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Thread: Long Range rifle

  1. #1
    Member AkGreg's Avatar
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    Default Long Range rifle

    I am looking to buy a nice rifle that is dual purpose, long range target shooting (out to 1000 yrds) and hunting for caribou, antelope, deer etc.....

    If price is not a factor what set up would you go with?? I have settled on a nightforce scope...but the rifle/actions are still up in the air...

    thoughts??

    Greg

  2. #2

    Default long range

    I'm sure that in 1892 when Peter Paul Mauser was putting the finishing touches on a 7mm cartridge he had just designed, little did he know he was launching what would prove to be the most popular game caliber in the history of smokeless powder.

    One 7mm that enjoyed a certain degree of popularity in the '50s was the 7x61 Sharpe & Hart (left) and in the 1960s, the .284 Win.



    Here in the states the 7mm bore will in all probability remain a distant second in popularity to the .30 caliber, but when you consider the advantages the .30 has had, it's pretty impressive how popular the 7mm has become in such a relatively short span of time. After all, the .30 was the official caliber of the U.S. military from 1892 to 1967, first in the form of the .30-40 Krag, followed by the .30-06 and then the .308 Win. (7.62 NATO). Then there's the little matter of there being some 10 million Winchester Model 94 and Marlin lever-action rifles chambered in .30 WCF. It's no wonder, then, that no matter how you track it--through sales of loading dies, component bullets, loaded ammunition or unprimed brass--.30 will always come up number one simply because there are so many of them out there. New-gun sales figures, however, are something else again, for the 7mm competes quite successfully with the .30 in that category.


    Anyway, the 7mm as a smokeless-powder caliber was launched when Spain adopted the 7mm Mauser as its martial cartridge in 1893, first in a limited number of Mauser's Model of 1892, then in serious quantities in the Model '93. The cartridge is known by at least four names: Spanish Mauser, 7mm Mauser, 7x57 and in England as the .275 Rigby. It was eventually adopted by the armies of Mexico, Brazil, Chile, Uruguay, Colombia, Venezuela, Costa Rica, Serbia, China, Persia, Transvaal and the Orange Free State.








    There's nothing inherently superior ballistically in a 7mm bullet, but it just works out that in the most popular game weights, it has a remarkably high ballistic coefficient. Left to right: The 140-grain Nosler Ballistic Tip is rated at .485, the 150-grain Swift Scirocco at .515, the 154-grain Hornady SST at .530, the 160-grain Nosler AccuBond at .531, the 162-grain Hornady SPBT at .514 and the 162-grain Hornady SST/InterBond at .550.



    The first American company to chamber for the 7mm Mauser was Remington in its Model 1897 Rolling Block Military Carbine, the entire production of which went to the Mexican government. The following year, though, the chambering was offered in the No. 5 Sporting & Target Rifle version of the Rolling Block, along with the .30-30 Win. and .30-40 Krag. That same year the 7mm chambering was also added to the five-shot Remington-Lee bolt action rifle. In either case, relatively few 7mm Mauser rifles found themselves in the hands of America's hunters and shooters.


    The story here stayed pretty much the same through the 1920s, '30s and '40s--Remington only offered the 7mm in its '17 Enfield-based Model 30 bolt-action rifle and Winchester in its Model 54 (and later in the Model 70). All together, though, it was a mere drop in the bucket; few other than handloading rifle cranks were even aware of the 7mm's existence.

    Prior to the arrival of the .280 Rem in 1957, these three were the major players in the 7mm game (left to right): 7mm Mauser (7x57), 7x61 Sharpe & Hart and 7mm Weatherby Magnum.



    The only other 7mm cartridges that had any presence whatsoever on these shores were the 7x64 Brenneke and the 7x61 Sharpe & Hart, for which Norma of Sweden was the main source of ammunition--also, the 7mm Weatherby Magnum, which goes back to the mid-'40s. But again, we're talking a tiny percentage of avante garde hunters handloading for custom-built rifles. As a caliber, the 7mm was still wallowing in obscurity as late as the 1950s.


    That all started to change, however, in 1957 when Remington introduced its .280, the first commercial 7mm (.284) cartridge from a major American arms company. The .280's sole raison d'etre was to compete with the phenomenally popular .270 Win. With the 20/20 hindsight that time bestows, it can be said that Remington made a mistake by developing the .280 for use in the semiauto Model 740 because it had to be loaded to pressures levels below those used for the .270 Win., which was designed strictly for bolt guns. Once that decision had been made and there were rifles and ammo in the hands of consumers, there was no turning back.

  3. #3

    Thumbs up 7mm mag

    can't go wrong with the 7mm mag for long range, we turn the 7mm mag into real beanfield rifles, down here in south carolina we have what is called long range deer shooting, kenny garret built the first beanfield, now some mighty fine rifles are being built in tenn for this type shooting, 800 yards shots on deer is easy,
    the 264 mag is another good long range rifle
    7mm mag is the best

  4. #4
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    I have a 300 RUM for my long range hunting needs. The 338 RUM/EDGE/Lapua are all good long range cartridges too.

  5. #5
    Supporting Member Amigo Will's Avatar
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    The phrase Beanfield rifles has been around at least fourty years longer than Kenny has been in the Beanfields rifle business

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    Member fnsakdel's Avatar
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    Default long range

    Well if price is not a factor just get one of all
    TY Del

  7. #7
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    Default wow

    terrific info...... I was reading some reviews of the 338 Norma.... sounded pretty interesting... I'm not sure if I want to be on the front edge of what may be a passing caliber craze though...???

    what about the guns themselves?? Remington 700?? Win 70? Sako? Weatherby??

    others??

  8. #8

    Default Long Range

    I would consider the 7mm STW or 338 Edge.
    " Americans will never need the 2nd Amendment, until the government tries to take it away."

    On the road of life..... Pot holes keep things interesting !

  9. #9

    Default 40 years

    don't know about that, you ever shot beanfields?


    Quote Originally Posted by Amigo Will View Post
    The phrase Beanfield rifles has been around at least fourty years longer than Kenny has been in the Beanfields rifle business

  10. #10
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    I think if you look at the ballistics charts you can't go wrong with a 300wby. I was surprised no one mentioned it. The 270wby is another that has longer range and in the 7mm class. I would argue though that the 300wby gives you better all around hunting effectiveness and can handle long range shooting. Afterall, Roy Weatherby designed his cartridges to be effective long range hunting rifles. Interestingly his favorite was the 257wby. Take a look at them and see what you think.

    I would also recommend looking into a weatherby accumark rifle. I have one in the 300wby caliber with a muzzle break on it. For an off the shelf weapon I don't think you can do much better. It is a fantastic shooting gun. I've never shot a gun I have more confidence in and I've done a fair bit of long range hunting.

    Just my 2 cents.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by eagleclaw View Post
    800 yards shots on deer is easy
    Shots in the field at 800 yards are never easy; the wind drift alone will measure in feet . It can be done, but let's not call it easy.

  12. #12

    Default wind drift

    yes i know, that is why we have the right stuff, we measure the wind speed with meters,and lazers, even the heat from the ground will affect the shots
    sit your rifle under a tripod on hangersto keep it steady, 800 yard shots are easy once you get set up, been doing it a long time and sure is fun, its like target shooting in the military

  13. #13

    Default hard to go wrong with a 300

    yep 300 is hard to beat in long range shooting, i like the 180 grain hornady for my 300



    Quote Originally Posted by patrickL View Post
    I think if you look at the ballistics charts you can't go wrong with a 300wby. I was surprised no one mentioned it. The 270wby is another that has longer range and in the 7mm class. I would argue though that the 300wby gives you better all around hunting effectiveness and can handle long range shooting. Afterall, Roy Weatherby designed his cartridges to be effective long range hunting rifles. Interestingly his favorite was the 257wby. Take a look at them and see what you think.

    I would also recommend looking into a weatherby accumark rifle. I have one in the 300wby caliber with a muzzle break on it. For an off the shelf weapon I don't think you can do much better. It is a fantastic shooting gun. I've never shot a gun I have more confidence in and I've done a fair bit of long range hunting.

    Just my 2 cents.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by patrickL View Post
    I think if you look at the ballistics charts you can't go wrong with a 300wby. I was surprised no one mentioned it.
    I absolutely agree. The 300 Weatherby is THE 1000 yard rifle for beginners. Works pretty well for seasoned shooters as well.

    http://accurateshooter.wordpress.com...record-100-8x/

    Really, the cartridge is not all that critical; there are literally a dozen good choices. You want to launch relatively heavy bullets (high b.c.) for caliber in the neighborhood of 2900 fps. This will give you manageable recoil, reasonably long barrel life and all the external ballistics you need.

    Quote Originally Posted by patrickL View Post
    I would also recommend looking into a weatherby accumark rifle. I have one in the 300wby caliber with a muzzle break on it. For an off the shelf weapon I don't think you can do much better. It is a fantastic shooting gun. I've never shot a gun I have more confidence in and I've done a fair bit of long range hunting. Just my 2 cents.
    This is also a good suggestion. The Mark V Accumark rifle is a bit heavy to lug hunting on the tundra, but for LR shooting the weight is an asset. I am not aware of a better off the shelf rifle for this purpose considering its reasonable cost. Of course if you are going to build a gun then your options are myriad. You will not shoot at 1000 yard targets for very long before you decide that you need all the accuracy you can muster and an off the shelf rifle is probably not going to fill the bill.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by eagleclaw View Post
    yes i know, that is why we have the right stuff, we measure the wind speed with meters,and lazers, even the heat from the ground will affect the shots
    sit your rifle under a tripod on hangersto keep it steady, 800 yard shots are easy once you get set up, been doing it a long time and sure is fun, its like target shooting in the military
    That's nearly a half mile. Even with the very best equipment that's a difficult shot. Wind speed and wind direction can easily shift three times in that distance, at least it does where I shoot and compete. Unless you have a line of wind socks you set up in the field (deer aren't too keen on these) or forward scouts that report the change in weather it is not easy. It is doable, it is repeatable, but it is never easy.

    We agree though, that LR shooting is fun. For my part I like to shoot varmints at LR, but for big game I like to get much closer.

  16. #16

    Default true

    yes thats true , but well anyway, come on down to take part in some of our 1,000 yard shoots, set you up a egg and take a shot, sure is fun

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by eagleclaw View Post
    yes thats true , but well anyway, come on down to take part in some of our 1,000 yard shoots, set you up a egg and take a shot, sure is fun
    I love egg shoots, but where I am from we set the eggs at 300 yards, no sighters, just one shot. It's a lot of fun and a great competition.

  18. #18

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    If money is no object, I would recommend a blaser R93 with the newly released 6.5x284 match barrel. With quality glass and berger 140 grain bullets, this combination will kill deer, caribou, sheep and antelope all day long out past 1000 yards.

    I got a 300 win mag match barrel this summer and the accuracy has been phenominal.

  19. #19

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    If money is no object, then do it all custom. Custom action, custom match barrel, custom stock, Jewel trigger.

    If I was going to have a custom LR rifle built, I would go with a Borden Alpine or Timberline action, Lilja barrel in Sendero contour, and an HS Sendero stock. Most importantly, it would be built by a smith who knows and understands LR and most good smiths are back logged almost a year or more. The componants I mentioned are just my preference. There are quite a few top end quality action, barrel and stock makers.

    My preference for a good all around LR cartridge would be the 300 RUM... and that's what I have, in a Sendero. If you want to kill game at 1000+ yds, the minimum cartridges you need would be along the line of a 7 Dakota or STW. The reason I say that is they have power to send a good high BC bullet down range with enough velocity to expand on impact. Cartridges like the WSM's, 7 RM, 300 WM, 338 WM dont quite get to 1000 yds for game with most bullets.

    Which brings up another consideration... A lot of guys will build their rifle around a particular bullet, as in chambering, throat and twist. A lot will also pick a cartridge based on brass availability, Lapua being the premium choice.

    As far as factory platforms go, Rem 700 and Savage are the two most popular. Guys like Savages because you can switch barrel them easy and the Savages are great out of the box shooters as well as the Rem Senderos. The Rem 700 has the most aftermarket componant available.

    1000 yard rifles, for shooting game, are going to be pow,erfull cartridges and will have some recoil. Many LR shooters put brakes on their rifles to deal with the recoil and to see the bullet impact. This is almost manditory with the big 338's. I dont have a brake on my 300 RUM.

    If you're serious about getting a LR rig, then I would highly recommend you check out the LRH site to get an idea of what all is involved.

    Have fun with your project

    -MR

  20. #20
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    Just buy one already built for you:
    http://www.dakotaarms.com/cgi-bin/qu...Tactical_Rifle

    They also have one in .300WM, if that's what you want.

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