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Thread: Pursuing vs Posiitioning

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    Moderator LuJon's Avatar
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    Default Pursuing vs Posiitioning

    Reading the regs is down right confusing I says in on the same page that you can use your sled to position for a shot in certain areas but you cannot under any circumstances use a vehicle to pursue an animal that is fleeing. This sure will put a damper in the "hunting the hunters" book sales as anything more than another "how it used to be" Alaska hunting book.

    So I can't chase a wolf pack with a sled but some dude with a plane, a shotgun and a permit can fly around and blast them at will... Perhaps the trapping regs will help.......................Nope it says you can't use a motorized vehicle to "molest or drive" a furbearer, but it does repeat the limited locations in which you can "position" yourself for the shot. Now is pursuing the same as molesting, or driving? I have no idea honestly!
    What a cluster!

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    Member sharksinthesalsa's Avatar
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    Default soooo

    if you pass said animal at a high rate of speed are you then no longer pursuing, but positioning yourself for another shot
    "early to bed, early to rise, fish like hell, and make up lies"

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    Maby they are referringto the use of a snowgo and sled to cause the animal to use its instincts , and you the hunter, to place yourself ahead of the animal so you may shoot it from a solid, non moving position.

    Caribou, when they are alert to the presece of a snow machine and sled will run UP the mountain every time. When I see them, they usually see me, if not before I see them moving off, up that hill. by the time Im within a mile of the group, it will be leaving.
    I will then use a creek draw or a ridge to ride up the mountain, out of sight of the animals, as fast as I can and wait for the Caribou who are going to come, and they do.

    When we start chasing Wolves, they do the same thing, and it works well. They do not know were ahaed of them, and we shoot with the snowgo seat as a rest, or kneel and elbows. Just remember to keep swinging as you pull the trigger if your animals still moving.

    Reindeer herders used to ride and cull their Ferral reindeer, by driving up to them at about 35-40mph and shooting them in the head with a pistol or rifle of small caliber. You just about have to touch the animal before you shoot, and it takes alot of skill to actually place the shot. Bouncing, moving forward with a running animal whos moving off gives you about two seconds to get it done. Shooting any father away than touching distance is nearly impossible, as you, the machine and the caribou are doing some wild moves at high rates of speed.
    This tecnique developed because its easier to bring a carcass back to the herder than the live animal.

    If we know theres Caribou around the base of the mountain, we often send a fellow or two up to the mountain ridges to wait for the animals that will flee our hunting and later in the day meet up with them , and they will almost always have luck.

    Also, fat Caribou will fall back as they string out running away, like how skinny dogs run faster....so, especcially in winter, the best ones to shoot are at the rear of the runners. If I can, I will see caribou crossing a river or eating around a lake and looking at the back of the group, find the fattest females, as well as watching the cows lead and the Bulls follow in fall time river hunting.
    Many times, groups of cows will cross the river,and the big Bulls will cross following them, so we let the first ones go by and wait for the cautious big guys to come outta the bushes on the females trail, and hit the water running.

    In open country during winter, I will approach a goup of Caribou, and they will flee , miles before I get there, and I can often find a way to cut them off and wait for them, in folds and defilades of the land, as well as stopping above creeks and waiting for the Caribou to start climbing up out of the creek they are putting between them and me.
    Sit and shoot.

    Persuite is chasing them, Positioning is cutting them off from that escape. I see nothing wrong with driving a vehicle to cut them off, and shooting from a standstill is the only way that you will connect for sure.

    Thats what I do, and how I understand it.
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    Default great question

    Quote Originally Posted by LuJon View Post
    Reading the regs is down right confusing I says in on the same page that you can use your sled to position for a shot in certain areas but you cannot under any circumstances use a vehicle to pursue an animal that is fleeing.
    That's a tough one that I've wondered about too. Once I asked a F&G guy directly where that exact line was because I didn't want to cross it - I was right then sitting on a snow machine, with a rifle.

    He said he didn't know exactly where the line was. Makes you appreciate both his honesty, and the "grey area" that this question lies within.

    I think its tough to obey all game laws when such a number of them are not black and white, but we all do our best, and most err on the side of conservativeness - I do - though we've all seen otherwise too.

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    Member Vince's Avatar
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    Default

    Lujon...


    i am sitting on the hill side and spot a wolf pack...

    i can ride down to where they are at or are going to be. same for Moose , caribou,, etc...

    i can not have forward motion to take the shot. and in some instances it requires the engine be turned off.. in all reality not a whole lot different then in a boat rules..


    but... if is see that pack running up the Rex trail i can not pursue them to tire them out, or herd them in to a shooting lane for my self or others. nor can i shoot at them WHILE running among them. pursuing and positioning are not that confusing when you think that YOU MUST BE STOPPED TO SHOOT. can you chaise water fowl in your boat? or swimming deer or bears or bou? only in a very limited locals.....
    "If you are on a continuous search to be offended, you will always find what you are looking for; even when it isn't there."

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    Moderator LuJon's Avatar
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    Lets say the wolves see you and take off (fleeing) leaving the rex trail and head out toward a lake just to the north of the trail. You know a way to circle around the lake in a nearby draw and head them off. You crack the throttle and speed around to the back side. You come to a skidding stop jump off your sled and run to a vantage point overlooking the lake just as the pack breaks out onto the ice. Can you shoot them or did you use your sled to pursue fleeing animals? Is this positioning or persuit?

  7. #7
    Member Vince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuJon View Post
    Lets say the wolves see you and take off (fleeing) leaving the Rex trail and head out toward a lake just to the north of the trail. You know a way to circle around the lake in a nearby draw and head them off. You crack the throttle and speed around to the back side. You come to a skidding stop jump off your sled and run to a vantage point overlooking the lake just as the pack breaks out onto the ice. Can you shoot them or did you use your sled to pursue fleeing animals? Is this positioning or pursuit?
    You went around? sounds like you answered your own question...

    it is not that easy any way... i have had wolf in that area leave my 580 zr behind..in deep snow. you may not pursue in an attempt to harass or herd in to shooting positions.

    say you see nice spring bear on side of the hill... he is going up..

    you take your sled up the hill to turn it back down to allow your buddy a shot at it...


    Thats bad...


    you see bear on side of hill... he is going up.. you go up to where he is with in range and stop.

    thats okay


    you see bear you go up he turns and comes back down so do you...
    you get down to bottom when in range and stop. ... use your ethical judgment... did you herd it or position due to terrain and the inability of your sled to stay on the hill

    99.999% of the time you are out there alone and these judgments will be yours. if you are trying to walk a fine line between them you probably are .. .and then the line would be open to interpretation by LEO..and LEO is the one who will finally decide to site you or not.

    so... if you cant not decide if your actions are pursuing.. or positioning.. you should probably pass...
    "If you are on a continuous search to be offended, you will always find what you are looking for; even when it isn't there."

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    Default positioning

    Quote Originally Posted by LuJon View Post
    Lets say the wolves see you and take off (fleeing) leaving the rex trail and head out toward a lake just to the north of the trail. You know a way to circle around the lake in a nearby draw and head them off. You crack the throttle and speed around to the back side. You come to a skidding stop jump off your sled and run to a vantage point overlooking the lake just as the pack breaks out onto the ice. Can you shoot them or did you use your sled to pursue fleeing animals? Is this positioning or persuit?
    Positioning. I'd call that perfectly legal, and a smart action to take.

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