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Thread: National Geographic Story on Salmon & Fishery Management

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    welfare state of Alaska

    Default National Geographic Story on Salmon & Fishery Management

    The August issue of National Geographic Magazine has very interesting article on salmon on the Russian Kamchatka Peninsula. The story is avalaible at: or the link at:

    The article covers soviet fishery management and mis-management and the concern for the health of the fisheries and ecosystem.

    It appears from the article that the Russian researchers are very much aware and concerned about the flow of nutrients into the river ecosystem and the long term effects of removing these nutrients. One example is made of fast growing trees along the river banks and dying and then falling into the river to provide shelter for the fish. The Russian researchers are gathering data on the nutrient balance in their healthy rivers with massive unchecked salmon runs - this should provide us with some comparitive baseline data to what our levels may have been before we signifcantly altered the nutrient flow with our nets.
    Living the urban lifestyle so I can pay my way and for my family's needs, and support my country. And you?
    ".. ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country" JFK

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2006


    Quote Originally Posted by tvfinak
    this should provide us with some comparitive baseline data to what our levels may have been before we signifcantly altered the nutrient flow with our nets.
    You're funny. You're actually trying to continue the same discussion that was recently locked HERE. And in that discussion you argued that the commercial fishing nets have "eliminated the flow of nutrients". Now you've changed your story to "significantly altered". Go figure.

    You made the same concocted, preconceived, hypothetical issue in that discussion that you are trying to make again...that the river is underseeded, has a loss of essential vital nutrients, and fishing nets have eliminated the flow of nutrients. Reference None of which you ever showed. In fact you rejected indicators showing that the nutrients in our ecosystem were healthy.

    So before you go any further, save our members the pain and post your problem statement and the facts backing it up. I mean if you are going to start a discussion with a statement that nutrient flows have been significantly altered by commercial fishing, and imply our ecosystem is faltering because of the commercial nets, then you need to show that is true.

    I am in support of further study or monitoring of the ecosystem. But I will not jump to conclusions, start fires, or seed thoughts that the commercial fishery is jeopordizing the ecosystem by significantly altering the nutriet flow. That is yellow. And I certainly know better than to compare the ecosystem and nutrients of a system in Russian with one in Alaska.

    BTW tvfinak, I am confused why you are so concerned about the nutrients in the ecosystem when you admitted to blatently violating fishing regulations by taking over-limits, saying that you will just pay the fine if you ever get caught. Reference A resource violator doesn't strike me as someone who's sincerely concerned with the resource. Maybe you missed the part in that article about the impacts of poaching and illegal harvests...

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2006

    Default actually had friends in Russia

    I have had friends in Russia studying with the Russians. Russian scientists visited the Kenai a couple of times while I was working. They are short on equipment and personnel. One group that visited was amazed that we had computers for everyone in the office. They had one to share between 10 of them. That was 15 years ago but I wonder if much has changed. They are very capable people but they lacked exposure at that time to outside scientists. We had good discussions but they were lacking a global perspective because of in country restrictions on travel and communications.

    I wish them the best in their studies.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default here come's the brigade, lol.

    Tv how you took what you did from that I don't know. I read the article, and it is very interesting. It would have been cool to leave it at that. They say the Kamchatka runs were having trouble so can't figure out your comment above anyway. I found one quote from it near the end would help me reply to you.

    Those five areas, together with the Kol and the Utkholok, would make Kamchatka the planet's greatest, boldest experiment in nurturing wild salmon species for their own sakes and for the measured use of humankind. And it could actually happen—if long-term management perspectives informed by scientific research, along with honest governance backed by strict enforcement, are allowed to triumph over the scramble for short-term gain by insiders.

    If you put the word ALASKA at the first sentence you could be talking about us. Our State. Here those insiders are people or groups who put political pressure through rabble-rousing and other means on are largely scientific endeavor be that BOF or NPFMC. Public input is necessary, but the public then has a duty to be informed. What do you really want anyway?


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