.375 Ruger, Barnes 300gr TSX RL-17
I just finished loading 40 samples. 8 recipes of 5 shots each. Test will be to plot pressure curve with chronograph readings.
Rifle is clean now, rifle will be cleaned after 2nd, 4th and 6th groups. A fouling round will be shot prior to 1st, 3rd, 5th and 7th groups. Cooling between each 5 shot group will as needed, it's warm down here.
I'm winging it on these loads based on H4350 numbers, some may not be shot if max pressure is found early.
Currently COL is 3.372, ogive is .055 off the lands in my rifle and feeds well from the magazine at this length. If max pressure is reached in this session best group will be chosen and seating depth will be tweaked for next shoulder pounding session providing things are looking good.
My rifle likes .124 off in the 270gr TSX the best but the 300gr TSX contacts the lands at a different ogive measurment so I'm starting over.
I had descent results with H4350 in the past. Groups got better as velocity increased but compressed loads were hit prior to acceptable groups or max load. I'm hoping the RL-17 will be a better powder for the heavy bullet. 81.9gr of RL-17 is not yet compressed at this length but it's getting very close.
70.5gr of RL-15 shot just under an inch with the 300gr TSX's but velocity was slower than desired at peak curve. Since it does so well with 270gr TSX's I'm trying to get the magic combination with 300gr TSX's, it may never happen.
This rifle shoots 300gr Game Kings and 300gr Partitions quite well at 2654fps with 73.0gr of RL-15 and 83.0gr of RL-19.
Since it does so well with 270gr TSX's I'm trying to get the magic combination with 300gr TSX's, it may never happen.
The joy of reloading, results will be posted mid day tomorrow.
I got an early start at the range this morning, 0630. Testing went well as all chronograph data was collected with no error messages. Flags were flying taut, targets were at the 100yard line, 300gr bullets handle the wind pretty well.
All velocities are five shot averages:
77.9gr 2585fps +23fps good group
78.6gr 2611fps +26fps
79.3gr 2635fps +24fps
80.0gr 2662fps +27fps most velocity per 0.1gr of charge, worst ES/SD. Not sure about that correlation.
80.7gr 2677fps +15fps
81.4gr 2690fps +13fps best group
81.9gr 2697fps +07fps best ES/SD, 7/4
Charge efficiency was falling off after 80.0grs. Best SD and ES numbers came at the three highest case fills suggesting that RL-17 likes a full case in the 375 Ruger. The knee of the curve falls in between 80.0 - 80.7gr. However, best accuracy in todays test came at 81.4gr.
I may have just got lucky with todays shooting, see pic. I will seat the next batch at .050, .075, .100 and .125 off the lands with the 81.4gr charge. It will most likely be a few days before I can get back to the range.
In closing, it appears that the 375 Ruger shooting Barnes 300gr TSX is a winning combination.
I always like reading your posts, Marshall. You offer a great amount of information & detail. I also like the fact you're a fan of the .375" bore.
Thanks for taking the time to post!
My pleasure Dan, and yes I love the 375 Ruger. Those with the 23" African will most likely see better velocities than my 20" Alaskan using this powder.
Originally Posted by Dan in Alaska
I noticed you're a 375H&H fan. 4350 powders work well in the 375 H&H too. You might be able to get a compressed load of RL-17 to work well in the H&H. Let me know if you try and how it works out.
What signs of pressure, if any, did you encounter?
I've pretty much settled on the RL-15/270gr TSX combo for my .375 H&H. It puts the hurt on critters, and I've been plenty satisfied with this pairing.
I have been playing with RL-17 in my .280AI and .25-284, though. Unfortunately, I don't have nearly as detailed notes as you do. I need to improve on my note-taking & remembering to drag the chronograph to the range. I'm getting lazy in that regard.
Originally Posted by BrentC
No firm lifts at the highest load but chrony showed no need to load more powder. Higher charges resulted in less gain in velocity per tenth of charge loaded.
Primers were CCI 250's, they were not showing any pain, mild shooters all the way.
Cases were trimmed to 2.570, after firing they only grew to 2.5705, virtually nothing. The long soft hitting burn gave a good push to these 300gr TSX's.
I've loaded the same combo in a good friends Rem 700 375H&H, it likes the RL-15 and the 270TSX. That powder seems to kick with a hard fast light off.
Originally Posted by Dan in Alaska
I may drag it out and work up a RL-17 test batch. My notes show a compressed load of H-4350 did well with 300gr TSX's in his rifle so the RL-17 may do better?
I need finish up on my rifle first, to many open projects.
Very Interesting. Thanks for the detail. I would like to try RL-17 in my 375 H&H with 260 grain Accubonds and Partitions. Where would I look for some load data (can't seem to find any on Alliant's web site). I know it's a similar burn rate to the 4350's but I wouldn't mind seeing some sort of official load data.
That's where I'm at. I'm got five .223's I'm currently playing with. Trying to do them all at once is a handful.
Originally Posted by marshall
To my knowledge there is none. I used notes from previous H4350 data and started with that. The RL-17 is running about 60fps faster at equivalent charges. It pushed this 300gr TSX to the harmonics that my barrel seems to like in this weight.
Originally Posted by Double Shovel
The H&H does well with a full case of H4350 so the RL-17 may work for you too. I burned up plenty of bullets today. Start low and work up. I'm thinking about working up a load for the H&H too.
I would consider starting with 76.0gr of RL-17 and step it up in 1.0gr increments until compression around 81.0grs. Plan on pulling bullets from the higher loads if pressure shows early.
P.S. Nice moose!
Thanks, I always enjoy and appreciate your posts. One question: What if any crimp are you using?
None at this time Dave. With the TSX and it's grooves it's hard to crimp with my die set if the case neck doesn't sit a few thousands above the groove at its loaded length.
Originally Posted by Daveintheburbs
Once I dial in the seated length during the next test session I plan on a light taper crimp for the finished product.
Todays test results had surprisingly good accuracy, perhaps deeper seating like the 270TSX my rifle likes will do even better. If so the grooves on the 300TSX will match up nice with a 2.570 case trim length. If not a longer case trim may do the trick. I don't want to trim shorter since the Ruger case is allready a little short in the neck.
The picture in post #12 of Brett's information,( http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/...t=65641&page=2 ) shows a TSX on the far right. It appears to have a taper crimp in the first groove. If loaded length lines up with case trim and any one of the grooves your in good shape. If not there is plenty of neck tension. I have shot TSX's from the magazine with no crimp and had no jump. I do have a muzzle break, that does reduce the likelihood of jump.
Last edited by marshall; 11-04-2009 at 14:39.
Reason: add pics
Thanks Marshall!!! I'll be looking for RL-17 to load them up.
I hope I'm not boring anyone to death with this post. This morning I finished up the loads for the final test.
First, the best powder charge was determined from the previous test related to this post. I've loaded this batch in various seating depths to fine tune what appears to be a already good shooting rifle / load combination.
The following data reflects seating depths measured off the lands to the ogive using Hornady OAL equipment.
RL-17 @ 81.5gr
Hornady Brass 2.572
Barnes 300gr TSX
Ogive / COL / distance off lands
1.) 2.712 / 3.297 / .125 off
2.) 2.737 / 3.322 / .100 off
3.) 2.762 / 3.347 / .075 off
4.) 2.787 / 3.372 / .050 off
5.) 2.812 / 3.397 / .025 off
These numbers reflect measurements in my rifle. COL varies +/- .011 due to bullet construction, but ogive measurements are spot on.
I sorted the bullets by weight. This box of 50 varied from 298.7gr - 301.1gr. Each three in a recipe are sorted to weigh the same for data collection. In the real world it's not worth the time or effort it takes to sort bullets for the intended purpose of a rifle or cartridge of this caliber.
With any luck I'll sneak off to the range Monday or Tuesday and put these on paper @ 100 yards. Left to right is recipe 1-5 and five additional bullets seated .055 off on the far right, that's the original recipe so I know it shoots well. They're for whacking steel plates at 200, 300, 400 and 500 yards to confirm forecasted trajectory. The plates are 12"X12" at 200yards and 24"X24" beyond. They're quite easy to hit and make a loud bang when whacked by a 375.
Wondering if you ever made it to the range to check those new loads?
Perhaps tomorrow morning Bob. My mothers husband has been in the hospital so I flew out to Austin, TX on my days off to help her out, she's 81. I just got back home late last night and have a few honey doo's to get caught up today.
Originally Posted by BobG
I'm looking forward to finishing the data and will post as soon as I get it done, thanks for checking.
Thanks for the info folks. I'm building up a .375 Ruger on a 1909 Arg. action. I'm going with a longer tube 24-25" I'll let y'all know how it shoots.
I'm planning on using "300s" pretty much exclusively.
I'll keep ya posted.
I made it out to the range this morning to shoot the recipes in the #15 post on this thread. I couldn't possibly be any happier with this rifle and load combination, #3 was the clear winner.
The pictures attached reflect the 5 seating depth variations to be tested from the previous velocity tests. 6 targets are recipes 1-5 plus the fouling target that was shot to make scope adjustments and foul the clean bore. The foulers were repeats from the 7th recipe in the first test and chronographed at 2698fps today.
My rifle has always shot the 270gr TSX with .5moa accuracy but refused to shoot the 300gr TSX until now. Target #3 group measured at .545 outside to outside. When you subtract the .375 bullet diameter you get the center to center group of .170 inches. Needless to say I feel pretty good about this mass produced American made rifle.
Today's velocities are up from the first test by 38fps. I added .1gr of powder that should only reflect an increase of 3.3fps. The other variables were seating depth and an increase in outside air temperature of 20 degrees.
Groups were shot with a 1.5-6X24mm Leupold.
RL-17 @ 81.5gr @ 2728 FPS
Hornady Brass trim 2.572
Barnes TSX 300gr, BC .357
Ogive 2.762, .075 off the lands
These results are in my rifle, yours may vary. If you use this data please work up to the load that your rifle prefers. This data may assist you in a starting point. Longer barrel rifles will have higher pressure!!!
When this load is sighted at 2.8" high at 100yards the ballistic chart in the attached picture is what can be expected.
I shot a few rounds at steels this morning to confirm trajectory. I hit the steels at 300, 400 and 500 yards with one shot attempts. I would say that the data is accurate.
The steel in the pic was at 400 yards, the Barnes TSX is the shiny copper spot