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Thread: 338 wsm velocity

  1. #1

    Default 338 wsm velocity

    Hey how fast could I get the 225 gr. TSX going out of a 338 wsm? I saw one load that claimed 2900 fps. Is that too optimistic? If that's for real than I'm pretty interested.

  2. #2
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    Default In Somebody's Dreams...

    Go_North,

    Not even close. It isn't possible in a 338 mag at normal pressure so I'm sure it won't happen in the smaller case.

    72.0 grains of RL-19 will drive a 225 grain bullet to 2800 fps in the my 338 WM with 22.5" barrel.

    In my 338 WSM 68.0 grains of RL-19 will almost get to 2700 fps but that is a hot load. It has a 22" barrel. I have tried several other powders but none can get a 225 grain over 2700 fps with normal pressure.

    Where are you looking for a 338 WSM? Custom gun, I suppose? It is a very handy and capable rifle but why do you need 2900 fps from a 225 grain bullet?
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    Default

    Do you mean the 325 WSM???

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    Default

    Barnes doesn't make the TSX in a 225 grainer for the 8mm so he cant be talking about a 325 whizzum.

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    Default

    If you need a little more vel but want to stick with a standard length action you might check out a 330 Dakota. I have a model 76 that with a 23" barrel and RL 19 ( drop tube) gets between 3050 fps and 3100 with Nos Part for moa accuracy. I really like the Barnes XXX but haven't had a chance to work up a new load for that particuar bullet in this rifle.

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    Default

    opps...re my prior above thread...225gr. bullet.

  7. #7

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    I was under the impression that the 330 Dakota and the 338 RUM were almost identical?? How do they compare- length, recoil, etc?

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    .338WM

    The maximum velocity for a Barnes 225-grain FLC (the blue color ones) in the Barnes #3 manual is listed at 2916 fps using XMR 4350 powder.

    With RL 19, maximum again, it's listed at 2914 fps.

    Then RL-22, maximum, listed at 2930 fps.
    -------------

    I imagine that such maximums could be attained with the 225-grain Triple-shock, but again, we are talking about maximum velocities and pressures. I don't think the .338WSM can attain those velocities.

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    Default

    John Barsness wrote on another forum that Winchester spent quite a bit of time developing the 338 WSM, but when they found they couldn't approach the velocities of the 338 WM, they went after the 8mm version, aka 325 WSM.

    I'm sure there are wildcatters out there pushing a 338 WSM to insane velocities with no respect for the pressures being generated. Velocity forsaking safety at all costs is a terrible tradeoff.

    I'm sure after the 375 Ruger is released there will be folks necking it up and down all over the place and from internet chatter of what the case capacity might be, it should be able to exceed the Win Mag case velocities with reasonable pressures.

  10. #10

    Question 338 mag velocity

    I have been working up a load for brown bear hunting using my 338 win mag browning with a 26-inch barrel and the 225 gr barnes TSX. With 72gr. of Reloader 19, I am getting velocities just under 2900 ft/sec. Thats at the maximum load and pressure.

    Do they even make a 338 WSM?????????


    Fuzzybear

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    Default 338 Wsm

    I seen a custom one built if I remember correctly by one of the Montana custom manufactures. I think it was a Cooper?

  12. #12

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    ok, w/all the 338 cartridges (including wildcats) out there, what's the lowest recoiling way to get the 225 gr. TSX to say 3000 fps? (preferably not magnum length)

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    Default 338's I have known...

    Yes, Virginia, there is a 338 WSM, sort of.

    I made one back about 2000 when I found the first quantity of WSM brass. It was and is a good caliber falling between the 338 Mag and the 338-06.

    I have a new one coming soon, made on a Montana action, Broughton barrel, NECG sghts, MPI stock, Leupold Quick detachable, weaver style scope mounts. I have a leupold 1.75-6x32 with a #4 reticle waiting for it.

    The 330 Dakota is 2.5" long and based (quite closely) on the 404 Jeffery case. The case head is .545" in diameter as is the body of this case, with a 30 degree shoulder. The 7mm, 300, 330, 375 and 404 Dakota cases are all of this dimension. The 416 Dakota is the 404 Jeffery case full length with an improved shoulder/neck and holds a lot of powder. The 330 Dakota is more efficient then the 338 RUM.

    The 338 RUM as with all of the RUM's has a rebated case head of .532" and a body diameter of approximately .550". These cases are full length, 2.900"-ish and require a longer action or a modified action to handle them.

    The WSM is essentially a shortened version of the RUMs. I don't know which of those two came first but the Dakota line was out before the RUMs or the WSMs.

    Several wildcats have been made on the 404 case over the course of the past twenty years, maybe longer. Ken Howell, for one, developed a series of cartridges on a shortened and "improved" 404 Jeffery case.

    As for a comparison of the 338 RUM and the 330 Dakota, I would say they are close in performance. The RUM will be about 100 fps faster across the board with any given bullet weight. The 330 will send a 250 grain bullet out at about 2850 fps. That's a lot of smack. Recoil in the same rifle will be little different between the two calibers. In the Dakota stock, the recoil of my 404 Dakota with a 400 grain bullet at 2450 fps, is very mild, more on the lines of the 338 WM in most guns. This from a 8.5# rifle. The 330 Dakota, in the model 76 stock, kicks about like a 30-06. The stock design is one of the best recoil reduction systems available.

    I don't like the belts but I like the ballistics of the 338 Win Mag. The 330 Dakota is a 338 Win Mag without a belt and a good 100 fps more velocity. That is the 225 grain bullet at about 2950-3000 fps, and the Dakota stock will absorb the recoil. Thats about as good as it gets if you want a 33 caliber rifle.
    Last edited by Murphy; 12-06-2006 at 19:24.
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  14. #14

    Default Federal HE

    I have chronographed Federal High Energy 338 WM factory ammo, loaded with 225 grain Trophy Bonded Bear Claw bullets, at about 3000 +/- 10 fps out of my 24" Browning A-bolt. Best I've ever done with handloads is about 2850.

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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Forestar View Post
    I have chronographed Federal High Energy 338 WM factory ammo, loaded with 225 grain Trophy Bonded Bear Claw bullets, at about 3000 +/- 10 fps out of my 24" Browning A-bolt. Best I've ever done with handloads is about 2850.
    2970 fps out of my Ruger with a 24" tube, but it was around 55 degrees that day, at the Cushman range in Fairbanks.

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    Default 338's - Winchester and Dakota....

    Had a 338 WM and liked it - even though I sold it (22" #2 barrel, magnaported, Brown stock, Ruger 77)....
    Now have 330 Dakota (24" barrel, magnaported, Brown stock, Dakota 97)...Like it better...can load to modest pressures for 338WM velocities, or load to higher pressures for 340Weatherby velocities...very versatile and efficient....my only complaint is that the only factory ammo comes from Dakota and is ridiculously expensive...I could pay that much and shoot less, but I refuse to....and knew that when I built the rifle...further, would prefer a 22" or 23" barrel for the type of hunting I do....

    I think that all Alaska-use 338s (WM or Dakota or Weatherby, etc.) should have iron sights - I like a fiber-optic front blade and a removable receiver sight rear...Magnaporting is great for reducing muzzle jump and speeding a follow up shot, though I can't say there is much recoil reduction....

    I supose that Ruger will reinvent the wheel and use their new .375Ruger case to make a 338Ruger, but all they are doing is what Don Allen (Dakota Arms) did in the early 90's - I think the 330Dakota is optimal for gunnuts who reload....BUT Ruger wants their name on cartridges that cover the same ground, rather than adopt the 404 based Dakota rounds....Too bad.

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    Default

    As a final note 330 Dakota brass, currently made by Norma (very good), is supposed to start being manufactured by Lapua (the best)....prob only of significance to reloaders.

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    Default Dakota Brass..

    Quote Originally Posted by shphtr View Post
    As a final note 330 Dakota brass, currently made by Norma (very good), is supposed to start being manufactured by Lapua (the best)....prob only of significance to reloaders.
    I was told by Ward at Dakota that their brass (for the 404 anyway) was made by Jamison (which is now located in Sturgis). I don't think it was made by Norma but it wasn't always made by Jamison. So you may well be right about Norma and Lapua but I specifically asked who made the 404 brass and was told Jamison, just down the street.

    The do have strong ties to Lapua and they have an unveiled caliber based on the 338 Lapua necked to .423 it is called the 425 Lapua. Should be a dandy. Also they do carry Lapua brass in other calibers.

    And, as a side note, I have some brass made by Lapua(obviously), which I bought from Graf & Son, sold as Dakota brass, in 30-06 but is headstamped D/A, 100th, 30-06.
    Dakota markets a special edition 100th anniversary 30-06 rifle and ammo and brass in this Lapua made case. It was priced for about $30 per 100 vs the normal $50 per 100 Lapua price. So it is a bargain for very good brass and somewhat special for the 100th annivesary of the 30-06.

    We've wound the original subject of this post around a bit but it's clear there is a strong following for the 338 bore diameter and the many calibers are well represented. It is a good caliber whether in Alaska or Texas. I have hunted with several different calibers of the 338 bore and all have served very well.
    Is there nothing so sacred on this earth that you aren't willing to kill or die for?



  19. #19

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    is there a 338-9.3x64 wildcat? What's it called? How does it compare to the Dakota?

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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by go_north View Post
    is there a 338-9.3x64 wildcat? What's it called? How does it compare to the Dakota?
    I don't know about that one, but there is a .338-404 wildcat. It uses .404 cases necked-down to .338-caliber bullets. I have heard that its ballistics are similar to the .338 RUM. There are a few loads for it posted on the Internet.

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