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Thread: Deshka weir count

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    Member willphish4food's Avatar
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    Default Deshka weir count

    As of June 4- 238 fish. Last year, when it barely reached half the threshold level BEG, there were 5688 fish through the weir. in 2007, 16,929. There is nothing water wise to impede fish passage. Great water levels in the Susitna and Deshka Rivers, warm temperatures, normal breakup schedule. I think it is very safe to say that we have a BIG problem. Gear up for full closure of this fishery, and hang on to your hats as other Susitna streams are closely monitored.

  2. #2

    Wink

    The other streams are not going to be closely monitored. There will be a fly over, when they reach their spawning grounds, to do an ariel count of spawners, but that is it. The only monitoring going on, will be LE monitoring the fishermen. The other streams are in just as much trouble, but the state can't afford to close the roadside fisheries, because of the tourist industry. That is why they are trying to put in hatchery stocks as well. Deshka will close on Monday. Roadside streams will not be affected by the EO about to be released.
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    Default question

    Quote Originally Posted by willphish4food View Post
    As of June 4- 238 fish. Last year, when it barely reached half the threshold level BEG, there were 5688 fish through the weir. in 2007, 16,929. There is nothing water wise to impede fish passage. Great water levels in the Susitna and Deshka Rivers, warm temperatures, normal breakup schedule. I think it is very safe to say that we have a BIG problem. Gear up for full closure of this fishery, and hang on to your hats as other Susitna streams are closely monitored.
    Willphish4food - where did you get the culmulative figures for last year on 4 June. I looked on the ADF&G web page under fish counts and it does not look like 5688 fish were past the weir on 4 June. Also, looking at this year the counts are just starting to increase so it may be a little early to make a prediction. What the sport fishery doing today and the rest of the weekend may be more of an indicator of what is happening. This next week will be telling.

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    Default Willphis4food off a month

    I figured something was wrong with Will's numbers. He looked at 4 July not 4 June. In 2008 on June 5th there was only 150 chinook past the weir. This year there is over 300. So lets go back to being calm and not jump off the cliff yet. The run is just starting to come in.

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    Member willphish4food's Avatar
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    Default jumping off a cliff?

    My bad. I did look at the July numbers. It definitely put things in a very bad light. Looking at just the last 2 years' data (cause thats the page I'm on) the bulk of the run passes the weir from June 11 to July 1. Historically, June 12 marks the 25% mark of the run. With 6 days of data to go, we are at 442. We should be seeing a big upswing in the numbers, but so far its a trickle. Definitely cause for concern, but not panic yet. My apologies.

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    Default time for action

    With 52 counts yesterday and a total of just over 700 I would think ADF&G is getting very nervous and action should be coming in the next day or so. I would hope it is a total closure and not catch and release fishing. There is a mortality associated with catch and release and the regulaion 75.003 states one can only go to catch and release if the goal is going to be made. Using words like closed to retention in my mind is the same as catch and release. The emergency order should just say the fishery is closed to chinook salmon fishing - period. That would also prompt the closure in the commercial fishery. If one allows continues mortality and the assumption the goal is going to be met then the plan would or could allow the commercial fishery to operate. I am tired of ADF&G sport fish word games. Close the thing to all users and reopen if a surge of fish comes up the river. Lets let conservation rule over opportunity in this situation. One piece of data that is missing is how well the fishery is doing and if thee is any sign of a concentration of fish below the weir. Maybe one of the ADF&G readers will answer.

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    Default Hate to have to agree... Looks bad...

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerka View Post
    With 52 counts yesterday and a total of just over 700 I would think ADF&G is getting very nervous and action should be coming in the next day or so. I would hope it is a total closure and not catch and release fishing. There is a mortality associated with catch and release and the regulaion 75.003 states one can only go to catch and release if the goal is going to be made. Using words like closed to retention in my mind is the same as catch and release. The emergency order should just say the fishery is closed to chinook salmon fishing - period. That would also prompt the closure in the commercial fishery. If one allows continues mortality and the assumption the goal is going to be met then the plan would or could allow the commercial fishery to operate. I am tired of ADF&G sport fish word games. Close the thing to all users and reopen if a surge of fish comes up the river. Lets let conservation rule over opportunity in this situation. One piece of data that is missing is how well the fishery is doing and if thee is any sign of a concentration of fish below the weir. Maybe one of the ADF&G readers will answer.

    Don't know if you are following the King numbers on the Anchor, Ayakulik, Karluk... Are all way behind schedule and looks way worste then last year.... Now don't accuse me off jumping off a cliff here Nerka, but Sockeye returns are early all over the state and showing up strong inthe same rivers that have virtually no kings, so pretty good indication that gonna be another dismal year for kings in these systems.

    Last year at this time fishing inDeep Cr was increadible... Wonder if there are many fish yet this year?

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    Member fishNphysician's Avatar
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerka View Post
    Lets let conservation rule over opportunity in this situation.
    Amen, brother. Amen.
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    Default Shaking my head

    It's a NO BRAINER..... I agree with Nerka's take on this. No need to play word games or risk the loss of any caught and released fish. To any fish and game decision makers that might read this, get on your broad shoulders and game face and pull the plug NOW. Forget about trying to make anyone happy and do what's right for the fish. I wish we understood more about why the king runs are dismal, but pointing fingers at each other solves nothing. Let's let Mother Nature do her job, keep trying to identify the Cook Inlet/Kodiak system wide factors, and feel good about lending a helping hand by not harrassing the fish in these streams that are laying the golden eggs.

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    Default

    1st, last and always without spawners the rivers will be dead. With counts as low as they are we cant afford to loose ANY fish. C&R indeed puts a fish under stress and does cause the loss of some of them. again we cant afford any loss for any reason we can prevent.

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    Member sheep man's Avatar
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    Default

    I hope there looking hard at the little su, catch rates are way off....any buddy and every buddy please call Fish and game in palmer,,,,,ask for MR, Rutz...my gut feeling is that the hole northern district is shot for the year.....

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    Member willphish4food's Avatar
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    Default

    Deshka mouth this weekend had mixed reports. Those that got up early and fished the openings did well= later in the day fishing was poor- but weather was 75-80 degrees, bright sun- bad fishing conditions. The most reliable report I had was that from 10-2 on Sunday there was about one hookup every 10 minutes or so. Not great, but not awful, either. Also, hook and releasers early in the week that I talked to said it was great. 10-20 fish to the boat in 3 hours. Sunday, no rollers at the mouth, but lots of them out in the Big Su. No indication that a huge surge of fish is building up preparatory to shooting up the stream. The rollers in the Su indicate that Northern streams should keep seeing fish building up. So far Parks Highway streams are slow, but picking up. Weather is killing us- kings don't like bright sun and warm water!

    Unless something happens in the next 2 days, Deshka will only be at about 15% minimum, instead of the 25% that Fish and Game is looking for to keep it open. It would be consistent with the plans to close it completely, let it rest a week, and if the numbers catch up where they should be, then re-open it.

    One thing about the Little Su: the Deshka River being restricted has heavily increased boat traffic and angler effort on the Little Su, but there isn't a corresponding increase in the numbers of fish being harvestede.

  13. #13
    Member fishNphysician's Avatar
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    Default Shuttin' her down...

    It's official:

    The Deshka River king salmon sport fishery will close at 6:00 a.m., Saturday, June 13, through the remainder of the king salmon sport fishing season. The Deshka River king salmon sport fishery will close at 6:00 a.m., Saturday, June 13, through the remainder of the king salmon sport fishing season.
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    Default

    The northern district commercial season has also been terminated.

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    Angry The Little su next?

    It's official for the deshke, is the Little Su going to be next? It just might need to be.

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    Moderator AKmud's Avatar
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    Default

    They ought to shut down all the northern streams for a complete 4-5 year cycle and place stricter limits on the commercial openings IMO. Letting the system recover over the generational cycles would be the fastest way to get things back on track.

    I know....tourism and businesses would be heavily affected, but they will also when the fishery disappears.
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  17. #17

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    AKmud I totally agree with you on your comment. I don't want my grandson's saying "Grandpa tell me 'bout the good old days" when it comes to the king fishing on these Valley rivers. The thing should of been shut down from the start of the season and the catch and release thing is another burr under my saddle.

  18. #18
    Member willphish4food's Avatar
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    Default last two days

    The last two days' counts were pretty good. Not where they should be yet, but definitely more encouraging for at least beating last year's dismal return. The thing that changed was the weather- cool, overcast, and rain Friday night. It's fine that the river was closed- go ahead and leave it until the escapement will be met.

    As to monitoring other parks Hwy streams, the department sends people out to the mouths to take stock of the catch numbers and rates, and speaks with guides and others with a long history of fishing local rivers to keep abreast of how the run is doing. Last year we were one day away from an EO closure of all Parks Hwy streams, but a big slug of bright fish was observed at several stream mouths, so it was felt that the weekend only fishing would be restrictive enough.

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    Member thewhop2000's Avatar
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    Default Willow way slow for kings

    Had a friend go fishing for three hours, two days in a row at the mouth of the river. @ 50 people constantly fishing. Two jacks were the only fish caught, on both days. I'm hoping the week-end fishery only helps the numbers improve somewhat. If not, maybe that should be shut down too. He didn't even see any rollers in the river either. Dismal year all around.

  20. #20
    Moderator AKmud's Avatar
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    I floated Little Willow yesterday and didn't see any kings whatsoever. Usually we see them pooled up or in the shallows as we are floating, but we didn't see a single one. We only caught a few small grayling and one small rainbow. Hopefully the surge will come soon...
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