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Thread: Obama Orders Review of Federal Subsistance

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    Member AKBassking's Avatar
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    Default Obama Orders Review of Federal Subsistance


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    Default Just fricking wonderful

    I can only imagine where this is heading!! Not good.

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    Member ret25yo's Avatar
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    And in further review of said subsistence rights............





    Obama appoints new Subsistence czar

    If you cant stand behind the troops in Iraq.. Feel free to stand in front of them.

  4. #4

    Default DOHhh

    OK, everybody drop your pants, bend over and grab your ankles this is gonna' sting >>>>>
    " Americans will never need the 2nd Amendment, until the government tries to take it away."

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    Member AKBassking's Avatar
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    Question Question

    Is there any other state that has federal subsistance?

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    Don't be getting all worked up over this, yet. Might as well see what comes of this. I suspecvt not much, and this is just Obama paying lip service. The Fed Subs. Program is run in accordance with the laws in ANILCA that created it. Likely will take an act of congress to make any serious changes. Even changing the members of the subsistence board can't just happen at the stroke of a presidents pen.
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    Member AKBassking's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by martentrapper View Post
    Don't be getting all worked up over this, yet. Might as well see what comes of this. I suspecvt not much, and this is just Obama paying lip service. The Fed Subs. Program is run in accordance with the laws in ANILCA that created it. Likely will take an act of congress to make any serious changes. Even changing the members of the subsistence board can't just happen at the stroke of a presidents pen.


    Now MT, as always I respect you opinion, however who controls Congress? It won’t take much to get that stroke of the pen and with Begich up there who knows.

    I have a bad feeling this is a little more than lip service............ We are a "Red" state......

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    Member bushrat's Avatar
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    I have to echo what MT said, wouldn't get panties in a bunch yet by jumping to conclusions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AKBassking View Post
    Is there any other state that has federal subsistance?
    I don't think so. I have never heard of it until I came here. But then again there is no other State that is like this either. For the Natives here that is there way of life and how they survive. Think about it all other Native Americans are placed on Reservations and stuff. Gonna be a tricky situation.
    Former A.F Staff Sergeant

  10. #10

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    That's the problem. We "Wait till we see what comes of it" then it's too late. It's a done deal by then.

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    Default Dear Barak Obama...

    Please send money to Alaska's Department of Fish & Game, they need it...they continue to get their budget cut & never get too many studies correct, as proven this past summer, when a weir counter near Pilot Station, UNDER counted king salmon & many people had to sacrifice subsistence practices that have been going on for CENTURIES before the US Constitution.

    As well, please put in an IMMEDIATE INJUNCTION on the pollock fishery over harvest of king salmon bycatch, as that's just wasted, & just like caribou rotting on a tundra, that's TOTALLY unacceptable.

    & Almighty Obama, I pray to you, O Great one, to open the eyes of the sportsmen & women of Alaska, to see that all subsistence users aren't the devil, & aren't given "special rights"...I mean, after all, I don't see anyone complaining about subsistence berry picking, eeling, or blackfishing. Please guide the AOC to greener pastures, & leadth them not to temptation of division, but one of unity, for all Alaskans, whether they subsist or tropy hunt, or guide, or what have you.

    In closing, I'd like to say that you can send tons of money to the Alaska Moose Federation, as they do a splendid job, of trying to "grow more moose" & that's a major staple of subsistence hunters, sport hunters & photographers, statewide. If you could give them one tenth of one percent of the TARP that you gave to banks, you'd be doing a world of Justice to the State of Alaska.

    In your name we Pray!

    AMENBA

  12. #12

    Default Pretty good stuff there!

    Quote Originally Posted by gogoalie View Post
    Please send money to Alaska's Department of Fish & Game, they need it...they continue to get their budget cut & never get too many studies correct, as proven this past summer, when a weir counter near Pilot Station, UNDER counted king salmon & many people had to sacrifice subsistence practices that have been going on for CENTURIES before the US Constitution.

    As well, please put in an IMMEDIATE INJUNCTION on the pollock fishery over harvest of king salmon bycatch, as that's just wasted, & just like caribou rotting on a tundra, that's TOTALLY unacceptable.

    & Almighty Obama, I pray to you, O Great one, to open the eyes of the sportsmen & women of Alaska, to see that all subsistence users aren't the devil, & aren't given "special rights"...I mean, after all, I don't see anyone complaining about subsistence berry picking, eeling, or blackfishing. Please guide the AOC to greener pastures, & leadth them not to temptation of division, but one of unity, for all Alaskans, whether they subsist or tropy hunt, or guide, or what have you.

    In closing, I'd like to say that you can send tons of money to the Alaska Moose Federation, as they do a splendid job, of trying to "grow more moose" & that's a major staple of subsistence hunters, sport hunters & photographers, statewide. If you could give them one tenth of one percent of the TARP that you gave to banks, you'd be doing a world of Justice to the State of Alaska.

    In your name we Pray!

    AMENBA

    GOGOALIE, Got a good laugh out of that! Thanks!

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    Member mod elan's Avatar
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    Sorta funny goalie, but even jokingly "praying" to BO makes me tummy sick

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    Quote Originally Posted by mod elan View Post
    Sorta funny goalie, but even jokingly "praying" to BO makes me tummy sick
    It is funny, but I can certainly see your point. Perhaps praying to BHO is inappropriate. I suspect it would be better to address him in a more non-religious manner. Maybe something like:

    Your Excellency,

    We, your humble subjects, beseech you to judiciously exercise your great wisdom in reviewing subsistence hunting in Alaska. Should you decree that we are unfit to harvest the king's deer (moose, caribou, etc), we implore you to extend the most generous welfare benefits you may bestow upon us and provide us, through your great beneficence, with a Walmart and Safeway in each village that we might refrain from the most barbarous practice of killing and consuming other living creatures.
    We remain, Your Excellency, your most obedient and undeserving servants; the residents of Alaska.
    We are right to take alarm at the first experiment upon our liberties.
    James Madison

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    Member Vince's Avatar
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    That could put all subsistence management back in the state's hands but would require the state give a priority to rural hunters.
    "I don't see that happening," Pourchot said. "Nobody I've talked to in years sees that happening."

    so Who do we have to call to get started on this?
    "If you are on a continuous search to be offended, you will always find what you are looking for; even when it isn't there."

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    Default An air drop is needed.

    If you have a wait & see attitude, you are likely to have an adverse reaction to what is decided and have no chance to voice your opinion.
    This is the time to be PROACTIVE.

    Maybe the BOG meetings should be cancelled so you can wait & see what the ADFG comes up with on their own.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince View Post
    so Who do we have to call to get started on this?
    The problem is that the state constitution pretty clearly prohibits a rural subsistence preference, which is required by ANILCA. This was why the feds took over in the first place. Every attempt the legislature made to comply with ANILCA was ruled unconstitutional by the state supreme court (rightly so, IMO). Nothing has changed.
    There are only 2 possible solutions to the problem at this point. Either ANILCA must be amended (not going to happen), or the state constitution has to be amended. Every previous attempt to do that has failed, leaving me to believe that we are stuck with federal management forever. At this point, it has been many years since the legislature has even seriously attempted to address this issue, and I'm not aware of any move under way now to change that. I think everyone in the legislature has essentially given up on it, and Knowles dropping the Katie John appeal pretty much signalled the end of the state of Alaska's resistance to federal management.
    We are right to take alarm at the first experiment upon our liberties.
    James Madison

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    Member bushrat's Avatar
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    Default There is a fix...

    ...and it has been attempted by Jay Hammond and Wally Hickel and a couple of legislators in the past:
    http://www.alaskabackcountryhunters....bsistence.html

    At the heart of this issue lies a right the federal government, however clumsily, was attempting to preserve: the right of certain people to subsist off the land and waters in a customary and traditional manner. This is still a right and privilege that many Alaskans (both Native and non-Native) enjoy not as a casual sport, but as an absolute necessity. Because Alaska is largely unroaded, and many places are accessible only by air or water, subsistence is still a vital, undiminished part of our heritage. However, it is also a vital part of the lives of tens of thousands who do not meet the federal government's definition of "rural." It was the federal government's mistake to believe that Alaska's customary subsistence traditions are based on location, or race, alone.

    In recognition of this, various individuals—from former governors Wally Hickel to Jay Hammond—have suggested a solution: in times of shortage, preference to fish and game use shall be given to residents residing in or near the affected Game Management Unit; so-called "Local Preference." This solution is acceptable and deemed fair by a great many Alaskans, and upholds the "common use" intent of our state constitution while still ensuring that subsistence use of a resource is the "highest and best use" in times of shortage.


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    Member walk-in's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bushrat View Post
    ...and it has been attempted by Jay Hammond and Wally Hickel and a couple of legislators in the past:
    http://www.alaskabackcountryhunters....bsistence.html

    At the heart of this issue lies a right the federal government, however clumsily, was attempting to preserve: the right of certain people to subsist off the land and waters in a customary and traditional manner. This is still a right and privilege that many Alaskans (both Native and non-Native) enjoy not as a casual sport, but as an absolute necessity. Because Alaska is largely unroaded, and many places are accessible only by air or water, subsistence is still a vital, undiminished part of our heritage. However, it is also a vital part of the lives of tens of thousands who do not meet the federal government's definition of "rural." It was the federal government's mistake to believe that Alaska's customary subsistence traditions are based on location, or race, alone.

    In recognition of this, various individuals—from former governors Wally Hickel to Jay Hammond—have suggested a solution: in times of shortage, preference to fish and game use shall be given to residents residing in or near the affected Game Management Unit; so-called "Local Preference." This solution is acceptable and deemed fair by a great many Alaskans, and upholds the "common use" intent of our state constitution while still ensuring that subsistence use of a resource is the "highest and best use" in times of shortage.

    I agree with you that this could be a potential solution, but I think it would still require a constitutional amendment based on the way the court has interpreted "common use" in the past. I just don't think there is the political will to deal with the issue, and I highly doubt a constitutional amendment will ever pass.
    We are right to take alarm at the first experiment upon our liberties.
    James Madison

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by walk-in View Post
    At this point, it has been many years since the legislature has even seriously attempted to address this issue, and I'm not aware of any move under way now to change that.
    You are quite wrong here in this statement.
    The AFN is at this moment crafting the resolution that will mandate the State of Alaska adhere to Federal Law.
    "96% of all Internet Quotes are suspect and the remaining 4% are fiction."
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