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Thread: .40 S&W & 10mm lead

  1. #1

    Default .40 S&W & 10mm lead

    I'm going to start reloading for my .40S&W (Springfiled XDm). The 40 and 10mm are the same diameter bullet .400. I've checked the local stores here in valley/Anchorage area and have found some lead for the 10mm but little for my .40.

    My question is with the diameter being the same, can you buy "10mm" lead and push it through my .40???

    Thanks.
    Brian

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    Quote Originally Posted by USMC RET View Post
    I'm going to start reloading for my .40S&W (Springfiled XDm). The 40 and 10mm are the same diameter bullet .400. I've checked the local stores here in valley/Anchorage area and have found some lead for the 10mm but little for my .40.

    My question is with the diameter being the same, can you buy "10mm" lead and push it through my .40???

    Thanks.
    Brian
    Yes you can.

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    Quote Originally Posted by USMC RET View Post
    I'm going to start reloading for my .40S&W (Springfiled XDm). The 40 and 10mm are the same diameter bullet .400. I've checked the local stores here in valley/Anchorage area and have found some lead for the 10mm but little for my .40.

    My question is with the diameter being the same, can you buy "10mm" lead and push it through my .40???

    Thanks.
    Brian
    Yup, the 40 is just a shortened 10mm case and all things 10mm will work in the 40. The 10mm came first so some older die sets just say 10mm but are the same as those listed as 10mm/40S&W. All the bullets will work fine so long as they are not so flat nosed that they won't feed due to the sharper angles in the shorter 40S&W feed system. In other words, 40s like rounder noses . . . 10s feed flat noses better than 40s so conceder feeding when you buy your bullets.
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  4. #4

    Question Do you folks

    have any problems with barrels leading up with shooting lead bullets? Or does the hardness or lower velocities keep that to a tolerable minimum? I've been using just jacketed with my 40's, but lead would certainly be less expensive.
    If you like getting kicked by a mule...then you'll "love" shooting my .458.

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    Leading is usually caused more by to small of bullet rather than to soft. A hard bullet that is too small may lead more than a softer one. The "It needs to be hard cast" is mostly myth. Go with .401 or even .402 lead bullets to help prevent leading as bore seal is more important than hardness.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rbuck351 View Post
    Leading is usually caused more by to small of bullet rather than to soft. A hard bullet that is too small may lead more than a softer one. The "It needs to be hard cast" is mostly myth. Go with .401 or even .402 lead bullets to help prevent leading as bore seal is more important than hardness.
    I agree with everything here about leading but want to clarify on the myth of hard cast.
    “The "It needs to be hard cast" is mostly myth.”
    That’s quite true for leading but when it comes to terminal ballistics on live tissue hard cast being better than soft lead is no myth. Terminal ballistics is why we want hard cast. But like you say it is less likely to deform and fill the bore than soft lead even copper jacketed soft lead so it's much more likely to allow hot gases between the bullet and bore causing leading.
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    I suppose I should say what I mean by hard cast. First "soft" or pure lead won't work well in the 40 or 10mm. Air cooled wheel weights at about 11/12 bhn (still not hard cast) should work in the 40. Water cooled wheel weights at about 16/18 bhn (medium hard) should work in the 10mm. Hard cast 20+ bhn should not be needed in most handguns. Actually acww should be fine for the 10mm and still be hard enough to penetrate without expanding much if any. Most of what is called hard cast is harder than need be for most handgun velocities and tends to aggravate leading. 1200 fps just doesn't need to be that hard and still won't expand much at that speed. If were talking 454 or 460 at near 2000fps then hard cast may be needed. I'm shooting a 454 puma with cast at about 2000 fps using water cooled wheel weights. No leading but I haven't shot anything with it yet, so I don't have results on expansion. So yes, you are right in that soft lead won't work. But, BHN 20+ certainly won't be needed either.

  8. #8

    Default Thanks for the info

    That's what I like most about this forum. You can always get good info from the "guys" in the field.

    Thanks again.
    Brian

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    Quote Originally Posted by rbuck351 View Post
    I suppose I should say what I mean by hard cast. First "soft" or pure lead won't work well in the 40 or 10mm. Air cooled wheel weights at about 11/12 bhn (still not hard cast) should work in the 40. Water cooled wheel weights at about 16/18 bhn (medium hard) should work in the 10mm. Hard cast 20+ bhn should not be needed in most handguns. Actually acww should be fine for the 10mm and still be hard enough to penetrate without expanding much if any. Most of what is called hard cast is harder than need be for most handgun velocities and tends to aggravate leading. 1200 fps just doesn't need to be that hard and still won't expand much at that speed. If were talking 454 or 460 at near 2000fps then hard cast may be needed. I'm shooting a 454 puma with cast at about 2000 fps using water cooled wheel weights. No leading but I haven't shot anything with it yet, so I don't have results on expansion. So yes, you are right in that soft lead won't work. But, BHN 20+ certainly won't be needed either.
    Yup, very well explained this time, didn't even leave me anything to add.
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    As far as flat nose .40's go, I've had 0 failures with Colorado cast 180gr Truncated cone bullets in my Walther P-99 and S&W 4026. The Smith is one of the few autos that will usually feed an empty case from the magazine into the chamber. The Walther is tremendously accurate if you can get past the trigger. Crunchenticker.
    "A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise, and independence to the mind."

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    Company called Redline makes 220gr hardcast truncated cone for the 10mm that are priced right & work well.
    You can get them direct from Redline or from Dillon (Redline is cheaper).
    Vance in AK.

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    As one who had cast over a 3/4 million bullets by hand i will tell you there is a big difference in soft vs hard for leading. Soft lead will cause problems when you reach any real velocity. If you have a good hard bullet with good lube you will not have any problems with leading. I have shot full power 06 loads with cast bullets and not had any leading. there was a time thats all i shot was cast bullets. for pistol it still is. I came upon about 2300lbs of Lynotype. I used to mix that with my WW for casting.

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    Attached is my list of cast bullet suppliers. I've had great luck with Missouri bullets in 45ACP, 357 & 44. I shoot Penn 165gr cast bullets in my XDM40. It is designed to duplicate the 165 Remington Golden Sabre bullet. All the ones I have tried ship USPS, over 60lbs for about $15. Missouri lists hardness ratings on their bullets. Penn has some great info on cast bullets.
    Attached Files Attached Files

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    kgpcr
    You failed to mention one thing. Hard cast with the proper lube will still lead if they are too small. .400 may be too small. If you shoot a hard ( too hard to obturate) bullet that is under groove size, it will most likely lead. For the 40 or the 10mm a .401 or .402 in the 12/15 bhn range with a good lube should not lead unless you have a rough barrel, oversize groove dia or some other gun related problem. You really should slug your barrel to see what size bullet you need. A little big is usually better than too small.

  15. #15

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    Double Tap sells hardcast .40/10 bullets in 200 and 230 grain if that helps.

  16. #16

    Smile Hijacking in progress

    OK so this whole thread started regarding .40 and 10mm lead interchangeability etc. and quickly moved to hard cast lead etc.

    I think you guys all have ADHD. We see shiny things and get distracted..... LOL....

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    Quote Originally Posted by USMC RET View Post
    OK so this whole thread started regarding .40 and 10mm lead interchangeability etc. and quickly moved to hard cast lead etc.

    I think you guys all have ADHD. We see shiny things and get distracted..... LOL....
    I think it was my fault for saying not all 10mm bullets will run in all 40S&W guns. Sorry?
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    Ok then. Yes you can load 10mm lead bullets in your 40S&W as they are the same cartridge other than length of case. Will they work? That is an individual gun vs bullet hardness,dia,nose shape,lube type etc question that no one can answer without trying your combination in your gun. Sorry to get of track but the discussion of hardness,bullet size etc is relevent to wheather they will work or not. The answer is often not as simple as the question.

  19. #19

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    AS stated above, check out Missouri Bullets. A good bullet at a great deal with shipping.

  20. #20

    Default Awesome info

    Thanks gang for the great info. One of the great parts of reloading is the experimentation with leads, powders, charges etc. Just "another" reason to keep heading to the range!!

    Brian

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