Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 48

Thread: Want to guide?

  1. #1

    Default Want to guide?

    1. Remember - it is a profession. Kind of like being a surgeon where "surgery" can entail removing a sliver or working on the brain. Brain surgeons get paid more than "sliver removers".

    2. Find a good guiding operation that DOESN'T need help to work for. (You won't be working for nothing either from a monetary or knowledge standpoint).

    3. Forget everything "self taught" (well almost everything) about hunting.

    4. Spend the time to learn the basics and remember "guiding" as with any other profession is a life long learning process. And, that does not mean "parroting" such profound statements as "you can a big bear by the way it walks" or "the ears look big on little bears".

    5. If at the end of that first season you can't wait to get back to town or you believe the time is right to start guiding hunters with out direct supervision find anther profession - if the guide believes you are ready to start guiding find another guide.

    6. You may well learn from your experiences but - you won't teach yourself. That will require a lot of input from a broad spectrum of people - guides, biologists, conservationist, land managers and others for too numerous to mention in this post. Remember, once a "bridge is burned" it takes a long time to rebuild.

    Good Luck - it is a great life (for some).
    Joe (Ak)

  2. #2
    Member Vince's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Fairbanks most the time, Ancorage some of the time,& on the road Kicking Anti's all the time
    Posts
    8,989

    Default

    YEAH i POSTED that same story last winter..
    "If you are on a continuous search to be offended, you will always find what you are looking for; even when it isn't there."

    meet on face book here

  3. #3

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Montana338 View Post
    Joe – I know it can be a challenging life here is my story:
    Great example of "learning from our experiences"!
    Thanks
    Joe (Ak)

  4. #4
    Member ret25yo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Unit 13
    Posts
    1,471

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Montana338 View Post
    Joe – I know it can be a challenging life here is my story:

    http://www.snopes.com/critters/farce/ropedeer.asp

    If you cant stand behind the troops in Iraq.. Feel free to stand in front of them.

  5. #5
    New member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Bitterroot Valley, Montana
    Posts
    54

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wantj43 View Post
    1. Remember - it is a profession. Kind of like being a surgeon where "surgery" can entail removing a sliver or working on the brain. Brain surgeons get paid more than "sliver removers".

    2. Find a good guiding operation that DOESN'T need help to work for. (You won't be working for nothing either from a monetary or knowledge standpoint).

    3. Forget everything "self taught" (well almost everything) about hunting.

    4. Spend the time to learn the basics and remember "guiding" as with any other profession is a life long learning process. And, that does not mean "parroting" such profound statements as "you can a big bear by the way it walks" or "the ears look big on little bears".

    5. If at the end of that first season you can't wait to get back to town or you believe the time is right to start guiding hunters with out direct supervision find anther profession - if the guide believes you are ready to start guiding find another guide.

    6. You may well learn from your experiences but - you won't teach yourself. That will require a lot of input from a broad spectrum of people - guides, biologists, conservationist, land managers and others for too numerous to mention in this post. Remember, once a "bridge is burned" it takes a long time to rebuild.

    Good Luck - it is a great life (for some).
    Joe (Ak)
    So Joe if you were to give some advice: How would a guy or girl interesting in being a guide go about getting started off on the right foot?
    Montana

  6. #6
    Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Somewhere between lucky and extremely lucky
    Posts
    592

    Default Rocket science?

    Quote Originally Posted by wantj43 View Post
    1. Remember - it is a profession. Kind of like being a surgeon where "surgery" can entail removing a sliver or working on the brain. Brain surgeons get paid more than "sliver removers".

    2. Find a good guiding operation that DOESN'T need help to work for. (You won't be working for nothing either from a monetary or knowledge standpoint).

    3. Forget everything "self taught" (well almost everything) about hunting.

    4. Spend the time to learn the basics and remember "guiding" as with any other profession is a life long learning process. And, that does not mean "parroting" such profound statements as "you can a big bear by the way it walks" or "the ears look big on little bears".

    5. If at the end of that first season you can't wait to get back to town or you believe the time is right to start guiding hunters with out direct supervision find anther profession - if the guide believes you are ready to start guiding find another guide.

    6. You may well learn from your experiences but - you won't teach yourself. That will require a lot of input from a broad spectrum of people - guides, biologists, conservationist, land managers and others for too numerous to mention in this post. Remember, once a "bridge is burned" it takes a long time to rebuild.

    Good Luck - it is a great life (for some).
    Joe (Ak)

    Boy, you sure describe an intereseting career choice! Is 'patronizing' part of the job description 'cause you're pretty good at it (you all would understand if you've kept up with BRWNBR's post about 'help wanted'). BTW, you forgot the word 'judge' on #4, it should be, "you can JUDGE a big bear...", I'm a teacher, don't know if I'm any good at it, but I've sure witnessed a lot of first year teachers that were outstanding, primarily because they had work ethic, people skills and patience...experience is important, but it can also cause us to be jaded, and unwilling to change. Just my opinion, but you sound fairly jaded. Jake is as honest as they come, surprising that you are so obviously threatened by him. The moderators can remove this if they feel as if its a personal attack, I happen to think of it as 'another's perspective'.

  7. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Yukon Canada
    Posts
    1,289

    Default guides

    good post Joe, lots of good info for those willing to listen! 338 do you know Jack Hooker from Ovando?? he used to run wild horses with my dad, in Ore.
    I have for the most part made my living guiding. i started wrangling horses in the mountains when i was 15. i love it and would never do anything else. most years between trapping, guiding hunters and fishermen i spend at least 7 months in the bush, somtimes i get lucky and get in 9. My advice for anyone starting out is to do your homework and find a good outfitter first, then be prepared to start at the bottom and work up, this can take years. My son started wrangling 5 years ago and guided his first hunt this year, and he grew up in the area he was guiding. another mistake rookies make is not knowing how to talk to hunters, and pushing them to hard, most are older and not in good shape and when they are pushed to hard many will just give up. On a normal hunt i will take the first few days real easy and during that time i will assess the hunters ability and make plans from there. Being able to talk to them intelligently is also important, im a news junkie so its not a problem for me and it has been an incredible asset to me. I had a hunter tell me a few years ago he looked at 4 things to determine how a guide stacked up, 1 accommodations 2 guides ability as a hunter 3 food quality and 4 communication. he said its hard to find all 4. I told my son this... if you dont love it do something else as you wont be good at it. I remember a few times when I took high paying logging jobs... when the leaves started to turn colors my eyes would start looking at the mountains wishing i was there, i didnt last long on those jobs! Last bit of advice... you better have a wife who understands or better yet shares your love of the wild places... i am lucky mine does both.

  8. #8
    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Wrangell
    Posts
    7,602

    Default

    I was told if you come out and do this it don't mean we are related. Or other words better not catch you bringing your buddies out to my hunting area. In the little area I know the guides from its a fifteen to twenty year journey from first trip to registered if you stay in the local system

  9. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Yukon Canada
    Posts
    1,289

    Default good point

    amigo good point, its an unwritten code, a guide NEVER go back and hunts in an outfitters area. if you do you wont be guiding long. the only exception is on traplines, i have 2 traplines and a fishing lodge in the same area i guide in so i do hunt there, but the other parts of the area are taboo

  10. #10
    New member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Bitterroot Valley, Montana
    Posts
    54

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by yukon254 View Post
    good post Joe, lots of good info for those willing to listen! 338 do you know Jack Hooker from Ovando?? he used to run wild horses with my dad, in Ore.
    I have for the most part made my living guiding. i started wrangling horses in the mountains when i was 15. i love it and would never do anything else. most years between trapping, guiding hunters and fishermen i spend at least 7 months in the bush, somtimes i get lucky and get in 9. My advice for anyone starting out is to do your homework and find a good outfitter first, then be prepared to start at the bottom and work up, this can take years. My son started wrangling 5 years ago and guided his first hunt this year, and he grew up in the area he was guiding. another mistake rookies make is not knowing how to talk to hunters, and pushing them to hard, most are older and not in good shape and when they are pushed to hard many will just give up. On a normal hunt i will take the first few days real easy and during that time i will assess the hunters ability and make plans from there. Being able to talk to them intelligently is also important, im a news junkie so its not a problem for me and it has been an incredible asset to me. I had a hunter tell me a few years ago he looked at 4 things to determine how a guide stacked up, 1 accommodations 2 guides ability as a hunter 3 food quality and 4 communication. he said its hard to find all 4. I told my son this... if you dont love it do something else as you wont be good at it. I remember a few times when I took high paying logging jobs... when the leaves started to turn colors my eyes would start looking at the mountains wishing i was there, i didnt last long on those jobs! Last bit of advice... you better have a wife who understands or better yet shares your love of the wild places... i am lucky mine does both.






    Yukon,
    That name does not ring a bell. I do recall hearing about someone north of me working wild horses. At times I wonder if some of mine are just that. I do know of some guys just north of Jack at “Blackfoot Timber” in Lincoln.

    You make some good points regarding the criteria for the overall hunting experience:
    1) Quality – cleanliness - condition of the accommodations (gear – stock etc.)
    2) Client’s impression of the competency of the guide and other staff.
    3) Quality of the food.

    I would think if the outfitter and his staff focused intensely on delivering excellent results on all the above that would leave the quantity and quality of species sought as the wild card.


    Montana

  11. #11
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Yukon Canada
    Posts
    1,289

    Default predators

    338 not sure about your neck of the woods but in northern bc and yukon there is an old outfitter saying that goes like this.. if you are not controlling the predators in some way you are not taking care of your area... very true too. We work hard in the winter to take as many wolves as we can and due to that work we now have the highest moose population in the yukon.

  12. #12
    New member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Bitterroot Valley, Montana
    Posts
    54

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by yukon254 View Post
    338 not sure about your neck of the woods but in northern bc and yukon there is an old outfitter saying that goes like this.. if you are not controlling the predators in some way you are not taking care of your area... very true too. We work hard in the winter to take as many wolves as we can and due to that work we now have the highest moose population in the yukon.
    Yukon254,

    Wow! If you want some spicy debate in Montana bring up wolves.

    Try this: Walk into any two banks in my home town. In one bank walk up to the teller and comment this is a robbery.

    In the other bank walk up to the teller and say I love wolves can you direct me to where I might be able to view some.

    One will get you 24hrs. in the local clink with time off for good behavior the other will get you life.


    Montana

  13. #13
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Yukon Canada
    Posts
    1,289

    Default wolves

    Montana that is funny! I have seen it here in the midwest! I run wolf hunts out of my fishing lodge in the Yukon, and have been advertising at the All Canada shows... I have a picture of a hunter holding up a very large male (135 lbs) this picture is blown up to 20 by 24 and we have it on our booth.... most comments have been great with lots of interest in a hunt... but I get a kick out of the people that come by and just stop dead looking at the picture... then we get a "i wish you were dead" look and off they go.. good riddance I say I wouldnt want them fishing with me anyway! People just dont understand how hard wolves are on game populations if they are not controlled. You guys in MT are doing a good job this year on your wolf hunt, but my guess is they will get harder to hunt next year.

  14. #14

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sockeye1 View Post
    "..., but I've sure witnessed a lot of first year teachers that were outstanding,..."
    Not certain if you are referring to teachers in the school system, not certain where you are located, but at least in this school district teachers are not "turned loose" to teach after hanging around the school yard for a couple of weeks. Unfortunately, that would be the equivalent of what is all too often happening with the guiding industry.

    Quote Originally Posted by sockeye1 View Post
    "...Jake is as honest as they come,..."
    Who has suggested otherwise?

    Quote Originally Posted by sockeye1 View Post
    "...surprising that you are so obviously threatened by him..."
    Threatened? Why - it certainly would not be based on our involvement in the industry or histories of harvest or our efforts towards resource management issues.

    Quote Originally Posted by sockeye1 View Post
    The moderators can remove this if they feel as if its a personal attack, I happen to think of it as 'another's perspective'.
    Fear not! I think I'm on the same list as the APHA, BOG and BGCSB or those associated with these enities. So don't worry about personal attacks or unsubstantiated allegations.
    (I certainly didn't consider the post a personal attack - erroneous perhaps!)
    Joe (Ak)

  15. #15
    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Wrangell
    Posts
    7,602

    Default

    I've already said that I think Jake is honest and fair. Joe is also as far as I'm concerned.It takes a special type of person to share what they know and help others even if they may get in his way some day and Joe does that with his bear clinics. I'm glad Alaska still has some guides that are more than lodge owners that only step off the front porch if a camera is running.

  16. #16

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Montana338 View Post
    So Joe if you were to give some advice: How would a guy or girl interesting in being a guide go about getting started off on the right foot?
    Montana
    Pretty hard to beat the outline provided by "yukon254". Find a good outfitter, big or small, figure four or five years and or some really long seasons, work for several different guides and if you can't look back on the last day and smile and enjoy every aspect of guiding - not just JUDGING bears, find another line of work. If married, better have a wife as described in post #8 (I sure do).
    I don't know "yukon254" or his son, however, I have had the pleasure, and I do mean PLEASURE, of helping test several individuals that have followed the general training program described. Those individuals more than hold their own in professional discussions with their peers regardless of experience levels; always get "top dollar" and never have to "look" for a job guiding (they save any operation a lot of money); have to ability to learn and teach during their entire guiding career and are the best argument AGAINST the residency requirement to guide in Alaska.
    Joe (Ak)
    (Yukon254 - I truly wish your son the best of luck - he won't need it, he will make his own - just had to say it anyway.)

  17. #17
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Yukon Canada
    Posts
    1,289

    Default luck

    thanks joe, hes already on the right track, he has been lucky, he has spent 5 years with one of the best outfits in the business.He was put wrangleing with the owners brother who has 30 seasons under his belt this year, just a great situation with a great outfit, and he loves it like i do.

  18. #18

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Amigo Will View Post
    I've already said that I think Jake is honest and fair. Joe is also as far as I'm concerned.It takes a special type of person to share what they know and help others even if they may get in his way some day and Joe does that with his bear clinics. I'm glad Alaska still has some guides that are more than lodge owners that only step off the front porch if a camera is running.
    Thank you.
    Hunting clinics are a "win - win" situation for everyone involved whether given one on one or to a group. "Clients" can better participate in the hunt; guides enjoy a higher success rate; "residents" enjoy a higher success rate. The irony is the more we know about hunting methods the less likely there will be conflicts between hunters be they guided or unguided.
    Much better to provide the "clinics" than to watch hunters wondering up and down short side canyons or ridge tops looking for sheep; or wondering up and down the river bank looking for a bear or moose behind some "bush". And, that doesn't even count what what the presenter can learn from those being "taught" (that's a lot more than one might think).
    Joe (Ak)

  19. #19

    Default

    "sockeye1" - Sorry about the double "what" in the last sentence of the last post. Will re-write and re-post if clarification is needed. (Missed the fifteen minute deadline!)
    Joe (Ak)

  20. #20
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    607

    Default

    I know many big game guides, all you need is a line of B.S. a mile long.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •