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Thread: Whittier Harbor Master Message

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    Member AKBassking's Avatar
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    Default Whittier Harbor Master Message


    ALASKAN SEA-DUCTION
    1988 M/Y Camargue YachtFisher
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    So do I. As a more than decade long berthholder, I have witnessed harbor fees more than double and facilities fall apart. Hundreds of Thousands of dollars are wasted every year because the harbor refuses to measure boats. A former harbor employee's live abord boat was SIX feet longer (LOA) then he paid for! I would estimate that over 90% of the boats lie about their overall length. Both of the boats next to me in my slip are 4 feet longer (and oversized for the finger) then they pay for. Every time I pay my dues, I am punished for being honest. So effing corrupt!

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    Quote Originally Posted by akpowrider View Post
    So do I. As a more than decade long berthholder, I have witnessed harbor fees more than double and facilities fall apart. Hundreds of Thousands of dollars are wasted every year because the harbor refuses to measure boats. A former harbor employee's live abord boat was SIX feet longer (LOA) then he paid for! I would estimate that over 90% of the boats lie about their overall length. Both of the boats next to me in my slip are 4 feet longer (and oversized for the finger) then they pay for. Every time I pay my dues, I am punished for being honest. So effing corrupt!
    I was considering placing my name on the waiting list, but have decided to just trailer my boat and pay the season fee for the parking lot.


    If it isn't a big secret, What is your LOA and what is your monthly cost?

    ALASKAN SEA-DUCTION
    1988 M/Y Camargue YachtFisher
    MMSI# 338131469
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    Holy Cow! If they rebuild the harbor, I might even get a slip someday before they lock me up in the old folks home!!!

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    Member AKBassking's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingfisher2825 View Post
    Holy Cow! If they rebuild the harbor, I might even get a slip someday before they lock me up in the old folks home!!!
    Have you check the prices over at the "private" dock? They are cheaper than some I have seen in Florida for 600K

    ALASKAN SEA-DUCTION
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kingfisher2825 View Post
    Holy Cow! If they rebuild the harbor, I might even get a slip someday before they lock me up in the old folks home!!!

    Actually not. As I recall they are going to rebuild the harbor but notadd new slips. I think they will wind up with even less. I think I have been on the list 5 years, and I am always 15 years out when I call and ask.

    Jim
    2009 Seawolf 31'
    www.seawolfmarine.com
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  7. #7

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    I've talked to one of the engineers that worked on the whittier ramp improvements, and various other harbor jobs around the state and he did say it would be too much money to expand the current harbor. Said something about how putting in a new breakwater was very very difficult with the depth, as theres a very steep drop off just past the current breakwater. He said theres been plans to improve the current harbor, but not expand it. Basically saying the same as the message from the HM.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by akpowrider View Post
    So do I. As a more than decade long berthholder, I have witnessed harbor fees more than double and facilities fall apart. Hundreds of Thousands of dollars are wasted every year because the harbor refuses to measure boats. A former harbor employee's live abord boat was SIX feet longer (LOA) then he paid for! I would estimate that over 90% of the boats lie about their overall length. Both of the boats next to me in my slip are 4 feet longer (and oversized for the finger) then they pay for. Every time I pay my dues, I am punished for being honest. So effing corrupt!
    2 points:

    1 - Corruption-wise, I think that things are much better than they used to be.

    2 - What is the basis of your estimate about boat length?

    3 - I was on the list for more than 4 years. I didn't lie about my boat length. That means that the next 18 guys are liars.
    I can't come to bed right now honey - somebody on the internet is wrong.

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  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by fishbob View Post
    2 points:

    1 - Corruption-wise, I think that things are much better than they used to be.

    2 - What is the basis of your estimate about boat length?

    3 - I was on the list for more than 4 years. I didn't lie about my boat length. That means that the next 18 guys are liars.
    No problem,

    If you only had to wait 4 years for your slip, that means your vessel is berthed in the 28' and under slips. A buddy of mine has a boat in those fingers. Look how many Bayliner 2859 s are berthed on H G and F float. They are all over 30 ft loa. Most have a swim platform and bow spirit (anchor roller) that puts them over 31 foot loa. Many have their tenders on the swim platforms which adds another 1 or 2 feet. They are also too beamy for those slips (read your berthholder agreement). My buddy is berthed next to one of these...his boat has the scars to prove it! His legal boat gets banged up everytime the oversized boat leaves its slip. Looking at the freeboard differences between the vessels, it is quite obvious they should not be next to each other.

    It irks me that the city is Paying for a study to figure how to raise more funds! For the last 10 YEARS I have asked about measuring boats and the funds lost.I have been assured that loa's would be measured and recorded. It has not happened yet. Yes, I have gotten my tape measure out! LOA and LOD are two different things.
    I am very happy to have a slip in the harbor. I love the city of Whittier and it's people. I spend money at local business 12 months of the year.
    Happy Boating

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    Quote Originally Posted by akpowrider View Post
    No problem,

    If you only had to wait 4 years for your slip, that means your vessel is berthed in the 28' and under slips. A buddy of mine has a boat in those fingers. Look how many Bayliner 2859 s are berthed on H G and F float. They are all over 30 ft loa. Most have a swim platform and bow spirit (anchor roller) that puts them over 31 foot loa. Many have their tenders on the swim platforms which adds another 1 or 2 feet. They are also too beamy for those slips (read your berthholder agreement). My buddy is berthed next to one of these...his boat has the scars to prove it! His legal boat gets banged up everytime the oversized boat leaves its slip. Looking at the freeboard differences between the vessels, it is quite obvious they should not be next to each other.

    It irks me that the city is Paying for a study to figure how to raise more funds! For the last 10 YEARS I have asked about measuring boats and the funds lost.I have been assured that loa's would be measured and recorded. It has not happened yet. Yes, I have gotten my tape measure out! LOA and LOD are two different things.
    I am very happy to have a slip in the harbor. I love the city of Whittier and it's people. I spend money at local business 12 months of the year.
    Happy Boating
    I have to agree. Since I have to use the ramp every weekend, I drive by those 28' slips and see other 2825's in there and I know that the LOA is greater than 28' because I have measured mine. It is closer to 30' with the engines and anchor roller.

  11. #11
    Member Alaska Gray's Avatar
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    Lets just hope if they do rebuilt it they will make it bigger. With the big boats parked at the end of the dock there has been many times a boat pops out of nowhere. the traffic lane is very narrow. As of right now it is the worst harbor out of the 4 around here.
    Living the Alaskan Dream
    Gary Keller
    Anchorage, AK

  12. #12

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    But if they build it bigger, then what fun would it be going from the ramp to the entrance at low tide with a strong wind from the north or south

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    Quote Originally Posted by skydiver View Post
    But if they build it bigger, then what fun would it be going from the ramp to the entrance at low tide with a strong wind from the north or south
    Good point. that is the icing on the cake
    Living the Alaskan Dream
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    They are hiring somebody to find out if they can charge us more money The survey they sent out didn't work so lets spend 60 grand to pay someone to tell them to raise the prices
    Just drop yur pants and back up to the counter jelly.jpg in the harbormasters office

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    Quote Originally Posted by potbuilder View Post
    They are hiring somebody to find out if they can charge us more money The survey they sent out didn't work so lets spend 60 grand to pay someone to tell them to raise the prices
    Just drop yur pants and back up to the counter jelly.jpg in the harbormasters office
    I agree! How much more can they raise it before they realize people will stop coming
    Living the Alaskan Dream
    Gary Keller
    Anchorage, AK

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    Member spoiled one's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alaska Gray View Post
    How much more can they raise it before they realize people will stop coming

    A LOT more than they charge now.
    Spending my kids' inheritance with them, one adventure at a time.

  17. #17

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    I would say that they could ask for significantly more. Sure it will turn some away and reduce a few trips here and there for some people in Whittier. But, the truth of the matter is people that are willing to spend, flush, or waste (depending on your view) 125k on a boat, will spend money to go through the hole in the mt, launch the 30 foot boat, and park the rig. It is just a few drops in the bucket. Will Seward get busier? You bet, and that is just the way all those businesses down there love it.

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    Will people stop coming if they raise the price? I think it would have to go up a long ways before this happens. What is the fair price? I think that this is normally done by the principal of supply and demand. Currently there is A LOT more demand than supply. A couple of examples of this:

    1. The 15-20 year wait list for a 32' slip.

    2. Cliffside Marina, where people pay 80-100K for a slip and then HIGHER fees than in the public harbor. And they are almost full.

    Sorry, buy they could double the prices in Whittier and there would still be a waiting list.

    Jim
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    Fully Loaded

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    Member AKBassking's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrogers View Post
    Will people stop coming if they raise the price? I think it would have to go up a long ways before this happens. What is the fair price? I think that this is normally done by the principal of supply and demand. Currently there is A LOT more demand than supply. A couple of examples of this:

    1. The 15-20 year wait list for a 32' slip.

    2. Cliffside Marina, where people pay 80-100K for a slip and then HIGHER fees than in the public harbor. And they are almost full.

    Sorry, buy they could double the prices in Whittier and there would still be a waiting list.

    Jim
    I would have to agree. They need to get rid of the tanks and built a nice marine down the side around the end of the bay and it would draw lots of folks from Seward, but then again there are those in Whittier that would love to see the tunnel closed............

    ALASKAN SEA-DUCTION
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  20. #20

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    Keep in mind folks that these facilities must pay for themselves, i.e., the fees that are charged to the users must be sufficient to maintain and ultimately replace the facility. The marine environment is very hard infrastructure meaning it requires constant maintenance, but that only buys time as it will eventually become dilapidated and require replacement. Maintenance is costly. Marine construction is even costlier. People don't realized how spoiled they have been in AK with the low fees that have been traditionally been charged to users. Now that DOT is out of the harbor business meaning there will no longer be state/federal contributions to maintain and grow harbors, and the city owns/operates it, the users will have to make up the difference. People will be willing to pay significantly more that they do now and they will have to. Also, there is almost no chance of enlarging the existing harbor basin. An additional alternate location is the most feasible choice for expanding Whittier's vessel capacity. When the existing harbor floats are replaced there will be less slips, however they will be larger to accommodate the larger vessels that are using the harbor now versus when it was built.

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