Results 1 to 15 of 15

Thread: interesting observation...

  1. #1
    Member AKsoldier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Wasilla
    Posts
    1,555

    Default interesting observation...

    I needed to shake the dust off my reloading equipment after a year of no use, so I decided to load up a batch of 45 ACP last night. I like to load 50 rounds at a time, using like head stamps to eliminate case variations in testing my loads for consistency. I already had about 15 Federal cases primed, so I started digging through my box of cleaned and prepped cases looking for more Federal cases to complete the run of 50. I have a total of about 300 or so cases for 45 ACP, and I was having trouble at first finding Federals. While sifting through the box, I finally came up with 50, but I got to thinking it was wierd because I knew I had plenty of Federals, so I went through them all.

    What I discovered is that Federal cases are heavier than all the others - to the degree that they move to the bottom of the pile during sifting, much like gold in a gold pan. I found my 50, then went through all of the remaining cases, trying to sort out all of the brands. I wound up with about 60 more Federal cases, all at the bottom of the box.

    Anyone else ever notice this? I wonder what Federal does differently. Dimensionally they are the same as the others. (Obviously)

    The other 299,300,000 people can have it.

    Noone has a more intimate understanding of, or deeper appreciation for freedom, than a soldier who has fought for it in a country where it does not exist.

  2. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Eureka MT
    Posts
    3,048

    Default

    They must be thicker brass as if they are all the same on the outside and there heavier, the only option is they're thicker. I've never paid a lot of attention with 45acp brass so long as it's not Amer stuff.

  3. #3
    Member AKsoldier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Wasilla
    Posts
    1,555

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rbuck351 View Post
    They must be thicker brass as if they are all the same on the outside and there heavier, the only option is they're thicker. I've never paid a lot of attention with 45acp brass so long as it's not Amer stuff.
    That's what I'm thinking too. I think it stands to reason that they are a bit stronger as well, I think I'll start using Federal cases exclusively for my "hot" (read - near max pressure) loads.

    The other 299,300,000 people can have it.

    Noone has a more intimate understanding of, or deeper appreciation for freedom, than a soldier who has fought for it in a country where it does not exist.

  4. #4
    Moderator
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Midwest
    Posts
    4,431

    Default

    Maybe that is where they belong. At the bottom!
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Kenai
    Posts
    1,888

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AKsoldier View Post
    That's what I'm thinking too. I think it stands to reason that they are a bit stronger as well, I think I'll start using Federal cases exclusively for my "hot" (read - near max pressure) loads.
    Welcome home brother!!!

    It would be interesting to chek case capacity of the Federal cases as opposed to others. If the brass is truly thicker the capacity will be a little lower making pressures in them a little higher without using the "hot" loads! Be interesting to chronograph identical loads in Federal brass vs another brand.
    Vance in AK.

    Matthew 6:33
    "But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you."

  6. #6
    Member AKsoldier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Wasilla
    Posts
    1,555

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Vance in AK View Post
    Welcome home brother!!!

    It would be interesting to chek case capacity of the Federal cases as opposed to others. If the brass is truly thicker the capacity will be a little lower making pressures in them a little higher without using the "hot" loads! Be interesting to chronograph identical loads in Federal brass vs another brand.
    Sounds like a good experiment. I'll have to try that, but I'm going to have to buy a new chrony first. And thanks, it's good to be home!!!

    The other 299,300,000 people can have it.

    Noone has a more intimate understanding of, or deeper appreciation for freedom, than a soldier who has fought for it in a country where it does not exist.

  7. #7
    Sponsor ADfields's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Missing Palmer AK in Phonix AZ.
    Posts
    6,416

    Default

    Yes welcome home and a heartfelt thanks for what ya done over there!

    It must be thicker as I canít imagine the alloys specific gravity would be that different. Toss some on a scale when you are experimenting and see how much heavier they are.
    Andy
    On the web= C-lazy-F.co
    Email= Andy@C-lazy-F.co
    Call/Text 602-315-2406
    Phoenix Arizona

  8. #8
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    SwampView AK, Overlooking Mt. Mckinley and Points Beyond.
    Posts
    8,809

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AKsoldier View Post
    And thanks, it's good to be home!!!
    Yeah, I was beginning to get the idea you were back. Glad you made it.

    I've heard Federal Brass was bad stuff, but don't recall the details. I dunno if it is accurate, out of date, or just rumors. Anyway, I've been on the lookout when using it, and haven't recognized any issues so far.

    Smitty of the North
    Walk Slow, and Drink a Lotta Water.
    Has it ever occurred to you, that Nothing ever occurs to God? Adrien Rodgers.
    You can't out-give God.

  9. #9

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Smitty of the North View Post
    Yeah, I was beginning to get the idea you were back. Glad you made it.

    I've heard Federal Brass was bad stuff, but don't recall the details.
    Many thanks and a sincere welcome home, Aksoldier.

    As for Federal brass, I've heard about the problems, but never experienced it myself. My big beef in recent years has been with Winchester brass. Really inconsistent, like they turned off the neck trim function on their line and decided a third to a half of the necks needed dents while they had the chance. In some batches every single case needed trimmed and trued. I bought a full case of Federal 30-30 brass because the price was right, and in reforming it to lots of calibers, it's some of the best brass I've ever used.

    Long and short of it, I keep brands sorted due to capacity differences, then monitor and care for cases. Most of my loading is not to gut busting max, so I get fairly long case life from most brands.

    Maybe complaints about Federal come from pushing the ceiling? Dunno, and I'm not likely to find out any time soon.

  10. #10
    Member AKsoldier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Wasilla
    Posts
    1,555

    Default

    I don't really have any issue with the federal cases - just thought it was interesting that they are heavier than the others. I rarely load to max with 45 ACP. The only time I get close to max is if I'm having accuracy issues and I'm trying to get more bullet stability. All of my 45 ACP handloads are just for plinkin'. Defense loads are always factory stuff.

    The other 299,300,000 people can have it.

    Noone has a more intimate understanding of, or deeper appreciation for freedom, than a soldier who has fought for it in a country where it does not exist.

  11. #11

    Default

    Sounds like we read from about the same reloading pages. Sort it and shoot it.

  12. #12
    Moderator
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Midwest
    Posts
    4,431

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AKsoldier View Post
    That's what I'm thinking too. I think it stands to reason that they are a bit stronger as well, I think I'll start using Federal cases exclusively for my "hot" (read - near max pressure) loads.
    It has been my experience that the thicker FC cases are not stronger. They are softer and don't last as long because they develop a ridge at the base from the carbide sizing and the constant expanding of the brass at the base. I dislike them a bunch. W-W headstamps are always preferred if I can't get Starline. Max pressure for the ACP won't expand much of anything. When you load to Super pressures you see a lot of expansion.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



  13. #13
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Southwest Alaska
    Posts
    2,145

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Murphy View Post
    Maybe that is where they belong. At the bottom!
    Ouch. That's funny.

    Brass from different manufacturers can vary in other ways. Has anyone eve3r noticed the feel of Winchester brass compared to other manufacturers? Winnie brass feels much smoother.
    Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocre minds. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Albert Einstein

    Better living through chemistry (I'm a chemist)

    You can piddle with the puppies, or run with the wolves...

  14. #14
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Eureka MT
    Posts
    3,048

    Default

    I've never developed a like or dislike for any particular brass, but I don't push the upper limits much either. As Murphy says, thicker is not necessasarily stronger.

  15. #15
    Member AKsoldier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Wasilla
    Posts
    1,555

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Murphy View Post
    It has been my experience that the thicker FC cases are not stronger. They are softer and don't last as long because they develop a ridge at the base from the carbide sizing and the constant expanding of the brass at the base. I dislike them a bunch. W-W headstamps are always preferred if I can't get Starline. Max pressure for the ACP won't expand much of anything. When you load to Super pressures you see a lot of expansion.
    So thicker/heavier doesn't always mean stronger.... thanks Murphy, It's not likely I would have blown myself up since even max loads for me mean within published pressure limits, but the voice of experience is always welcome. For my 45 ACP's, I'm not much of a brass brand stickler, except that I like to load a batch with like cases, brand is unimportant. For high-pressure loads though (anything rifle, and 460 S&W) I like to be a bit more particular.

    The other 299,300,000 people can have it.

    Noone has a more intimate understanding of, or deeper appreciation for freedom, than a soldier who has fought for it in a country where it does not exist.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •