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Thread: rowing frame

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    Default rowing frame

    I am planing on building a new frame for my 14' NRS Otter with some dry storage boxes and that will break down for fly out trips. Does anyone have any pictures or advice on a frame like this? Thank for any help

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    Member danattherock's Avatar
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    I take float trips and needed a frame that would break down small. Not just for the bush plane, but the commercial flights up to Alaska as well. No room for dry boxes on the one I designed, but it may give you some ideas. Just over 20 lbs and the seat is made of 1" pvc (like cutting board). The edges and corners are rounded unlike the image below. A padded kayak gel seat will sit on top of that. Breaks down small and packs easy. Below is what I had made. Except I did away with the break on the tube sides of the frame, making it four pieces total, rather than six. Food for thought anyway.

    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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    Nice lightweight design Dan. Should be easy to put together on a river bank too.

    Trapperdan, take a look at the two Bighorn raft frames at NRS: http://www.nrsweb.com/shop/product_list.asp?deptid=1052. Bighorn 1 packs one box/cooler, and the Bighorn 2 packs 2. They are certainly heavier than Danattherock's design, but are straightforward. NRSweb.com, AlaskaSeries.com, Hollaender.com and others will sell you various types of usable connectors, oar stands and other fittings should you decide to go with a non-welded aluminum frame. Alaska Steel sells the aluminum pipe at a decent price if you are in Anchorage.

    I've used welded EMT and steel pipe frames, but the Schedule 40 Aluminum pipe is far stronger, and sometime you may really need that strength. Also frames made with removable fittings facilitate frame changes and adjustments. Whereas a welded frame is what it is, and if your needs change you have to build another. Either can be made to take down for flight, but the ones that bolt together with fittings are designed that way by nature.

    You can design a frame that goes under a box/cooler, but it just adds complexity and weight. It's easier to suspend the box/cooler with straps. I don't like the cooler strap brackets that NRS and others sell. They suspend the cooler too high, making it difficult to use it as a seat. I see they make an adjustible one now: http://www.nrsweb.com/shop/product.a...51&deptid=1055. But I don't see any advantage for these over plain old straps.

    Just my personal opinions.

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    Default Rowing frame

    Danattherock
    I will be building a frame real soon, is that frame of yours PVC or AL, I could not tell.
    Thanks T

    Sweepint
    Wasilla, (when not overseas)
    '' Livn' The Dream ''
    26' Hewescraft Cuddy, twin 115 Yam

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    Member danattherock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweepint View Post

    is that frame of yours PVC or AL, I could not tell.
    It is 1.5" (1 7/8" OD) schedule 40 anodized T6 aluminum with spring clips holding it together in the slip joints.
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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    Cool breakdown Danthe...

    Are you using a mesh to hold things on this design?

    George

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    If by "mesh" you mean holding gear suspended off the floor of the raft, no. I have a gear hammock for the back of the raft. The frame will only support me on the seat. Wife up front on the front thwart.
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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    webmaster Michael Strahan's Avatar
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    Default Oar Stand Angle?

    Quote Originally Posted by danattherock View Post
    I take float trips and needed a frame that would break down small. Not just for the bush plane, but the commercial flights up to Alaska as well. No room for dry boxes on the one I designed, but it may give you some ideas. Just over 20 lbs and the seat is made of 1" pvc (like cutting board). The edges and corners are rounded unlike the image below. A padded kayak gel seat will sit on top of that. Breaks down small and packs easy. Below is what I had made. Except I did away with the break on the tube sides of the frame, making it four pieces total, rather than six. Food for thought anyway.

    Hi Dan,

    Most of the frames I've used have about a 15 outboard tilt on the oar stands. It appears you are using the Hollandaer crossover fittings for yours. Are your oar stands vertical, or are you rotating the fittings to 15? If they are tilted, do they dig into your tubes?

    There are some cast aluminum fittings that go in the end of the pipe, which are designed to accommodate an oar lock, but these are straight too. Alternatively you could bend the oar stand pipe... just curious how you dealt with this.

    Also, are you bracing your feet on the front cross-bar? If so, have you considered installing a drop bar similar to the one on the NRS Longhorn frame?

    Great stuff...

    -Mike

    -Mike
    LOST CREEK COMPANY: Specializing in Alaska hunt consultation and planning for do-it-yourself hunts, fully outfitted hunts, and guided hunts.
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    I have another thought on your breakdown frame, Dan. I prefer to have my seat canted forward a bit. Especially if there is no seat back. This gives me a better position for the portagee stroke (pushing forward), and keeps me from flipping off the back in rough water. You can still buy frames with a simple slant board seat. It's surprising how well it works, and is actually quite comfortable. Not sure how your seat is attached, but if it's just clamped on you can adjust it to suit. I have one that's welded flat, but I don't like to use it.

    As for oar stand fittings, you could grind off the lower outside edge a bit to allow for them to cant outward.

    I usually don't have a lowered foot bar on my frames, but I liked when I did. Most of the time I brace against a thwart, or put just one foot on the high cross bar in front of me. If you use the thwart you have to strap the frame in tight to keep it from slipping around.

    Trapperdan, another option is to do what danattherock did with his frame, and add separate units for suspending a cooler & box. Then you are completely modular for different configurations. Lots of ways to do frames.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Strahan View Post

    Are your oar stands vertical, or are you rotating the fittings to 15º?

    -Mike

    Honestly, have not thought about this Mike. I have not yet heard of rotating them 15 degrees. The fittings are adjustable with flush mounted alan screws. I have not even put the frame on the raft yet. Wife and I work out of state and we were home in Feb when I received the frame. We plan to get back to NC in June, where I will put the frame on the raft for the first time. We have three days of rowing lessons in the mountains of NC then. But I have not heard of rotating the fittings. If you don't mind, tell me the rationale for doing so. As for foot bar, I choose to do without in an effort to keep weight down. At 6'6", my feet can wedge under the front thwart if need be. I have kept adding a drop down U shaped footbar as a possible add on after using the raft/frame together. But for now remain undecided.
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Strutz View Post

    I have another thought on your breakdown frame, Dan. I prefer to have my seat canted forward a bit.
    Thanks for the thought Jim, but the seat bracket is welded. They suggested two options, one of which would be alan screw fittings that could be adjusted. But at 300 lbs, I was very skeptical so I had them double the size of the bracket and weld it to the rear frame bar. Also had them use 1" poly seating surface instead of the 1/2" they normally use. Big guys learn to be skeptical. You would be amazed how many pieces a plastic lawn chair can break into when it is cold
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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    webmaster Michael Strahan's Avatar
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    Default Oarstand angle

    Quote Originally Posted by danattherock View Post
    Honestly, have not thought about this Mike. I have not yet heard of rotating them 15 degrees. The fittings are adjustable with flush mounted alan screws. I have not even put the frame on the raft yet. Wife and I work out of state and we were home in Feb when I received the frame. We plan to get back to NC in June, where I will put the frame on the raft for the first time. We have three days of rowing lessons in the mountains of NC then. But I have not heard of rotating the fittings. If you don't mind, tell me the rationale for doing so. As for foot bar, I choose to do without in an effort to keep weight down. At 6'6", my feet can wedge under the front thwart if need be. I have kept adding a drop down U shaped footbar as a possible add on after using the raft/frame together. But for now remain undecided.
    Dan,

    The deal is that when you're sitting in the boat with your hands on the oars, the shafts are at an angle when the blades are in the water. A 15 outboard angle gives you a 90 relationship between the oarlock and the oar shaft, which is what you want. Otherwise, the shaft is at an angle in the oarlock and pops out easier.

    An idea that might work for your frame is to spin the Hollandaer fittings around so they are inboard. Then you can kick them out at the proper angle and you should be fine. But it will bring them closer to the inside of the boat, and you will have a little more oar shaft on the outboard end. Should work though.

    Take care,

    -Mike
    LOST CREEK COMPANY: Specializing in Alaska hunt consultation and planning for do-it-yourself hunts, fully outfitted hunts, and guided hunts.
    CLICK HERE to send me a private message.
    Web Address: http://alaskaoutdoorssupersite.com/hunt-planner/
    Mob: 1 (907) 229-4501
    "Dream big, and dare to fail." -Norman Vaughan
    "I have climbed my mountain, but I must still live my life." - Tenzig Norgay

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    Member danattherock's Avatar
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    Mike,

    Thanks man. I will be sure to take note of this and try it when I put the rig together in June. Sounds very logical now that I hear more about it. Thanks for sharing.
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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    Dan,
    I was wondering, where you got the aluminum for your frame, as in how'd you get schedule 40 aluminum with slip joints and all. I ask because I have an inflatable canoe that I want to build a rowing frame for, and I really like the way you built yours.
    -Greg

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    Default Rowing Frame W Oars


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    Quote Originally Posted by farcedude View Post
    Dan,
    I was wondering, where you got the aluminum for your frame, as in how'd you get schedule 40 aluminum with slip joints and all. I ask because I have an inflatable canoe that I want to build a rowing frame for, and I really like the way you built yours.
    -Greg

    I did not build the frame myself. Had a frame builder fabricate it to my admittingly very specific needs. They (River Boat Works) did a heck of a job, but my understanding is that they are no longer making custom frames. A bigger company was contracting them or something like that. Not sure. Either way, they were on the way out of the custom frame business. They are in Salida, Colorado so maybe you would want to touch bases with them. Their website is below. Ask for Arden. Great guy.

    http://www.riverboatworks.com/
    The two loudest sounds known to man: a gun that goes bang when it is supposed to go click and a gun that goes click when it is supposed to go bang.

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    Great post guys!


    Need les to say I have gobs of frames for my business and I have adopted a homemade version of the NRS Longhorn frame for my business. I have simplified them to be bare bones so I can re duce the size and weight. I fly my clients out on 185 and 206 aircraft so weight matters.

    I buy the NRS oar stands and pins as well as the NRS corners from Alaska Raft and Kayak and have the Aluminum pipe shipped up in 10 foot sticks and do all of the cutting and welding up here. The result is a 4 piece Bighorn looking frame that costs about 50% of the NRS price and has no single piece any longer than 40 inches. Light, tough and cost effective!

    Walt
    Northwest Alaska Back Country Rentals
    Kotzebue, Ak
    33 miles north of the Arctic Circle
    your best bet in Rafts, canoes and Camp rentals
    www.northwestalaska.com

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