....What are your guys' experience with 300 grain Swift A Frames? I am kind of intrigued on possably trying one last load with this bullet. I have heard they lack accuracy, but have no first hand experience with this caliber and grain weight.

    Also Im thinking that if a 300 grain Nosler Partition won't do the trick, and A Frame probably wont do much better.
    That's essentially the same bullet/speed I will be starting with in my new 375 Wby. I am getting 100 rds of the Wby factory 300gr NP ammo that come with the rifle, which I read somewhere will produce about 2,735 fps out of my 24-inch barrel, but I will confirm. I'm torn between that, the 300gr or 350gr TSXs, and the 300gr Accubonds. I've had an epiphany and realized that i can have anything loaded by someone else until I have time to learn to do it myself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by boliep View Post
    I will not go so far as to say I am a slut for Nosler but I have always had the utmost confidence in their Partition bullet. They perform.

    I would never say the NP is a horrible bullet, but it is just a cup and core, very ordinary performer. If the value of an exit hole is written off the bullets that always leave may not be your answer.

    Personally I have a large collection of recovered NP bullets I put in animals. I have shot a lot of animals with X and various iterations without ever recovering one. But the difference in meat damage with the X is enough to keep me using them...

    The 300gr NP is built tougher (thicker jacket) than the lighter variations.
    art

  7. #7

    Thumbs up me thinks...

    The 300 grain NP in a .375 is always a good choice for big bears. Does it penetrate or retain as much weight as some of today's "super premium" bullets, probably not. Is the bear dead in short order if they are put in the right place, yup, year after year, hunt after hunt, and bear after bear. I only hunt Alaska and use X bullets, but for many years I used Nosler Partitions in a 30-06 and .338 and never had bad results. To my way off thinking they are still about the best all around big game hunting bullet ever made, especially when impact velocities are 2800 fps and under.

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    I have to agree with everything hap wrote.

    I've kiiled a lot (dozens) of bull elk with Nosler partitions and with X or TSX bullets.

    While the NP always did an acceptable job, the TSX will do and excellent job, normally exiting the animal from any angle.

    I would never say the NP is not good, because it is good in temrs of terminal performance and it is generally an accurate bullet. The TSX is better.

    I have two 375 WBY rfles built on CRF actions and were I to hunt AK with them, I'd use the TSX 270gr. bullet at around 2800 fps to keep the pressures low in case my barrel was filled with rain when I pulled the trigger. Were I to hunt Africa with the same cartidge, I would use the 300gr. TSX at around 2650 to 2700 fps and I would also use the Barnes banded 300gr. solid at those speeds.

    The 350gr. TSX is too heavy for any AK use I could imagine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Sundles View Post
    I'd use the TSX 270gr. bullet at around 2800 fps to keep the pressures low in case my barrel was filled with rain when I pulled trigger.
    We've always taped the ends of our barrels so rain or twigs cant possibly make it in there. Or at least you'd have a pretty good sign that there was potential should you notice the tape shredded.

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    Premium Member MarineHawk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Sundles View Post
    I have to agree with everything hap wrote.

    I've kiiled a lot (dozens) of bull elk with Nosler partitions and with X or TSX bullets.

    While the NP always did an acceptable job, the TSX will do and excellent job, normally exiting the animal from any angle.

    I would never say the NP is not good, because it is good in temrs of terminal performance and it is generally an accurate bullet. The TSX is better.

    I have two 375 WBY rfles built on CRF actions and were I to hunt AK with them, I'd use the TSX 270gr. bullet at around 2800 fps to keep the pressures low in case my barrel was filled with rain when I pulled the trigger. Were I to hunt Africa with the same cartidge, I would use the 300gr. TSX at around 2650 to 2700 fps and I would also use the Barnes banded 300gr. solid at those speeds.

    The 350gr. TSX is too heavy for any AK use I could imagine.
    The only problem I have with he TSXs, for some of their bullets, is their horrible ballistic coefficient compared to other bullets of the same caliber and weight. For example, the .326 B.C. 270gr and the .357 B.C. 300gr .375 bullets.

    For example, lets say you fired five 375 bullets (B.C.) zeroes at 200 as follows:

    270gr TSX (0.326) at 2,850fps;

    300gr TSX (0.357) at 2,700fps;

    300gr NP (0.398) at 2,700fps;

    300gr AB (0.485) at 2,700fps;

    350gr TSX (0.425) at 2,550fps.

    Here's what the bullets are doing at 300 yds:

    270gr TSX: 2,054fps; 2,529 ft-lbs; 8.4 inches low;

    300gr TSX: 1,993fps; 2,646 ft-lbs; 9.2 inches low;

    300gr NP: 2,061fps; 2,830 ft-lbs; 8.8 inches low;

    300gr AB: 2,170fps; 3,137 ft-lbs; 8.3 inches low;

    350gr TSX: 1,970fps; 3,016 ft-lbs; 9.9 inches low.

    The 270gr and 300gr TSXs are the worst performers down range.

    The 350gr TSX essentially catches up with the 300gr TSX at 300 yds.

    The 300gr NP and AB both have passed the lighter 270gr TSX by 300yds.

    I expect the common response: "B.C. makes no difference in a bear bullet." Maybe, but then why even bother shooting lighter, shorter bullets if they are going clower than heavier bullets at only 300 yds? And, what's wrong with a bullet that will carry much more of its velocity and energy down range and still to exactly the same thing at close range when it hits a bear or whatever? What about the unfortunate wounded bear that you need to hit at longer range? On the one hand, if you don't care about down-range performance, there is no reason to go with a lighter bullet. On the other hand, if you do, in those instances, why not go with the heavier bullets that pass the lighter ones?

    Barnes easily could solve this problem by introducing the TTSX in the 375 caliber, like they did with the .338. For example they now have a wicked 0.575 B.C., .338 265gr TTSX bullet available. I have had my TSXs perform very well out of my 300 Win Mag, but I wish Barnes would tip them all.

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    Marinehawk,

    This subject is where I think a lot of folks get into "stuff" that does not matter with DG cartridges, which you alluded to.

    So, the 300gr. NP shoots .4 inch flatter at 300 yards than the TSX--not only will no person on earth be able to hold (under field conditions ) for .4 inch at 300 yards, but no game animal shot will notice a difference. I can see where this kind of minutia could serve well for 500 yard shots on sheep, but it is otherwise meaningless. Never mind that after the first shot fired, the NP in your magazine box will have flattened tips from the recoil of the first shot and your follow up shots will likely have a lower BC than the TSX bullets.......

    Here is the real problem with tipping some of these bullets to pick up extra meaningless "energy" or trajectory at 300 yards........that plastic tip forces you to seat your bullet further off the lands, depending on your magazine box length and other factors, but when I am working up loads, I want all the flexibility I can get in choosing OAL. This matters a great deal in the accuracy that can be obtainted in most rifles, not so much in others, but I hate to lose the option by using tipped bullets that force the ogive further away from the lands..............If you had a rifle custom built (barelled) around the OAL for that tipped bullet, you could then compensate for the seating depth.

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    Chriso,

    I know all about masking tape, but once in a while I'll fire a shot while hunting, thus shredding the tape and then later I'll need to fire again, but no tape has been on my barrel for several hours and I dont want to start carrying tape in the field.

    Keeping pressures at lower than max. is a good idea on DG loads when/if you have to deal with heat issues with SOME powders. Pressure is your enemy, the lower you can keep it and still achieve your needs, the better, which is why my 416's are Rigby's and not Remingtons, with one exception. ( only have one 416 Remington) Granted that oft times you've gotta live with the high pressure, but where I dont have to live with it, I dont.

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    Thumbs up 300gr Accubond

    The new 300gr Accubond for the 375 suppose to have a great BC.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Sundles View Post
    Chriso,

    I know all about masking tape, but once in a while I'll fire a shot while hunting, thus shredding the tape and then later I'll need to fire again, but no tape has been on my barrel for several hours and I dont want to start carrying tape in the field.

    Keeping pressures at lower than max. is a good idea on DG loads when/if you have to deal with heat issues with SOME powders. Pressure is your enemy, the lower you can keep it and still achieve your needs, the better, which is why my 416's are Rigby's and not Remingtons, with one exception. ( only have one 416 Remington) Granted that oft times you've gotta live with the high pressure, but where I dont have to live with it, I dont.
    Tim
    That is why I use an extra wrap of tape at the barrel to replace the tape when it gets shot off. I spend lots of time hunting Kodiak and it does know how to rain...

    That said, I do not remember ever replacing the tape after shooting... But I have it ready!
    art

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    hap
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alaska Bush Hunter View Post
    The new 300gr Accubond for the 375 suppose to have a great BC.
    I have very limited Accubond experience in the field, but so far it has been 4 for 4 bad. At modest velocities (very long range) on deer two of two did not exit. Two of two showed signs they tumbled with the jacket flared forward at about 45 degrees to the axis of the bullet.

    The other two were closer and showed minimal penetration and little more than a short shank remaining.

    The Accubonds are built heavier as weight and diameter increase... But they would be a very distant last choice from my very limited first hand observations...
    art

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    I have take many critters with the Nosler partition, and the Swift A-frame. The NP is not a cup an core design. It is a dual core bullet with a thick bulkhead between front and rear cores. The front of it will make a mess and the butt section (about 60% of the weight) will push on. They don't exit as often as I would like unless enough bore size and bullet weight is used. They do make good lion bullets in the 300 grain 375. The Swift A-frame is the same design with the front core bonded. They are tougher than the partition and will generally have 25 to 50 % more penetration in comparable weight/caliber.
    The TSX is likely the penetration king and leave ragged holes.

    I think sometimes we can use a bullet that is too tough given the target and the impact velocity. A Swift A-frame on a caribou isn't needed. Some animals have a tougher and thicker structure in muscle and bone. I think also that the partition, though an excellent bullet, performs best at more moderate impact velocity. The 300 grain 375 Partition above 2600 fps on the toughest critters my be expecting too much of this fine bullet. A moose is a very tough critter, physically, so is a heavy grizzly/brown bear. Also when we up velocity we need to use a tougher bullet for tough critters. I'd use one of the other two, I do use a lot Swift A-frames in my 375 Improved, Dakota, Ruger, Weatherby. I load a lot of TSX now for other folks at their request and have had no recent complaints about that bullet/caliber combo.
    Last edited by Murphy; 02-28-2010 at 14:26.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



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    hap,

    Having a spare wrap around the barrel is a great idea, thanks.

    Many, many times in my life of shooting and hunting, I've fired, and then hunted more that same day and not because I missed with the first shot either.................I also dont like to get dust or other debris like pine needles in the barrel. I watch my hunting buddies walk under/through pine bows with thier rilfes slung over thier shoulders, muzzle up and I'm always wondering if a needle just fell into the barrel.

    I tend to use masking tape because it is not elastic and will shred instantly when the bullet starts its trip down the barrel. This is probably anal on my part, but I don't want an elastic type tape that takes a lot longer to shred and thus has more of a chance of a tiny peice of it contacting the projectile.

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    This is sort of another subject but Tim mentioned loading a hunting load slightly below max velocity. This is a good idea. There are many unknown factors that can effect pressure in the field. Debris, snow, water we think can be avoided with tape but the tape but that may or may not be. A twig can punch through the tape and stay in the barrel. Also warmer temperatures, not necessarily hot but direct sunlight on the gun or ammo can heat it above the load development temperature. Further there is nothing to be gained by squeezing that last few FPS from a particular load. Trajectory and energy changes are very small and field marksmanship is far more important than that last bit of energy from a bullet.

    I shoot a lot of maximum loads during development. I'm working on load development with a wild cat caliber now learning how the cartridge responds to different powders and changes in powder charge. This is a learning curve, I'll go back to slightly sub par ballistics and best accuracy for my hunting trip. It is nice to find that a new development is not quirky and delivers the goods with room to spare. I've settled for about 2370 fps from my 416 and 400 grain bullets even though it produces 2450 with no pressure signs at all. Also changing bullet type (different construction) even of the same weight, requires a restart with the development. The Swift A-frame may produce higher pressure than the Nosler partition or Hornady DGX with the same powder charge. You can get in the ball park with cheap cup and core bullets but the final touches must be made with the actual bullet you will use. Be conservative with field loads, it could make a difference.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by hap View Post
    I have very limited Accubond experience in the field, but so far it has been 4 for 4 bad. At modest velocities (very long range) on deer two of two did not exit. Two of two showed signs they tumbled with the jacket flared forward at about 45 degrees to the axis of the bullet.

    The other two were closer and showed minimal penetration and little more than a short shank remaining.

    The Accubonds are built heavier as weight and diameter increase... But they would be a very distant last choice from my very limited first hand observations...
    art
    I have been reading more and more unfavorable reports about Accubonds, mostly coming appart to easily. I rate them just above a ballisitc tip based on what I've been reading. I only used on a game - a 300 WSM 180 gr bullet, about a 200 yd shot on a cow elk which penetrated and struck the lower spine leaving about a 3" exit hole. You really couldn't ask for more in that case, but if I needed something for deep penetration and crushing heavy bones, it wouldn't be my first choice. I lean toward the monometal E-Tips (Not yet available in .375). I recovered a couple from target shooting and they look very impressive.

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Sundles View Post
    hap,

    Having a spare wrap around the barrel is a great idea, thanks.

    Many, many times in my life of shooting and hunting, I've fired, and then hunted more that same day and not because I missed with the first shot either.................I also dont like to get dust or other debris like pine needles in the barrel. I watch my hunting buddies walk under/through pine bows with thier rilfes slung over thier shoulders, muzzle up and I'm always wondering if a needle just fell into the barrel.

    I tend to use masking tape because it is not elastic and will shred instantly when the bullet starts its trip down the barrel. This is probably anal on my part, but I don't want an elastic type tape that takes a lot longer to shred and thus has more of a chance of a tiny peice of it contacting the projectile.
    I use electricl tape because it's tougher and sticks better. I have no hard core evidence to back me up, but I dont believe it increases pressure significantly. I shoot max loads for hunting and have shot several through electrical tape in the field with no detectable increase in pressure. I always keep a partial role of both electrical and duct tape in my day pack for whatever reason. They have come in handy on several occasions. I also use electrical tape to attach my tag to my game. To each his own.

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