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Thread: A rant about manners...

  1. #1
    Member AlaskaHippie's Avatar
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    Default A rant about manners...

    A good friend celebrated his 45th birthday this past weekend, and since he works extra shifts all summer in order to play all winter he seldom has time to fish. He took off this past weekend and the Wife and myself decided to take him down and float the Upper Kenai as a way to celebrate "his" day.

    For the most part it was an excellent weekend. Blue skies, good campfire camaraderie, excellent fishing, good times had by all.


    But, we had an encounter on the River that really soured (for me anyway) what should have been a perfect day.

    Let me preface this by stating that I know that no single individual owns the River, and that it is a public resource. Whenever I float I endeavor to avoid parking anywhere near another raft/boat, I hate taking a side channel and finding I am going to have to float past some folks who are fishing there. I feel like I am intruding on their space, and always try to stay as far out of their drift as possible, while apologizing for "playing through" as we float past. The Upper is a bit crowded on the weekends I realize, but it is also a big river, with lots of room to share....There it is, the key word....share.

    We launched out of Sportsmans Saturday around 11 pm (Hey, after a night celebrating a momentous occasion with a bottle of scotch I was impressed at our early departure <grin>), and floated down past Powerline. I stayed to the right and beached on the far right bank on the back eddy/pool hoping to tie my buddy into a silver (my better half was quite content to kick back in the sun and let the advil and tums do their job on assuaging the previous nights after effects). After about 30 minutes and a few spawning sockeye, we decided to roll down a little bit and hit the island below us to our left, I'd been watching and the folks parked there where in the midst of packing up and moving on. After they left we pushed off and floated down. I beached just below a channel that feeds through the island and creates a pool in the upper end, and a nice gravel run off on the bottom. The B'day boy headed up to the pool to try for the elusive Coho whilst I headed down to run an indicator off the riffles into deep water trying for a rainbow, the wife changed from the Grateful Dead to Joss Stone on the Ipod/Speaker set up and opted to drink some more water (did I mention she was a champ on the Scotch whackin' the previous evening?).

    My buddy hit, and lost, a bright Silver as I worked my way down the riffles, finally I hit a dern humped up sockeye that made fast work of my 6lb tippet. I waded back to the raft to tie up a new line, and decided to grab the 8wt and rig for Silvers so I might join my firend up at the pool.

    Then the Peaceful, easy feeling, took a turn for the, well.....surreal...

    I was facing downstream, standing next to the raft and sorting through my fly box looking for a nice, flashy fly for Silvers when I heard voices. Looking upstream I see a drift boat floating in from the direction we had come and making for the upper end of the pool, directly where my friend was fishing, at the same time, from down the side channel comes a raft, also aiming for the pool. The drift boat beaches so close that my buddy has to move out of the way or get whacked with an oar, and the raft pulls in 15 ft below him, putting him between both boats. There was 7 people total in both boats and they hop out and begin chatting about "Great, this is a good spot, glad you pulled in here too"....Terrific....They're all from the same group.....

    My buddy looks at me and begins to reel in, I tell him to stay put, the Wife looks over and mumbles something about "people these days" as I tie on a dalli llahma fly and head towards the pool....Which now has 4 more rods fishing it then it had when we arrived. As I wade up my buddy reels in and heads back to the raft to tie on a different rig....Not a minute later another 2 rafts float in from the side channel, each with 4 plus the oarsman, and beaches on the pool...More folks, SAME group....Now I have gone from irritated to plain old pissed off....SEVENTEEN people have now beached on the pool we had waited to open up....I hook a few sockeye, and get nasty looks from our newly arrived "guests" because, oddly enough <grin>, my drag seems to be a bit loose and those pesky sockeye just want to run all over the pool.....

    I look downstream and my wife has rallied from the dead and is headed my way, beer in hand....She winds her way through the throng of people, half of whom are wading directly behind me to gawk at a dead, spawned out, King Salmon....I hear "Hey! watch your back cast", and without even glancing over my shoulder I double haul and really let it rip....

    The Wife strolls up and states thet Ray, our birthday boy, doesn't want to deal with the crowded pool, and is instead, going to go try a few casts down where I started earlier....As we are chatting, rafts 4, 5, and 6 float down the channel and beach.....we are now at over 30 people on an island not much bigger than a the boat ramp at Jims Landing...And yep, these folks are ALSO part of the same group..Which now numbers over THIRTY people!

    At this point I get loud....Not conversationally loud, but "that guy" loud...
    I cannot, for the life of me, understand how folks could be so crass...
    The Wife, shaking her head, has had enough, and knowing my penchant for sarcasm, shakes her head, and with a smile heads back to our raft....

    I am now shoulder to shoulder with more people than I had in my small town graduating class, and my BS meter redlines. I reel in, wind through the crowd, and head for the small group of guys who seem to be running the show. The 3 of them are in a deep discussion about how great it is to have such good weather, blah blah blah. I walk up, politely (which at this point takes a LOT of effort) wait for a break in the conversation, and when they turn to me I state "Hey, I just wanted to thank you all for rolling in on my friend and I, forcing him out of the hole he was fishing, and taking over this island. Mighty polite of ya'll."

    What is the response? Classic passive agressive "Me me me" mentality crap.

    "Well, hey, that's how it goes on the River!"

    10.....9.....8.....7......6.....

    (Did this schmuck REALLY just say that out loud??!!)

    5.....4.....

    (He did, and he is grinning about it to boot...)

    3.....2......1

    BLAST OFF!!!!!



    The rubber band snapped, the camel was loaded with one straw too many, the goose was cooked, Houston, we have a problem...

    I

    went


    OFF!!!!!!


    Since this is a Family Site I won't repeat what I said verbatim, but suffice it to say it started out with "Perhaps in your older years you *expletives* will learn to adopt a sense of manners, courtesy, and etiquette..."

    After that it kind of blurs, but I do recall, and the wife reports, that I then put on a display of colorful use of the slang for "Fornicate" in more ways than most folks have heard outside of the Elbow Room during a crab strike....

    As I was winding down, and feeling OH so much better for getting it off my chest, the wife of one of guys ( I refuse to use the word "Men" since they displayed none of the associated traits that the word applies to) says in her haughtiest tone..

    "S-o-o-orrryyyyy of we ruined your day"....

    I swear to god, even over the sound of the river, the wind in the leaves, the cry of the gulls, and the splashing of backpeddling morons, I heard, from 50 feet away, my Wife groan.....

    I respect, honor, and cherish women......BUT.....

    ...


    ......





    ........


    I hope she recovers from being referred to in a way in which she is unaccustomed....And I also hope she doesn't think I am a gynecologist....Because, honestly lady, they don't use THAT word, when discussing your anatomy....



    At this point I turned on my heel, and headed for our raft. We launched...Floated down river...And laughed the rest of the day over the looks on the faces of those folks who had NO clue as to what they had done to illicit such a reaction...And that is both the saddest...And the funniest, part of the whole episode.....


    Sorry for the long post....But I was amazed at the lack of respect given by that group....


    "That's how it goes on the River." has now become part of our family vernacular....

    "Dad, I don't wanna do my homework!"

    "That's how it goes on the River>"

    "Honey, why didn't you mow the yard??"

    "That's how it goes on the River."

    <grin>





    “Life has become immeasurably better since I have been forced to stop taking it seriously.” ― H.S.T.
    "Character is how you treat those who can do nothing for you."

  2. #2

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    Manners?

    Manners!

    Aren't those estates in the English countryside reserved for rich folks?

    You sure won't find them on Alaska rivers. They went out a loooong time ago.

  3. #3

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    While I agree with your frustration, as I've experience myself many times, you have to think about where those 30 friends are going to stop at. Somebody is going to get crowded eventually. The river isn't THAT big, and unfortunately it happened to you. That said, I would have probably done the same thing you did.

    A few weeks ago I was with in my one man raft floating alongside my buddies in a drift boat and we ended up being the "bad guys," that day. There is a gravel bar I love to stop at towards the end of the float, so we decided to stop on it. There was a drift boat with 4 people fishing on the very bottom of the bar. My buddies drift boat is a fiberglass one, very heavy, add 4 people and a dog to it and it takes some work to stop it. They ended up stoping and hoping out about 25-30 feet above one of the fishermen with the intentions of walking the boat up river a ways to give them their space.

    At this point, I'm already fishing at the top of the bar because my raft is much lighter and easier to maneuver. Immediately after they stop the drift boat the people below us just start ripping them up. Saying that "you came right in my hole." Now to keep it PG, lets say we just laughed at them when they said that. As we apologized, they continued to say they were fishing up and down this whole gravel bar before we got there. Keep in mind this bar is probably 50-75 yards long. All we did was say sorry. Eventually they stormed off and we caught a few rainbows in the 20-26'' range.

    So, similar story, just on the other end of the attacks. I see the groups frustration, but I would have given it a few minutes to see what would happen before I would have said anything. They would have found out we were moving up river to fish the top of the bar. But then again, they could have just been pissed off at something else and maybe it was inevitable.

    Encounters on the river are bound to happen, when they do I tend to shrug it off and move down river. I try to get two floats in a day so I figure I can just hit that spot on the second float.

  4. #4
    Member Phish Finder's Avatar
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    FWIW, beaching a drift boat 20 feet from folks with a clear bar above them is very poor form. If you can land a raft (which you can quite easily) then you can land a drift boat responsibly.

    Hippie, sounds like I missed a good time.

    One word:

    Helicopter.

    The good old helicopter cast works wonders in situations like that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phish Finder View Post
    FWIW, beaching a drift boat 20 feet from folks with a clear bar above them is very poor form. If you can land a raft (which you can quite easily) then you can land a drift boat responsibly.
    Totally agree with you on that. The oarsman was fairly new to that boat. Actually borrowing it. So it was his second time rowing it. Just not familiar with it. The problem was the current was so fast and the bar has a very steep drop off, he couldn't get the boat to slower water until further down the bar, behind a little eddy. I expected the other group to say something but didn't expect it to be in that manner.

  6. #6
    Member greythorn3's Avatar
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    ya ive run into lots of rude people fishing. it used to be just the russian, now its most places in the valley too!
    Semper Fi!

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    It sounds like bad manners were on display by both sides. I'm not sure what the lesson's supposed to be.

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    Member AlaskaHippie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Pid View Post
    It sounds like bad manners were on display by both sides. I'm not sure what the lesson's supposed to be.


    Let me guess....Blue raft, stern rowing station?

    <grin>
    “Life has become immeasurably better since I have been forced to stop taking it seriously.” ― H.S.T.
    "Character is how you treat those who can do nothing for you."

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    Member DRIFTER_016's Avatar
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    Yep, been in similar situations too many times.

    How's this one for ya?
    I'm fishing the island about 1/4 mile upstream from last chance and I'm standing beside my cat running a bead and float through the slot about 8 or 10 feet out in front of me. About 60 yards down stream there's a husband and wife fishing the tail of the island.
    Now some yahoo in a drift boat with his 3 buddies is floating down stream with a fish on and does he row in above or below me to land his fish?? ?? ?? Of course not, because he is the only boat on the river!!!!!
    He rows in right in front of my cat 8 to 10 feet from shore and drops his 30# anchor right on my float!!!!!! This is where running a 15 foot float rod comes in handy. I accidently knocked him in the head with it and launched his hat into the river. OOPS!!! Sorry about that!!!
    I continued to fish with them sitting there with my rod tip sticking out in thier way. They got the message and I never said a word.
    I talked to the couple down at the tip of the island and they couldn't belive what had just happened. I said it's par for the course these days as 90% of the population are .
    So yeah I know where you are coming from. Please let us know if you see them during FISHAPALOOZA and the PALOOZIANS will invade their space as retribution for this dispicable act!!!!!

  10. #10
    Member alaskachuck's Avatar
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    Default Stupid is forever

    So we were on the upper last weekend on the bear briads/whirlpool. June and I with sam, jose and megan. We are fishing the back channel with the main channel behind us. Back channel had narrowed down to about 10 feet wide. We had some people on foot above us but we all gave each other lots of space so it was good. I was working about 6 black submarines in front of me. They had must moved back up so i was stoked. So I look up to the left and what do I see. Some $^#% #%#%#% $^$$^$^ %$#%#% comeing down the channel in his drift boat. He on the oars and wife up front. I look closer and it was the same guy that cut me off three times trying to get around him at guardrail. So he is drifting down the narrow channel SIDEWAYS too. So needless to say im a little peeved. Oh wait it gets better. He wife manages to hook Nemo. All 7 inches of him. So now he is about 15 feet upstream of me and Im thinking there is no way in hell he is gonna drop anchor. I was right he didnt. HE WAITED UNTILL HE WAS IN FRONT OF ME ON TOP OF THE FISH AND KERPLUNK. 20 more feet he would have been able to hit the slack water. So then I had a nice chat with him. More of a 1 way chat. For those of you that know me you can pretty much figure what was said. He just stood there with this ummmmm what did i do wrong look. His wife was pretty embaressed and just kept her head down. He made the top 5 stupid things I have seen on the kenai list
    Grandkids, Making big tough guys hearts melt at first sight

  11. #11
    Member Phish Finder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRIFTER_016 View Post
    . Please let us know if you see them during FISHAPALOOZA and the PALOOZIANS will invade their space as retribution for this dispicable act!!!!!
    If you can't beat 'em, join 'em?

    Really?

    I'll stay in the 10% category
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    just like to pee a lot." --Capitol Brewery

  12. #12

    Default Great Story;

    Sorry to hear about your experiences Hippie, but that was a well written, fun read!

  13. #13
    Member alaskachuck's Avatar
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    Default Hey Hippie

    I too am sorry those Yayhoo's pissed on your parade. sounds like the day was going well for you guys too. Fish Karma will bite them in the butt
    Grandkids, Making big tough guys hearts melt at first sight

  14. #14
    Member AlaskaHippie's Avatar
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    Thanks fella's.

    It was merely a speedbump in an otherwise flawless day.

    Having grown up fishing that river I am disheartened to see/hear that so many folks ignore River Manners in pursuit of their own selfish agendas....

    Used to be a time when something like this was unheard of...Sadly it has now become the norm....
    “Life has become immeasurably better since I have been forced to stop taking it seriously.” ― H.S.T.
    "Character is how you treat those who can do nothing for you."

  15. #15
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    That’s an awful small peace of real-estate to fish in, just right for one boat. You must have felt like Custard at the Little Bighorn. Yip that hole should be called (AK-Hippies last stand.)

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    Default Gave that up long ago

    After fishing salmon (especially kings) from the mid "80's" for 10 or 12 years and with my boys finally getting old enough to acompany me, I finally got tired of all the disrespect, encroachment, and all around bad manners that we were encountering out there on a regular basis.
    Thats when we gave up the Susitna system fishing and migrated our summer vacations and long weekends to places far off the beaten path, choosing to enjoy maybe not quite as much actions as this river offers, but a much better quality experience.
    Now I fish the Sound out of Whittier almost exclusively, and find no problems with other people and a much better quality experience.

  17. #17
    Member alaskachuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fishook View Post
    That’s an awful small peace of real-estate to fish in, just right for one boat. You must have felt like Custard at the little big horn. The next time i float past that place on the river i will call it (AlaskaHipies last stand.)

    I like that. Great name
    Grandkids, Making big tough guys hearts melt at first sight

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    Member akshrop's Avatar
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    Big reason in what made me more of a pike fisherman than anything else. I like to get far from the clown crowds.

  19. #19

    Red face

    Hippie,
    I hate to hear of it happening, but I think it is virtually predictable nowdays to encounter this kind of behaviour on waters that have all the fishing holes named and known by so many. Most folks along that stretch of water have their daily agenda mapped out and follow it to a tee. They have a routine and routine stops along the way. If it were to happen in a remote location, then I think the rant would be credible, but on the Kenai well...it is a bit like complaining about the traffic in Anchorage. People flocking up like rats will act like rats, every time. I would never go to the Kenai, with high hopes or expectation of having a fishing hole to myself. I don't think it is realistic nowdays. Too many people, too few fishing holes and too many boats on the water.
    "96% of all Internet Quotes are suspect and the remaining 4% are fiction."
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    Gonna get worse as the kalifornikans keep infesting the state in greater numbers.
    Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocre minds. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Albert Einstein

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