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Thread: Which would you choose?

  1. #1
    Member The Kid's Avatar
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    Default Which would you choose?

    OK with all the hullabuloo going on over at the Most accurate factory rifle thread I just thought I would post this question in a new thread to keep from hijacking that one.

    So this is all completely theoretical but lets go into imaginary land for a bit and see what you all think.
    You are an avid hunter and handloader, as many of us are and you have only one big game rifle at your disposal(remember this is imaginary land). You have a big hunt booked that you have spent alot of hard earned dough on. You have been busy loading ammo and dialing in your only rifle, lets say just for fun that it happens to be chambered for the 300 Winchester magnum. You have tried every concievable combination of bullet and powder as well as factory ammo, and the only load that will shoot to the magical MOA mark happens to launch a Sierra Matchking. All of the other loads shoot around 1.75 to 2.25in groups at 100yds. There is not enough time to drop it off at the gunsmiths place, and you have a decision to make.

    So do you use the magic MOA load with its very lightly constucted bullet or do you choose a less accurate load shooting something like a Nosler Partition?

    I know what load I would take so lets here what all yoou accuracy fanatics have to say.

  2. #2
    Member Rod in Wasilla's Avatar
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    I'd use the appropriate bullet and limit the range of my shots to about 150 yards. It's the ethical thing to do.
    Quote Originally Posted by northwestalska
    ... you canít tell stories about the adventures you wished you had done!

  3. #3

    Default What Animal

    And what animal are we hunting in imaginary land in what type of terrain?
    "Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything."

  4. #4

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    MOA is keyboard ballistics when it comes to big game hunts. You just don't need it. Go with the bullet that has the best terminal performance for your game. 2 MOA is plenty accurate for deer out to 300-400 yards. It's probably good for moose twice that far.

    My "most accurate" hunting rifle won't do better than 2 MOA most days from a bench, but I've never owned another that shot so well offhand. Since I don't have a backpacking benchrest and have to take lots of offhand shots in brush and tall grass, it's my rifle of choice over several that will break MOA with almost any load from a bench.

  5. #5
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    Very interesting and realistic scenario for many people...

    I'll try to keep it as is without adding other information. However, you didn't mention the species of game that you are hunting (or at least I don't recall seeing it).

    If you are hunting non-dangerous game, then I'd go with the Match-Kings and try to keep my shots beyond 150 or so...I wouldn't want to hit an animal at close range with the velocity of the 300 WM using the Match-Kings. However, if you are hunting dangerous game (brown bear), then I'd change bullets to something more stout, accept the reduced accuracy, and keep my shots within 100yards. I've personally taken (or assisted in taking) several brown bears, and they all have been taken from 15, 35, 70 and 90 yards.

    Let's see what others have to say...

    Doc

  6. #6
    Member The Kid's Avatar
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    Default Whoops forgot

    Sorry I forgot to say that we are hunting on the in the interior for Moose and maybe a bear if you see one to your liking.

  7. #7
    Moderator hunt_ak's Avatar
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    I'd say any of those loads are 'minute of moose'....

    Pick the better bullet....

  8. #8
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    Absolutely would go with the Partition and the 2 inch groups. That combination would still shoot better than 99% of the hunters under actual hunting conditions, myself included.

    300 yards away the combo would still shoot to within 3.5 inches of where I was aiming. Heck, this years moose was shot with my iron sighted double offhand at a lasered 187 yards away.

    I will most likely catch slack for this, but to many hunters can only shot well off a bench. Man up guys. I love accurate rifles but no one needs a sub moa rifle for big game in Alaska.
    Tennessee

  9. #9
    Member Diesel Nut's Avatar
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    The load with the best bullet for the job, hands down. I can always get closer if necessary but honestly, a moose kill zone is roughly the size of an oven door and it doesn't take 1MOA accuracy to consistently hit that even at 300+yds

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    You're punching critters not paper.. Pick a good one and do the best you can with it.

  11. #11
    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    Bullets and ethics are always more inportant than MOA. MOA is for target shooters

  12. #12
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    Excellent comments guys...all very realistic and non-bs.

    Doc

  13. #13

    Default Partitions

    Partition load in that scenario. I would have to say that a sub moa rifle CAN be useful for a big game rifle in Alaska. 2 MOA at 100 does not equal within 3.5" of your aim at 300, unless I'm missing something it's almost 6.3" . If you are making a 400 yard shot on a sheep and your rifle is a 2" rifle, you could hit 8"+ inches from your aim point, and that's with a perfect rest. A Match King will kill a sheep.
    "Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything."

  14. #14
    Member Armymark's Avatar
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    You can hunt through the 2 MOA accuracy issue. The moment of truth is the well placed bullet that does not fail. If you work in to an ethical shot and the bullet does the job, you have brought together your skill as a hunter and a rifleman. You made the right choices understanding the limitations of all the aspects of the hunt. If you work your way in to a well placed shot and the bullet comes apart, you made a choice to risk the defining moment to something you could have controlled. In my opinion, the better hunter will work through the variable to a sure kill.

    "The best sniper is not always the best shot, it is the preparation and the decisions made that make a good sniper." (The Schoolhouse)

  15. #15
    Member 1Cor15:19's Avatar
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    I would absolutely use the Partition; no second thoughts at all. That kind of accuracy is "minute of moose" to as far as I would consider shooting one.

    Quote Originally Posted by blackfoot View Post
    Partition load in that scenario. I would have to say that a sub moa rifle CAN be useful for a big game rifle in Alaska. 2 MOA at 100 does not equal within 3.5" of your aim at 300, unless I'm missing something it's almost 6.3" . If you are making a 400 yard shot on a sheep and your rifle is a 2" rifle, you could hit 8"+ inches from your aim point, and that's with a perfect rest. A Match King will kill a sheep.
    2 MOA would be within approximately 3 inches point of aim at 300 yards all things being equal. 2 MOA should theoretically produce an approximate 6 inch group at 300 yards. No more than 3 inches high or low, left or right of point of aim to get in the 6 inch group.

  16. #16

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    Moose are not all that hard to kill. A well placed matchking between the ribs and through the lungs would end with a dead moose every time. I have used remington core lokts to shoot moose and caribou. They have always worked fine. I'm not sure the core lokt is any better than a match king. I think I may have read that match kings are used regularly for 308 military sniper loads. They must be fairly decent if the military uses them.

    For bear, I would not use a match king. I would pick something with a more robust construction(partition, a-frame, woodleigh, etc.)

    Hey Kid, why don't you get busy and finish my 375, so I don't have to worry about these anemic 30 caliber loads.....

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by 1Cor15:19 View Post
    I would absolutely use the Partition; no second thoughts at all. That kind of accuracy is "minute of moose" to as far as I would consider shooting one.



    2 MOA would be within approximately 3 inches point of aim at 300 yards all things being equal. 2 MOA should theoretically produce an approximate 6 inch group at 300 yards. No more than 3 inches high or low, left or right of point of aim to get in the 6 inch group.
    Right, my bad. I still say there is a use for an MOA rifle in Alaska hunting, sheep hunting in particular, but I agree that in this scenario the partition would be the way to go. When you throw in shooter error, slight mis judgement in range, steep angles, etc., you want all the accuracy you can get from your rifle if you're shooting over 300.
    "Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything."

  18. #18
    Sponsor ADfields's Avatar
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    Partition and 2MOA will do just fine for me.
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  19. #19

    Default OK

    Considering lots of moose and bears are killed with pointy sticks every year, I'm of the mindset that a rifle that shoots a well constructed bullet at 3-4 MOA would be more than adequate in the hands of a semi-proffeceint hunter who could close his ranges to under 150 yds. HECK most archers shoot inside 50 yds; surely a rifle hunter is as good as an indian, LOL !!
    " Americans will never need the 2nd Amendment, until the government tries to take it away."

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  20. #20
    Member Vince's Avatar
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    Default

    well given that choice of MOA or different bullet.. i would swap the partitions with accubond and use them any way. 2 inches in a 10 inch hole is a lot of playground and IMO, the accubond is a better slug for the job... for about the same cost
    "If you are on a continuous search to be offended, you will always find what you are looking for; even when it isn't there."

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