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Thread: Shippable fuel canisters?

  1. #1
    Member tboehm's Avatar
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    Default Shippable fuel canisters?

    Does anyone know the brand name of the fuel canisters for jetboil and other stoves that has the hazmat markings that allow them to be air shipped? Anyone have any specific experience with this? Thanks for the help.

  2. #2

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    It has been awhile since I have been involved with flying with fuel and flown with fuel carts but there was only one brand that did not have the DOT listing, it was not HAZMAT label but DOT regulation printed on the side meaning the valve passed DOT testing.

    We never had an issue flying to the bush with fuel cartridges as long as they were in the original cardboard shipping box. You log the flight as a cargo flight (no people) that is carrying people. Its been years since I was involved with flying so like most Fed rules, could have changed every week since then. Right after 9/11, seemed like it changed weekly for about a year.

    Flying commercial or bush? Back then, commercial was a dead no no fly with fuel cartridge but again like I said, the feds like to change things often. Why it was ogged as cargo.

    Not much help.

    I would contact your air carrier / DOT.

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    If all else fails, give Marc a call at 907 336-1330. I asked him the same question and he had the answer but I arranged to have the regular jetboil canisters at my hunt start location and I'll be darn if I can remember what he told me.

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    i haven't looked but not sure if you posted this in the bush flying forum as well? they would know for sure. i have flown with them in AK and the service I used (a well known one) asked for the DOT number on the primus canister. they said it wasn't a problem. but on commercial airlines (AK air), no such luck taking those along. for that i have a different stove for coleman fuel that i buy once i get to king salmon for example, and then fly out into the bush from there.

    post in the bush flying forum

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    Member 6XLeech's Avatar
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    Default Try this...

    Info in another thread not long ago:

    http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.co/s...479#post450479

    From these websites, you can look up your cannister to see whether approved or not.

    Good luck.

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    Member tboehm's Avatar
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    Default not working

    Quote Originally Posted by 6XLeech View Post
    Info in another thread not long ago:

    http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.co/s...479#post450479

    From these websites, you can look up your cannister to see whether approved or not.

    Good luck.
    Could you tell me what to look for, i can't seem to get this link to work.

    Thanks

    My problem is getting them to Dillingham. For some reason no one in town has any in stock and getting them there by barge is going to take to long.

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    Member 6XLeech's Avatar
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    Default From other thread..

    I called Northern Air Cargo (NAC), spoke to Steve about the same question for another thread.

    1. MSR fuel canisters are not approved for shipment by air cargo.

    2. Snow Peak (didnít have special permit number handy), and Primus (special permit DOT SP10677) cylinders are approved for shipping by air cargo. There might be others. Only canisters with special permits listed (website below) can be shipped by air cargo. If you donít have the DOT SP number, can search onliine, or bring canister to NAC (or other air cargo company) to check. If Steve at NAC is not there, then Mark Smith can help.

    3. To confirm special permit for your specific brand, go to website: http://www.phmsa.dot.gov/hazmat or
    http://www.phmsa.dot.gov/hazmat/regs/sp-a/special-permits/list or
    http://www.phmsa.dot.gov/staticfiles/PHMSA/SPA_App/OfferDocuments/SP10677_2006030078.pdf for info or to look up SP number.

    Any fuel shipment by air cargo requires hazmat fee, $30 and some paperwork. The $30 fee is per bill, so you want to ship all your hazmat materials at once.

    I'm quite new at this, but just relaying what I've found out so far. Others may know more, and I'll defer to them if they advise differently. One thing I don't know is whether you can get the fuel you need (or at least white gas) in the town you fly into, such as KOTZ or Bethel - at the Alaska Commercial store for instance - and so skip the whole hazmat fee/cargo loop. Seems like AC stores in September would be running out of fuel (and lighters) because all the hunters are buying stuff up. I don't know. Thought I might call the AC store or somebody at the destination sometime soon.

    Good luck.

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    Member 6XLeech's Avatar
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    Default Other options...

    Just now the PHMSA Special Permits Search didn't work for me.

    What I might do is call someone directly, your air cargo carrier, or someone you trust who's shipped cannisters lately, to see if they can offer any suggestions about brands of cannisters. Another option might be to ship 5 gallon bottles of propane?

    Wow, amazing that the cannisters are sold out in Dham.
    Best of luck.

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    Member 6XLeech's Avatar
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    Default Or...

    The MSR WhisperLite Internationale is a multifuel expedition stove:

    Multi-Fuel: Burns white gas, kerosene, and unleaded auto fuel.

    Packing 2 of these plus 2 (butane/propane) cannister type stoves (e.g., MSR Pocket Rocket type) would give you the most fuel flexibility. You could purchase and carry a couple of these or similar stoves to take with you. We have a group of four, but the second stove is also a backup.

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    6XLeech is correct concerning all the Hazmat including fees. I have two stoves I use, a snowpeak and a coleman single burner. I have not found a place in Bethel (AC,Swansons, Anvil's Cache) that carries anything for the snowpeak, msr, etc. The same goes for King Salmon, Naknek, Dillingham, Nome, Kotz, and McGrath. However all the "Hub" towns carry the little propane bottles for my coleman so do most village stores. The little extra weight of the coleman stove saves me the hassle of shipping Hazmat. I use the snowpeak off the road system and flying out of anchorage on bush charters.

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    Member 6XLeech's Avatar
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    Default Coleman or Century cannisters likely sturdy enough to ship...

    Some helpful basic information about fuels/stove types can be found at: http://zenstoves.net/Canister.htm#CanisterWeights. According to that info, Coleman and Century make canisters containing propane only "P(100)", and propane requires a heavier cannister (465, 468 gms).

    The sturdier steel cannister makes it too heavy for backpacking, but might be ideal for shipping and other types of trips. In fact, a friend here told me last week that a local air cargo service required Coleman brand canisters for shipping liquefied gas. There will still be a hazmat charge and forms, but ship all in one shipment for the same fee (per shipment, not per item). Confirm with your air cargo shipper.

    Coleman, 465, P(100)

    Century, 468, P(100)

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    Default Coleman too then...

    Quote Originally Posted by chumsnagger View Post
    ... all the "Hub" towns carry the little propane bottles for my coleman so do most village stores. The little extra weight of the coleman stove saves me the hassle of shipping Hazmat...
    Good little tip right there, Chumsnagger. Thanks.

  13. #13
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    Default DHM AC store got a shipment...

    Quote Originally Posted by tboehm View Post
    ...My problem is getting them to Dillingham. For some reason no one in town has any in stock and getting them there by barge is going to take to long.
    Call the AC store. Jim (907.842.5444) told me today they have Coleman propane cannisters, and they got a shipment of Coleman fuel (white gas) in.

    Good luck.

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    Member danattherock's Avatar
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    Default Forget the cannisters ...

    6XLeech offers the best advice I have read here...

    Get a MSR Whisperlite Internationale and be done with it. I like cannisters at times, but for trips to Kotz, Dilly, etc.., it is just a pain in the ass. The MSR Whisperlite Internationale is rock solid and burns white gas, auto gas, or kerosene. You will always find one or more of these in the bush towns. White gas is cleaner on the jets and readily available most the time. Maybe have your operator pick you up a can and keep it for you just in case. A side note, the cannisters don't perform as well in cold weather anyway. The MSR is a screaming torch! Not easy to simmer or cook with, but if boiling water and some basic cooking, it is the bee's knees. Consider the repair kit and a spare pump for longer trips. Honestly, the pump (plastic) is the only thing I think could actually break/fail. You would have to step on for that to happen, but just saying, the pump is the weak link. Designed that way on purpose to let pressure out as the plastic melts, opposed to exploding. A safety/liability issue for a stove maker as popular as MSR. Not cheaply made, but plastic is plastic man. Used mine on many extended trips and never had a problem. But I always take two Whisperlite Internationals, one expedition repair kit and an extra pump just in case. Link below to my suggestion.

    http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/Product___87723

    http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/Product___80088

    http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/Product___87839

    http://www.rei.com/product/709004?cm...:referralID=NA


    Link below to some great info on cold weather usage for this stove...

    http://therucksack.tripod.com/rations.htm




    .
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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    Moderator LuJon's Avatar
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    yep, my jetboil goes w/ me from the road but a whisper lite will go in situations such as yours. Make sure you take brand new never filled fuel bottles, then fill em up when you get to the village.

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by danattherock View Post
    6XLeech offers the best advice I have read here...

    Honestly, the pump (plastic) is the only thing I think could actually break/fail. You would have to step on for that to happen, but just saying, the pump is the weak link. Designed that way on purpose to let pressure out as the plastic melts, opposed to exploding. A safety/liability issue for a stove maker as popular as MSR. Not cheaply made, but plastic is plastic man.
    I find that hard to believe that is the excuse for the plastic pump, I am thinking the real reason is cost vs. an metal one. Primus has a VERY similar stove with a metal pump. The idea is the O-ring will fail and release the pressure in the bottle in the event of a fire, MSR could do the same thing if they wanted, but don't.

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    Member 6XLeech's Avatar
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    Default Echo from the past...

    This question's come up before.
    Same good advice/experience from Danattherock in 2006:

    http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/...ead.php?t=3424

    REI had Whisperlites discounted to $65 back in May.

    • MSR WhisperLite Internationale Backpacking Stove
    • REI Item #7090000014

    $64.99

  18. #18
    Member danattherock's Avatar
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    Default

    6XLeech,

    Always a scholar and a gentleman



    Quote Originally Posted by Alaska_Lanche View Post
    I find that hard to believe that is the excuse for the plastic pump.


    You could be right of course, but after reading your comment, I emailed MSR to hear what they had to say....



    Dan,

    Yes we use plastic pumps to prevent explosions. If your stove catches on fire and the flames make it’s way to the pump, the pump will melt preventing the flames from reaching the fuel bottle (pressurized). Hope this helps!

    Amber Wright
    Consumer Services Rep.
    Cascade Designs, Inc
    4225 2nd Avenue S| Seattle WA 98134
    1.800.531.9531 ext. 1527
    MSR|Thermarest|Platypus|Sealline



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    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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