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Thread: Kit Fox?

  1. #1
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    Default Kit Fox?

    I know, I know... just buy a real airplane. But I've still got questions!

    Anybody flown a Kit Fox? I've always been curious as to what kind of performance they get. What kind of performance with one person and some camping gear. What kind of performance with 2 people? Seems like they pop up for sale off and on, just don't know much about them.

    Lets hear the good, the bad, the ugly!

    Thanks,
    JB

  2. #2

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    There are more than 5 different models of Kitfoxs with many different engine starting from 2-cycle Rotax 447, 503, 582, going to 4-stroke Rotax 912, 914 and to regular Continental o-200 and Lyc O-235. Performance depends on the particular configuration, but in general they all have good STOL performance.

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    The ones I have seen the only camping gear you have room for is a tooth brush.
    Steve

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    I was just curious about the kitfox 4. There seem to be a few a around. Sounds like I better cut the handle off of my tooth brush so that I have room for some tp.

    JB

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    Quote Originally Posted by jrb View Post
    I know, I know... just buy a real airplane. But I've still got questions!

    Anybody flown a Kit Fox? I've always been curious as to what kind of performance they get. What kind of performance with one person and some camping gear. What kind of performance with 2 people? Seems like they pop up for sale off and on, just don't know much about them.

    Lets hear the good, the bad, the ugly!

    Thanks,
    JB
    You would be surprised what can be stuffed in a KF. I have a couple hundred hours in a KF II and about 90 hrs in my Avid "C" model. On floats with a 582 they are a single person plane. I can haul around myself, 28 gallons of fuel and about 150# of gear. I put an extended baggage in mine and it is quite useful. For fun cheap flying, it is the most fun you can have with your clothes on!

    Wheels and Skis, they perform very well with a 582!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PsUrTK2WlSM

    I have a few vids on there showing the avid and kitfox out playing around.

    I am getting ready to make a belly pod for mine so when on floats, I can load more gear right under the CG.
    Last edited by avidflyer; 11-11-2009 at 09:01. Reason: added content

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    Member algonquin's Avatar
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    Default look at a Pacer

    A pacer will carry 2 people plus a bunch of gear. Usefull of about 850lbs , hard to beat for 25 grand or so. 4 seats for airport to airport ops. My two cents. good luck tom

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    Quote Originally Posted by algonquin View Post
    A pacer will carry 2 people plus a bunch of gear. Usefull of about 850lbs , hard to beat for 25 grand or so. 4 seats for airport to airport ops. My two cents. good luck tom
    I agree its hard to beat the price, BUT Pacers are not LSA aircraft.
    If I were looking I go with a Stinson with a Cont O-470 upgrade.
    There was one in Oregon for 30k last month.

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    Member algonquin's Avatar
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    Smile lots more gas

    I had two pacers and now a C180. The 180 burns 12.5 -13.0 gals p/hr the little pacer (135hp) 7.5 -8 and the 160hp 9-10.5 depending on wt. The short wings need power to perform when heavy, =gas burn. The 180 just burns that much w/ o-470. Also the 135 hp pacer is happy with auto fuel and the 180 isn't so much.
    There isn't any easy answer to the question, The great debate rages on! I would guess buy what makes you happy and only pay what you figure you can get back out for if the romance fades and you need the younger women, faster airplanes, bigger antleres thing. Best of luck Tom

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    Quote Originally Posted by jrb View Post
    I know, I know... just buy a real airplane. But I've still got questions!

    Anybody flown a Kit Fox? I've always been curious as to what kind of performance they get. What kind of performance with one person and some camping gear. What kind of performance with 2 people? Seems like they pop up for sale off and on, just don't know much about them.

    Lets hear the good, the bad, the ugly!

    Thanks,
    JB
    I have a Kitfox N703KA, it is a Series 7 Supersport SLSA. http://www.kitfoxaircraft.com/Kitfox-SLSA.htm You can see it on the Kitfox web page, it is the Blue & White one. It flys a heck of a lot better than a J3 Cub, or a Cessna 172. It is very easy to convert to flying the Stick. I will handle a 25+ Cross wind, as a tri gear. Currently 703KA is Tri Gear Versions, sooner or later I plan on converting to the Tail Dragger. About 4.0 to 4.5 Gallons per hour. Mine Cruises at about 110 MPH. I can carry two 200lb adults, and about 10 lbs legally. Since it is an SLSA it is rated at 1320 LBS. However, had it been registered as an Experimental, I could have registered it to carry 1550. I am contemplating flying to Alaska in it, with one person I can put 150 lbs of baggage in the storage behind the pilot / Passenger seat. There was a gaggle of them that flew together to Alaska in 2000, and there was a Man from Mexico, that flew from somewhere in Mexicop through Texas, and up to Alaska. He had a YouTube series he had put together, about 10, covering the flight.

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    Although I am a Cub fan, I can see where being able to fold the wings and trailer the plane home would be a VERY good thing.
    Floatplane,Tailwheel and Firearms Instructor- Dragonfly Aero
    Experimental Hand-Loader, NRA Life Member
    http://site.dragonflyaero.com

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    Member avidflyer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Float Pilot View Post
    Although I am a Cub fan, I can see where being able to fold the wings and trailer the plane home would be a VERY good thing.
    That was my original thoughts, however, after doing that very thing for a couple months, I found it much eaiser to just pay the local airport tiedown fee. It is nice to be able to fold the wings and put it on the trailer and bring it to the garage for the maintenance work in the middle of the winter, or when that big wind storm is predicted to come through I can go grab it and put it in the garage in under an hour door step to door step.

    The issues that Paul Z stated on the weights is sort of only partialy true. There is only a weight restriction on the LSA of the 1320# maximum take off weight (note, it does not read GROSS weight in the FAA regs, but Maximum take off weight) As an experimental Ameture built there is no place on the FAA paperwork to list a gross weight. The "gross weight" is what you, the manufacture of the plane say you want to fly it with. The only place to list a weight is on the weight and ballance and that is not a registered document with the FAA.

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    I knew if I kept searching I could find the flight of Miguel Ramirez Mexico to Alaska. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8s9SHVDmUkw

    It is rather interesting. I would watch them all, when he had comentary I would pause the video and use Google to translate what I didn't understand. There are probably 12 videos starting in Mexico, and ending in Barrow. He started out, 2 hours south of MCAllen Texas, about 250 miles into Mexico.

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    The sea salt air and wind in Homer make outside tie-downs a very destructive thing in winter.

    Hey Paul compare some numbers from my Cub.
    I use a J3C converted to a PA-11 with a 90 horse.

    18 gallons of fuel at 4 gallon per hour burn.
    Empty weight on 26 inch tires: 770 lbs
    Empty weight on floats: 789 lbs
    Legal gross on wheels: 1220 lbs
    Legal Gross on floats: 1300 lbs (would be 1350 if it was born as a PA-11)
    Legal Useful load on floats: 511 pounds
    Legal useful load on 26 inch wheels: 450 pounds

    Cruise sped on wheels: 80-85 mph on 26 inch tires with flat prop
    Cruise on floats: 75-80 mph, on EDO 1400s
    Stall Speed: 38 mph
    VX=50 mph
    Vy=55 mph
    best glide: 55 mph

    Rate of climb on wheels: 1,200 fpm
    Rate of climb on floats: 900 fpm

    Take-off distance NO WIND measured with one pilot and half fuel: 150 ft wheels
    Take-off distance NO WIND Full gross weight plus a little: 300 ft wheels.
    Floatplane,Tailwheel and Firearms Instructor- Dragonfly Aero
    Experimental Hand-Loader, NRA Life Member
    http://site.dragonflyaero.com

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    Default Take a look at the Just Highlander

    You should take a look at the Just Highlander. There's no comparison with a Kit Fox. It can take engines from 100 to 120 HP. Huge cargo area, useful load 700lbs (assuming you build it light) LSA compliant but it was originally certified to GW 1550 lbs. (I would never fly over gross but I've heard it's been done.) Stall 27mph! Cruise is slower than a Pacer, about 100mph. The only thing that is really cool with a Kit Fox is that it has an option for a radial engine now.

    http://www.justaircraft.com/news.php

    Pacer's and Cubs are great planes but most of them are getting pretty old. Unless you strip one down to the airframe and rebuild it you don't really know what you have. The best thing about going experimental is the reduced maintenance cost. Resale value for experimental is always iffy but most certified planes have lost value recently so you never know.

    No I am not a Highlander salesman.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tralika View Post
    You should take a look at the Just Highlander. There's no comparison with a Kit Fox. It can take engines from 100 to 120 HP. Huge cargo area, useful load 700lbs (assuming you build it light) LSA compliant but it was originally certified to GW 1550 lbs. (I would never fly over gross but I've heard it's been done.) Stall 27mph! Cruise is slower than a Pacer, about 100mph. The only thing that is really cool with a Kit Fox is that it has an option for a radial engine now.

    http://www.justaircraft.com/news.php

    Pacer's and Cubs are great planes but most of them are getting pretty old. Unless you strip one down to the airframe and rebuild it you don't really know what you have. The best thing about going experimental is the reduced maintenance cost. Resale value for experimental is always iffy but most certified planes have lost value recently so you never know.

    No I am not a Highlander salesman.
    A buddy bought an Avid MK IV last year for 5500, put 2000 into it and sold it for 17,500. The kitfox line seems to hold value pretty well and are great for what they were designed for (low and slow and having pure fun). The Radial KF is one cool looking and sounding machine, but for the price, you can go buy a nice cub.

    The highlander or an S-7 is probably more practical for up here, but you just cant beat a KF or Avid for the $ and fun factor!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Z View Post
    I knew if I kept searching I could find the flight of Miguel Ramirez Mexico to Alaska. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8s9SHVDmUkw

    It is rather interesting. I would watch them all, when he had comentary I would pause the video and use Google to translate what I didn't understand. There are probably 12 videos starting in Mexico, and ending in Barrow. He started out, 2 hours south of MCAllen Texas, about 250 miles into Mexico.
    Thank you so much for sharing. That was an awesome compilation of an excellent trip from Mexico to Alaska! So entertaining!

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    If you are looking at kits, I've been looking at the bearhawk. It is something and the patrol model is one heck of a plane as well.

    http://www.bearhawkaircraft.com/
    Semper Fi and God Bless

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    Quote Originally Posted by tboehm View Post
    If you are looking at kits, I've been looking at the bearhawk. It is something and the patrol model is one heck of a plane as well.

    http://www.bearhawkaircraft.com/
    Yep it is a performer. A guy from outside Phoenix has one hangerd here at G'wood. I think Joe built it and sold his Cub.

    I flew in the BH at Lakeland and BSd with Bud some. It's hauling capacity and large cargo door is better then almost all it's size. It's tube and cloth.

    Was one dialing number away from ordering one abt 3-yrs ago. I know there were 2-kits went to Slowdotna..

    The Murphy out of Chilliwick, BC is worth looking at too.

    But...the Murphy and the BH are full size big boy planes. ha!.

    RR

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