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Thread: Why the Guide Contract for Sheep for TMA?

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    Default Why the Guide Contract for Sheep for TMA?

    As long as we are on the subject, I thought I would ask this one. Why is there a mandatory sheep guide contract provision in the application process for the TMA? Why should the F&G be concerned with that? If a non-resy draws a DS102 tag, he/she has to hire a licensed guide.
    Who got this stupid mandate passed?

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    Bizy, non-res hunters have to have a guide for sheep, no matter what part of the state they hunt in. The ADFG requirement weeds out those who would put in for draw without first having a guide lined up, thereby taking away the opportunity from those who were actually going to use the permit if drawn.

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    i think it also helps with guide competitivness. since drawing results are public some guides would contact permit holders and try to undercut the orginal outfitter the permit winner was going to hunt with. i know in the hand out fish and game ask that the permits be sent to the guides and not the permit winner. Now by having a contract it makes it illegal to do that as well.
    more or less a two fold usefullness combined with what was mentioned above.

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    Default Your not reading the question.

    Both of the above explanations are not answering the question. Why is the TMA the ONLY Unit that requires a guide contract? NONE of the other sheep units require this. What is so special about the TMA?

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    couldn't tell ya that, i dont' guide over there and haven't heard any reasoning, kodiak has the same contracts for bear tags as well.

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    The TMA is managed for trophy sheep also it is a one sheep per 4 year area. Overall i'd say the reasons above are the answer.
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    it might be that they are just using the TMA as a trial run for the contracts, rather that go thru the costs to impliment it everywhere, they tried one specific spot?

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    Maybe it has to do with the amount of out of staters who apply for the hunt. Maybe TMA gets more out of state applicants and therefore more out of state hunters.
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    I would assume this would help against anti hunters from winning permits to. Now if they win they have a contract obligation to the guide.
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    Default that seems a little far-fetched...

    sisnce you have to have a hunting license to apply....and you have to have hunter safety for a hunting license.
    i think snyd has it right...there are a limited number of guides for the area, this way nobody will win a permit and then not be able to find a guide.
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    Moderator Daveinthebush's Avatar
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    Can someone post a link to the new requirement? I could not find it in the Unit info. on sheep, no infor in the Tok Management area info., nothing on the Draw Permit information. Just curious where the information is.
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    If you were refering to me. It's not really far fetched. I tag won is a animal saved.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daveinthebush View Post
    Can someone post a link to the new requirement? I could not find it in the Unit info. on sheep, no infor in the Tok Management area info., nothing on the Draw Permit information. Just curious where the information is.
    It's here in the winter_supp.pdf file.

    http://www.wildlife.alaska.gov/licen...inter_supp.pdf
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    Moderator Daveinthebush's Avatar
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    Default Snyd

    Snyd: Thanks. I never noticed it when I applied. I see that some moose areas are also affected. Could be interesting in the future as I am sure they will add others.

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    Page 1 of the supplement gives the information and states all hunts requiring the agreement will have it listed in the "Additional Information and Requirements" for the hunt. DS 102 has the symbol but it is not mentioned in the bod of the Additional Information. The three moose hunts and Kodiak Brown Bear specifically states it. And Dave (Homerdave) hunter education is only required to obtain a hunting license in certain areas of Alaska specifically if you live on the major road system like Anchorage and Homer, or hunt on military land, its not a general requirement yet.

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    Default hunter ed

    is required in nearly every other state, is it required for a non-resident to get a license? or do they also get to slide if they are born after whatever date is the cut-off?
    anyhow, the idea that the gude requirement is to stymie "the dreaded antis" from putting in for TMA hunts struck me as unrealistic. i think all the other reasons proffered are more likely.
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    Actually, its required in all the rest of the states, all 49. Alaska is the only one that does not universally require hunter safety. Hunter Education is not a requirement for a nonresident to get an Alaska hunting license or permits. Of course, as you know, they do need the certification if they wish to hunt in a weapons restricted hunt. There are hunter education requirements for all hunters in a few areas, such as the Anchorage Coastal Wildlife Refuge and for young hunters in GMU 7, 13, 14, 15 and 20. I agree, the anti hunter's getting a permit is probably secondary to the problem of a hunter drawing a permit and then not being able to find a guide.

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    Member Ken R's Avatar
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    Default Peta

    Maybe not the intent, but it will keep PETA people for applying for the tag just to "save" a sheep. I don't see it as a bad thing anyway and why not expand into other draws?

  19. #19

    Default my guess

    My guess is it is because of the high # of non-residents putting in and getting drawn. The local people are pissed as should be all residents of the state for more than 10% of the tags going to non-resident hunters. The people at USO and Cabelas are flooding this with applications. The TMA was set up with a no more than 10% non-resident draw, but now can't be found. We will be working on making sure this gets passed in the next BOG cycle. I believe all drawing hunts that aren't already Non-resident hunts should have the no more than 10% in place. Pretty darn sad when more than 10% of the tags are going to people that don't even live in this state! If I had my druthers, I would make all drawing hunts unavailable for non-residents, but I do realize that less than 10% will work. Just like in the states.

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    A two edge sword. The people at USO successfully sued the state of Arizona over their non resident tag limits. I don't know if there was an appeal or the results if there was. Then the guide groups will scream for all to hear. But he other edge is the funding, Fish and Game, to a large degree, counts on the non resident license and tags income for operation. A revenue source to replace that lost would have to be found. I agree that there whould be limits, it is frustrating to keep putting in for tags and not be able to draw one. My semi annual contribution, just adding to the revenue.

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