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Thread: Need Advice!!

  1. #1

    Default Need Advice!!

    I was on a Brown bear hunt this spring, and the Oufitters assistant guide never showed up. Since the Outfitter had a hunt booked with another hunter 3 days after my arrival and it was a 1x1 hunt he elected to give me a partial refund for my hunt. BUT his check bounced!! What recourse do you guys & gals suggest Thanks

  2. #2
    Member AlaskaTrueAdventure's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Same-O

    Some of the same advise I recently advised goosepilot, who had not been paid...

    After attempting to talk with your guide-outfitter...

    ...File a complaint with the Alaska Big Game Commercial Services Board!

    PM sent.

    Dennis
    AK TAGS

  3. #3
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    Default

    Partial refund? Did you get to hunt at all? Did you even see any bears? Dennis is right, file a complaint and consider taking him to small claims court about the bounced check. And do me a favor and PM me who this was.

  4. #4

    Default Need Advise!

    Bill S. Yes, I did hunt. As mentioned, the Outfitter was with me for 3 days of my 10 day hunt before the other client arrived. And yes I did see a number of bears, sows with cubs and juviniles (2-3 yr olds).

  5. #5
    Member akguy454's Avatar
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    Default

    as with any business relationship, he offered a 10 day hunt for X amount of dollars. You did not receive a 10 day hunt for X amount of dollars. He offered a refund for not receiving 10 days worth of services that bounced. Sounds like you are at least entitled the amount you agreed on. Get that amount back legally if you can not arrange something with the guide.

  6. #6
    Member danattherock's Avatar
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    Default Perhaps some middle ground could be found...

    Consider having him book you a free 7 day hunt next season. If the check bounced, the guy is hurting for dough. This applies to many folks these days unfortunately. It would seem logical that if the guy has good intentions, he would be relieved to offer you a 7 day hunt in lieu of money he seemingly doesn't have. If he is a stand up guy, everyone could come out of this deal happy. You get the hunt you paid for and he gets the money that he likely needs. Food for thought at any rate.
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

  7. #7
    Member tboehm's Avatar
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    Default More info

    A few more details would be nice. Where are you located, where is he located, how much money are we talking about, were you successful, what would you like to happen?

    Danattherock - makes an interesting suggestion.

    I would definately contact that board and file a complaint.

  8. #8

    Default More info?

    I was on a Brown bear hunt, as such, we are talking about several thousand dollars!! And "No" I was not successful, but that is hunting. In fact. it was my 3rd unsuccessful brown bear hunt. I am looking for a 10+ bear or nothing! (My wife figures I just keep passing so I can go back???)
    As for a return hunt! How can one justify spending more money (air/hotels/etc) and more time with someone of dubious integrity??
    I know I am being somewhat vague on the details, but my intent is to get advise on how to recapture my money not to badmouth an Outfitter. Then I would be no better than he!
    Last edited by mcreg; 07-21-2009 at 08:26. Reason: spelling error

  9. #9
    Member Bighorse's Avatar
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    Default Good suggestion

    If you liked him, the area, and were not successful.

    +1 Asking about getting rebooked

  10. #10

    Default If his check bounces this year

    what makes you think he'll even be around next year? I'd go after the money and then do my darndest to warn others about his dubious practices. Why did you get short changed on your hunt? You were there and in the field 3 days before the other guy showed up. What was the deciding factor on whether or not you finished your hunt?

  11. #11
    Member 1Cor15:19's Avatar
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AlaskaTrueAdventure View Post
    Some of the same advise I recently advised goosepilot, who had not been paid...

    After attempting to talk with your guide-outfitter...

    ...File a complaint with the Alaska Big Game Commercial Services Board!

    PM sent.

    Dennis
    AK TAGS
    EXCELLENT ADVICE!

    It sounds as if you are a very reasonable client so I would absolutely try and speak with the guided before going forward. As for rescheduling the hunt it sounds as if you had significant incidental expenses with the hunt. I would explain this to the guide and see if he would reschedule the entire 10 day hunt next spring not just part of it. His assistant not showing up is not your fault and even in 3 days I suspect you did not get your money's worth.

    It sounds like you hired a guide that has good intentions, but you did not receive what he contracted to provide. It is a simple breach of contract and if you have contacted your guide and he is unwilling/unable to rectify this you should file a complaint and take the other necessary steps to receive your funds. At the very least you want to help protect future clients. If he will not make this right, you are not damaging his name and reputation (badmouthing him), he is. You are simply making others aware of his character and business practices. As a hunter you understand that the actual harvest of the animal is not what you are contracting from the outfitter/guide. It is his experience, protection and help that you hire and it sounds from your report he failed to deliver this to you. Report him properly and do not stop until you receive your entitled refund or he provides the services promised.

  12. #12

    Default 257 wby

    Your comments are bang on as to my sentiments. To answer your questions, I was with the Outfitter for 3 days then `his`client showed up on a 1x1 hunt. Which I found out was a return hunt for last year`s screw ups. I later found out the assistant guide was questionalble as the air taxi had no booking or even calls that he was to fly in anyone else but the 3 of us. Aslo I might add that the Outfitter showed up 2 days late, however I had booked my flight home 2 days after the hunt to avoid bad weather issues, I still could have done the 10 days. I was put up by a fishing lodge adjacent this fwellows concession till he arrived. Otherwise I guess I`d have found a good tree to sleep under for a couple of days. As for food, well I could stand to lose a couple of pounds so no big deal!
    The hunt was ended because both of us (hunter) had a 1x1 contract and the other fellow was on a return hunt and more senior than I so he was given priority. As well, I have been hunting bears for may years whwereas the other fellow had only seen 1 bear (last spring) so he was unable to judge size, sex. etc Also since the air charter only flew on certain days and hence I was stranded and always hopeful the àssistant`would show up, the Outfitter gave me an ATV and marine radio then sent me out on my own.
    During that time I seen several bears, all sow with cubs or juveniles (3-4 yr olds). I also called in a large male white wolf to within 10 yds with a predator call. Got some awesome pics!
    Last edited by mcreg; 07-21-2009 at 12:38. Reason: added comments

  13. #13
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    Default

    Well, pretty easy to answer.

    Why don't you call the outfitter and ask him how he can make the check good before you file a complaint against him? Depending on the amount of the check will determin your other recourses.

    But asking people on here on how to get your outfitter to honor his checks is really a time waster.
    Tennessee

  14. #14
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    Default

    Wait a minute. You are not an Alaska resident so him giving you an ATV and sending you off on your own is an illegal practice. The guide must accompany you in the field, not out guiding someone else.

  15. #15
    Member BRWNBR's Avatar
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    Default

    i'd let big game commercial services board know of his actions with the ATV for sure, thats bad judgment.
    Www.blackriverhunting.com
    Master guide 212

  16. #16

    Default Recourse Option?

    Snowwolfe: Good advise and I have already tried on numerous occasions to converse with the Outfitter to work things out. However all attepmpt have been in vain. There's an old saying "it's hard to get blood from a stone" and it appears this is the case.
    What I was hoping for is advise as to what avenues I have to get the money owing back- small claims/collection agency/legal action (lawyer) etc. Even perhaps which law offices specialize in small claims as i am not familiar with any Anc or Juneau AK law offices.

  17. #17
    Member akndnlawyer's Avatar
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    Default Time to consider legal counsel

    My thoughts from the bench: If you're a nonresident and are interested in discussing legal options to recover monies owed, you should talk to an attorney who practices civil law in Alaska.

    Oftentimes, just the retention of an attorney and a letter from that attorney stating the intent to file suit will motivate otherwise professional people into action to settle to avoid the inevitable costs associated with defending the suit.

    If the amount is less than $7500 you will likely want to file in small claims court. You can do this without the aid of legal counsel--but you should talk to an attorney first.

    You will have to be able to serve the guide with notice of suit so it would help if you had his contact information/known whereabouts for the process server to actually hand him the document.

    You can attend the hearing via phone--as can the defendant (guide). If you prevail at the hearing, you merely have a judgement against the guide for payment.

    Your options (and difficulties) once you have a judgment are:

    1) maybe he'll pay so as to not trash his reputation [this is rare as by this point everyone is usually very mad]

    2) levy a judgement against his Permanent Fund Dividend [this is complicated and often requires legal counsel--but once levied--you will be paid if the debtor (guide) is an Alaska resident and is eligible for the dividend]

    3) levy against his federal tax return [again, complicated and often requires legal counsel]

    4) levy against his bank account or employment paycheck if he works a regular job in the off season and you know this information--the bank info you would retain from the bounced check

    5) seek to settle the amount via tangible property such as a rifle, ATV or some other personal property (this is rare, see 1 above).

    Other readers, please do not PM me for legal counsel or advice--I don't have the time and you usually don't have the funds.

    I think the advice given to this point in the forum has been sound but if the issue is keeping you up at night, consider contacting an attorney to discuss your options. An informed man is a restful man.

  18. #18
    Member danattherock's Avatar
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    Default Seriously...

    Quote Originally Posted by akndnlawyer View Post


    My thoughts from the bench...



    Other readers, please do not PM me for legal counsel or advice--I don't have the time and you usually don't have the funds.

    .
    akndnLAWYER,

    If you would change your forum name and leave out comments like "from the bench", you would not be bothered by "other readers".

    Kind of makes me think of a stripper claiming sexual harrassment in the workplace.

    Food for thought.


    .
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

  19. #19

    Default Legal advise

    AKNDNLAWYER: Thanks for the advice.If you could PM me with a name or 2 I would be appreciative, as I am not from AK nor you i know any legal counsel there.
    If I might return the favor, obviously you are in the legal profession. There are many who read these forums and many who may be looking for legal counsel from time to time. Your closing remarks certainly won't win you any favor. I trust you are a little more "coy" in your closings from the "bench"
    There's an old saying" never judge a book by its' cover" I have found this to be sound advice

  20. #20
    Member danattherock's Avatar
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    Default

    There is also some old saying about walking like a duck, talking like a duck, ...
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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