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Thread: Ft Rich access fees

  1. #1

    Exclamation Ft Rich access fees

    I thought i'd post this in a new thread so as to not muddy up the other Ft Rich moose hunt thread.
    I'd like to know your take on this deal. If you don't know about it, here's how it works. Any hunters, bow or muzzle loaders must pay an access fee of $125 to the DNR folks on Ft Rich. Any other user does not have to pay any fees, though i'm not sure if that applies to small game hunters.
    I drew DM424 last year, went through the class, paid the fees, got my RAP and called in every day that I wanted to hunt and when I was done, I called to log out, and played by their rules. Why do these rules only apply to hunters? Hikers, walkers, berry pickers, or any other type of non-hunting related user do not have to pay or get a RAP. Seems like discrimination to me.
    Last year when I was hunting the southside of the post, I had people walking by me while I was trying to call in moose, some with dogs that were not leashed. I even had someone with 2 dogs chase a cow, calf and a small bull out of the area I was hunting. If anything, Ft Rich should be closed when folks are hunting moose there but because of the vastness of Ft Rich lands it's virtually impossible to stop them. And don't try to tell them they aren't suppose to be there, it could get you hurt if you approach the wrong person. We all pay taxes so that excuse isn't valid. You either play by the rules or stay of Army land, that's how it should work yet it does not.

  2. #2
    Sponsor Hoytguy's Avatar
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    Default B.S>

    I think the whole access fee thing is BS.. I am military, I used to live on the base when my wife drew the tag in 03', she had to pay the fee.. call in, call out.. deal with all the B.S. but in the end she shot a nice moose seocnd to the last day on the 14th of Jan. People sneak in under the eagle river gate.. and walk their dogs.. All it would take is a few to get prosecuted for tresspassing and it would eliminate all the tresspassers.. Or one to get run over.. but then again that would just add more restrictions to it.. Good luck hunting it.. I havent been lucky yet to draw that tag..

  3. #3
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    All recreational users are supposed to have the pass. Not saying that they do, especially the folks that have lived near the border(s) and have used it for years. However, if you run into the Wildlife Conservation folks they will ask to see your RAP.

    Funny, I always assumed most of the hikers, dogwalkers, etc didn't sign in. Then one day a guy passed me on a bike; I was walking in on a major trail. He stopped and said, "Hey, do you know where the boundary is for Training Area XXX?" He was obviously signed in and trying to abide by the rules.

    I think the $125 is excessive, especially since there is no guarantee the areas will be open. I fully understand how the system works, and why areas are opened for recreation only at the last minute (and the Wildlife guys work hard to get as many areas open as possible), just think the fee is too high given the restrictions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AkHunter45 View Post
    I thought i'd post this in a new thread so as to not muddy up the other Ft Rich moose hunt thread.
    I'd like to know your take on this deal. If you don't know about it, here's how it works. Any hunters, bow or muzzle loaders must pay an access fee of $125 to the DNR folks on Ft Rich. Any other user does not have to pay any fees, though i'm not sure if that applies to small game hunters.
    I drew DM424 last year, went through the class, paid the fees, got my RAP and called in every day that I wanted to hunt and when I was done, I called to log out, and played by their rules. Why do these rules only apply to hunters? Hikers, walkers, berry pickers, or any other type of non-hunting related user do not have to pay or get a RAP. Seems like discrimination to me.
    Last year when I was hunting the southside of the post, I had people walking by me while I was trying to call in moose, some with dogs that were not leashed. I even had someone with 2 dogs chase a cow, calf and a small bull out of the area I was hunting. If anything, Ft Rich should be closed when folks are hunting moose there but because of the vastness of Ft Rich lands it's virtually impossible to stop them. And don't try to tell them they aren't suppose to be there, it could get you hurt if you approach the wrong person. We all pay taxes so that excuse isn't valid. You either play by the rules or stay of Army land, that's how it should work yet it does not.
    Same complaint from a year ago ......http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/...ad.php?t=42096

  5. #5
    Member broncoformudv's Avatar
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    I think charging just moose hunters $125 is outragous and I would love to see where that money goes. It sure does not go towards funding the post DNR folks. Yes everyone is supposed to have a RAP and call in but most people just going out for a walk or taking the dogs on a run fail to do so. They didn't even mention needing a RAP when I inpricessed post in 2005 the only reason I found out about was when I went to the DNR folks to ask them about hunting on post.

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    Default Crap

    I think it was crap that as ADAF I had to pay the fee when I drew the tag in 2007. I did soeley on the fact that I thought it would be a meat hunt to fill the freezer.... It did not turn out that way and I was even more piss...ed when the seaon closed and I did not have a moose in our freezer.

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    I agree John and argued it when Elmendorf instituted it. Why only hunters? No extra cost to anyone but they figure they have a captive audiance since if you drew the tag, you'd pay access.

  8. #8
    Member sharksinthesalsa's Avatar
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    Default fees

    i dont' see a huge problem with paying a fee to access military lands....125 bucks may be a little stiff....the mps at the gate told me anyone who accesses the lands for recreational purposes must have the pass, has to call or sign in and has to call/sign out.....tell me if i am wrong, but when you harvest a moose you are required to call in and they send personell out to your moose kill and check on everything and take samples or something....i doubt you have to do that when you catch some trout out of the lakes on base....i do not know if the 125 dollars is eartagged to go directly back into the wildlife department on base, i would hope it does, but i do not know how to find out or if they will even tell you....i do not see this tag as a guaranteed meat hunt and i will be hunting hard in harvest areas as well looking for that fifty/spike/3/4 browtiner....but it is nice to have an any bull tag so that the first moose with antlers that gets within thirty yards is taking a muzzy through the lungs....heres another question when do you have to pay the fee?.....during the proficiency shoot?.......i wouldn't mind seeing a fee all users....say a 40 dollar annual pass....that includes a vehicle pass for on post....i might pay 60 bucks for that....and maybe an extra 15 per other military installation.
    "early to bed, early to rise, fish like hell, and make up lies"

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    Default Wildlife Fund??

    I asked the same question to Mr. David Battle when I called the number in the supplement. He wasn't in when I initially called but did return my call. I asked specifically about the access fee and why Ft Rich and Elmendorf required the fee but Greely and Wainwright did not. He stated that he couldn't justify why they didn't but said the fee goes directly for wildlife management and goes into a fund with the department of treasury..... I guess more of a mandatory donation versus what they are calling an access fee. I agree that the $125 is steep and probably should be reduced but thats their rules and I'll pay the money and hunt hard to kill something... I could also save far more than that due to not having to haul a trailer and ATV to hunt elsewhere.. Logistical and day to day costs add up pretty fast...

    I was more upset about the profieciency shoot and the two days that they are offered. Two weekends in a row and nothing farther out in late September or October. The second date conflicts with my wife and sons early moose hunt and the early date falls at a time when I am training in the lower 48. Not sure how I'll pull that off.... I asked about being retested at Rabbit Creek but he said it wouldn't suffice. I've bow hunted for over 25 years and harvested numerous animals but now find myself proving my profieciency to a group of people that may not even bow hunt. I also had to prove my profieciency to obtain the bow hunter certification which was evaluated by what I consider serious bow hunters...

    As for the RAP. EVERYONE is required to have and use one. If they don't, then they are in violation of the US Army Alaska Commanding Generals policy not the MP's on wildlife department. If they are caught, then they'll lose the legal right to access military land throughout the state. I don't ask to see anyone elses access cards while out running around post and don't really care if they signed out or not. They'll have to justify their ignorance when they're caught doing something they aren't supposed to be doing. They (MP's, Wildlife Officers) do ask and do check depending on who is patrolling and where people are saw. It's also for their safety due to no one really knowing who is training or firing at any given time. It would be he** to be out berry picking and a stryker vehicle bust thru the brush and ruin your day or a stray round hit you while you're playing fetch with your dog...

  10. #10

    Default Get over it

    Hunting on base requires a lot more base resources than just going for a hike. First, they spend the time to provide the training, gathering and distributing all the hunting materials, monitoring the hunting activities and following up on kills.

    Basically, there is no obligation at all to let anyone hunt on base. They are doing what they can to offer more hunting possibilities to us. They feel to preserve the hunt, they need to keep things a bit tighter (thus the proficiency test and classroom time).

    If you don't want to pay the fee, you are free to not apply for the hunt. The fee is spelled out right there in the permit application material, so it isn't something they throw at you after you get the permit.

    As for the proficiency test, I agree with that 100%. There are a lot of archery hunters out there who have been certified for 25 years or so and have used their skills all the time, remaining at least relatively proficient with their bow. There are also plenty out there who got certified 25 years or so ago and haven't used it since. There is no way to verify which people are which. When you apply for a permit, there isn't a bio attached describing your use or lack of use of a bow over the last decade. I don't see why asking people to prove that they can still hit the broad side of a barn is a problem. The proficiency shoot when I did it was the easiest thing I have done in a long time. Far easier than the original certification shoot.

  11. #11

    Default

    You pay the $125 when you go to your mandatory meeting and I hope for all of those that drew this tag that you have to do the shoot prior to paying. Paying the $125 prior to the shoot and if you were not to qualify would really suck.
    Just to make this clear, I have no problem paying the $125 fee to hunt Ft Rich or Emendorf but other users should also be paying an access fee. I think $40-$60 per year is fair and would generate a good amount of money for the base wildlife programs.

  12. #12

    Default Pay first

    Quote Originally Posted by AkHunter45 View Post
    You pay the $125 when you go to your mandatory meeting and I hope for all of those that drew this tag that you have to do the shoot prior to paying. Paying the $125 prior to the shoot and if you were not to qualify would really suck.
    Just to make this clear, I have no problem paying the $125 fee to hunt Ft Rich or Emendorf but other users should also be paying an access fee. I think $40-$60 per year is fair and would generate a good amount of money for the base wildlife programs.
    When I did it before, we paid prior to the shoot. Not a worry though, if you fail the shoot, you have no business archery hunting. It is, or at least it was, very easy. It's been a few years, so things may have changed, but I doubt it.

    The $125 is related directly to hunting, not the other activities. The other users do not need the wildlife management. The other users do not need the training and monitoring that the hunting requires. They do have to have the same access permit, but that does not require any efforts from the wildlife management crew.

    Really, $125 for such a convenient hunt is a bargain. Especially with the help that they provide. Easy access to information about numbers taken to date, areas with recent sightings, past areas with good success, etc...

    Obvisouly, this is just my opinion, but I feel that the $125 is a very reasonable charge for the hunting that is being made available.

  13. #13
    Member TWB's Avatar
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    If successful I'd rather pay the $125 to hunt on base than pay over $2000 in fuel costs alone to hunt up off the Yukon, and I'd get to sleep in my bed every night.
    We do not go to the green woods and crystal waters to rough it, we go to smooth it. We get it rough enough at home; in towns and cities; in shops, offices, stores, banks anywhere that we may be placed

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by TWB View Post
    If successful I'd rather pay the $125 to hunt on base than pay over $2000 in fuel costs alone to hunt up off the Yukon, and I'd get to sleep in my bed every night.
    And if you weren't successful?

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    For drawing the tag John, for drawing the tag! Hunting is hunting, even on base.

    When I was a conservation agent, any help I gave in spotting moose was in direct proportion to the effort of the hunter. If all he was doing, and I've seen it, is drive dwon the road, stop every 100 yards or so, get out and stand on the berm glassing, then get back in, then no help came from me.

  16. #16

    Default Army Post

    Ft Richardson is an Army POST not a base

    The Air Force has bases...The Army has posts

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sua Sponte 96 View Post
    Ft Richardson is an Army POST not a base

    The Air Force has bases...The Army has posts
    And they will soon be a joint installation so what is your point?

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    Member TWB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AkHunter45 View Post
    And if you weren't successful?

    Then I'd ***** about it, LOL

    I think it's a BS deal where only hunters have to pay it. 95% of the lands usage goes to hikers, dog walkers, mtn bikers, and folks out fishing. Now if there were some upkeep that needed to be done that would only survive with some sort of fee, then it should be a fee across the board.
    We do not go to the green woods and crystal waters to rough it, we go to smooth it. We get it rough enough at home; in towns and cities; in shops, offices, stores, banks anywhere that we may be placed

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    Quote Originally Posted by anchskier View Post
    There are a lot of archery hunters out there who have been certified for 25 years or so
    Really? ...when did they start the bow hunter certification program?
    ------------------------------------------------
    pull my finger....

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    Default "Get over it"?

    Wow that's blunt! First I call BS to your justification of the reasoning behind the funds. I know what they're designed to be used for but the reality is they aren't used to the fullest extent that they could be. In over 20 years of military service I've never had to pay to use the land that I've worked or lived on. The wildlife management and opportunities were also far better than here. I support paying the funds but also see some relevance in the others view points. I will gladly pay the money due to the convenience of being at home to hunt and the money saved in logistical expenses to hunt elsewhere.

    If the profieciency test is "so easy" then why do it? If they can't shoot then they won't kill anything and no one should be recreating in an area open for hunting so what can they hurt. Don't give me the justification about wounding an animal because the test won't prove or stop that. ALMOST anyone can shoot a bow at a stationary target at 30 or less yards with no adrenaline running. The real test is who can shoot a monster bull at 40 yards with the wind blowing, snow falling and their heart beating 1000 bpm.

    Just my two cents!

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